Baldwin Corvette? Please Help.
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 33
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From: Cohasset MN
Baldwin Corvette? Please Help.
There is a custom bodied Corvette for sale locally. The lady who has it, says it may be a Baldwin design. I am not sure what this means...
It has flares, a rear spoiler, and cut-in round headlights (single-lense), and the hood is a stock small block style hood.
The motor is not original, the paint is not original, and the suspension has been rebuilt.
It is a 1970 t-top with a 4 speed, and add-on sidepipes.
I guess my question is; Is a custom bodied Corvette worth as much as a stock restoration vette? Because she is asking a premium price for it.
I am searching for info on Baldwin, but have only found a couple links so far. I found this picture:
The only thing the local car has in common with this picture is the side pipes and the racing stripe around the tail end... The local car has a slightly larger than normal rear spoiler and fender flares.
[Modified by wytevett, 3:28 PM 8/10/2002]
[Modified by wytevett, 3:40 PM 8/10/2002]
It has flares, a rear spoiler, and cut-in round headlights (single-lense), and the hood is a stock small block style hood.
The motor is not original, the paint is not original, and the suspension has been rebuilt.
It is a 1970 t-top with a 4 speed, and add-on sidepipes.
I guess my question is; Is a custom bodied Corvette worth as much as a stock restoration vette? Because she is asking a premium price for it.
I am searching for info on Baldwin, but have only found a couple links so far. I found this picture:
The only thing the local car has in common with this picture is the side pipes and the racing stripe around the tail end... The local car has a slightly larger than normal rear spoiler and fender flares.
[Modified by wytevett, 3:28 PM 8/10/2002]
[Modified by wytevett, 3:40 PM 8/10/2002]
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 65,492
Likes: 230
From: Orange Park Florida
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (wytevett)
You are thinking of a company known as Motion Performance.com do a search, they resold through Baldwin chebby in Long Island NY....a whole series of performance enhanced chebbys including a few vettes, natch....
well the Motion Performance center was located a block or so away from Baldwin Chebby and was owned by Joel Rosen....still is, I think....
NOW you go to his website and find the vettes you are thinking of...
and match the details very closely to pix of your car....
NOW watch for the gas cap detail...it's NLA...maybe a custom Motion cap...
ONLY Joel Rosen can get you a replacement cap, supposedly...BUT here is the klinker....Rosen wants lotsa money to authenticate your car as being a Baldwin/Motion car....
they sure enough got into it with the EPA types and such and were shut down sometine in the early 70's....from producing their own 'brand' of muscle cars with warrenty, brand new....they were just a little too large for the governemnt and Nader weenies to tolerate....
so match details, and dream on....odds are it's not a Motion car....
GENE
well the Motion Performance center was located a block or so away from Baldwin Chebby and was owned by Joel Rosen....still is, I think....
NOW you go to his website and find the vettes you are thinking of...
and match the details very closely to pix of your car....
NOW watch for the gas cap detail...it's NLA...maybe a custom Motion cap...
ONLY Joel Rosen can get you a replacement cap, supposedly...BUT here is the klinker....Rosen wants lotsa money to authenticate your car as being a Baldwin/Motion car....
they sure enough got into it with the EPA types and such and were shut down sometine in the early 70's....from producing their own 'brand' of muscle cars with warrenty, brand new....they were just a little too large for the governemnt and Nader weenies to tolerate....
so match details, and dream on....odds are it's not a Motion car....
GENE
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 33
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From: Cohasset MN
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (mrvette)
I am sure you are correct. I think if it was a real one, she would be really bragging about it. When I asked about the custom body, she wasn't sure where the work was done, and she had seen a picture with the name Baldwin on it, and compared the car...
The front end looks like this one:
Except the hood is a standard small-block hood.
Also, the local car has no vents behind the side windows, as shown in the pic.
Thanks for the tips.
The front end looks like this one:
Except the hood is a standard small-block hood.
Also, the local car has no vents behind the side windows, as shown in the pic.
Thanks for the tips.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 803
Likes: 0
From: South San Francisco CA
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (wytevett)
Instead of thinking about how much it's really worth....think about if you want to own it ....or not....based on the actual car itself. If it's a pretty cool Corvette and you like it....who cares what it is called? You can always buy a stock, factory original Covette if you want to....but does one of those make your heart skip a beat....or does this one?
[Modified by fontking1a, 4:21 PM 8/10/2002]
[Modified by fontking1a, 4:21 PM 8/10/2002]
Pro
Joined: Feb 1999
Posts: 735
Likes: 0
From: Portland, OR.
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (wytevett)
The BM body parts were available over the counter also, I believe they are still available, and somebody may have put some on it which makes it a non-BM Vette that has been modified and that detracts from the value.
Something to consider...
Something to consider...
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 2,125
Likes: 9
From: Crescent City, CA
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (wytevett)
I agree with the above. There were alot of wantabe Motion cars. Without paperwork, its a cusomized 70 vette.
Is it what you want?
I do not think the mods increase the sale price, so back to the basics that you need to look at. How much work is it going to take.
Terry
Is it what you want?
I do not think the mods increase the sale price, so back to the basics that you need to look at. How much work is it going to take.
Terry
Race Director
Joined: Feb 1999
Posts: 16,978
Likes: 7
From: In Dreams There Is Truth Ohio
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (wytevett)
Baldwin Motion vettes had a dash plaque with a serial number. If it's a true Baldwin Motion, it's worth major $$$$$$$$, but it has to be authenticated.....only one way to do that, and that is to shell out 1K to Mr. Rosen hisself....and he will send you the paperwork it the car is the real McCoy, no paperwork if it's a wannabe....but it will cost ya one grand to find out.
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 33
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From: Cohasset MN
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (73454)
Oh yeah... It is a car that makes my heart skip a beat, but I don't want to have somebody tell me it is something it is not.
It is definately a nice car, it is more like a show car though. I would want to drive it, but at the price she is asking, I don't think I would have the guts to take it on the road. Our '73 was hit by moron's 3 times in the fist two years we got it roadworthy. :rolleyes:
I have been to quite a few car shows, and I have been around the country a few times, and I don't recall seeing a Corvette with these body mods, so I thought I would check it out with you guys.
Thanks again everyone!
:cheers:
It is definately a nice car, it is more like a show car though. I would want to drive it, but at the price she is asking, I don't think I would have the guts to take it on the road. Our '73 was hit by moron's 3 times in the fist two years we got it roadworthy. :rolleyes:
I have been to quite a few car shows, and I have been around the country a few times, and I don't recall seeing a Corvette with these body mods, so I thought I would check it out with you guys.
Thanks again everyone!
:cheers:
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Drifting
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,987
Likes: 3
From: Manchester, Dead Center in the Middle of TN 25 miles to Jack Daniels,10 miles to Geo Dickle, and .8 mile from the Liquor Store at I-24 Exit 114
St. Jude Donor '05
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (71coupe)
Contact BamaVettes and let him tell you what he knows about reserching a tittle, He might let you in on a little secret on how to tell if it is or not. JIM
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 6,273
Likes: 14
From: Austin TX
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (PROSOUTH)
After watching Vette pricing for about 20 years, my observation is that custom Vettes decrease the value of a factory original UNLESS the car has a documented pedigree (such as a Callaway or Greenwood or Baldwin Motion or ASC Duntov) or it just happens to be EXACTLY what the one in a zillion buyer wants.
Otherwise, the price will be discounted because the buyer doesn't really know what he is buying and probably doesn't know how to tune or maintain it.
IHMO, older Vettes are hobby vehicles, not investments. Money spent on mods is hobby money and is no different than money spent on dining out or a movie. The payback for mods is performance or a "Nice Car" comment once in a while.....
[Modified by flynhi, 8:04 PM 8/10/2002]
Otherwise, the price will be discounted because the buyer doesn't really know what he is buying and probably doesn't know how to tune or maintain it.
IHMO, older Vettes are hobby vehicles, not investments. Money spent on mods is hobby money and is no different than money spent on dining out or a movie. The payback for mods is performance or a "Nice Car" comment once in a while.....
[Modified by flynhi, 8:04 PM 8/10/2002]
Safety Car
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 3,556
Likes: 0
From: Seattle WA
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (flynhi)
custom vettes are always more "inexpensive" than a original or restored vette. more people like stock. the people who will pay more for a custom vette are people who get bored with stock. people who like upgraded suspensions, expensive custom paint, and bigger wheels etc. how much is she asking for the vette? if its over $20,000 and not originally a motion vette give her the finger and walk off the lot, unless you think its worth the price. thats what it all comes down to. is this car worth $xx,xxx.95 to you? or would you rather buy a wreck with no frame damage and spend a few bucks to make it look how you want it to?
[Modified by '79ProwlerOrange, 7:46 PM 8/10/2002]
[Modified by '79ProwlerOrange, 7:46 PM 8/10/2002]
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 33
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From: Cohasset MN
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. ('79ProwlerOrange)
The lady seems nice when I talked to her on the phone so I didn't want to insult her. I just told her the price was out of my league(it is!:) )
She wants $17,500 for it. Personally, if I had a car like that, I would not try to fetch such a premium for it when I didn't have any documentation to back it up. Basically, I asked who did the body work, and she said she bought it that way, but had it painted, new suspension installed, and her son-in-law rebuilt an LT1 engine for it. She said when she bought it, it had a truck engine in it. So, it is no where near original, but it is a FINE looking car.
It is pretty much what I want in a shark, but 79ProwlerOrange is right. I think I should build the one I have into the street rod that I want. I am part way there, I got the VB suspension halfway installed!
She wants $17,500 for it. Personally, if I had a car like that, I would not try to fetch such a premium for it when I didn't have any documentation to back it up. Basically, I asked who did the body work, and she said she bought it that way, but had it painted, new suspension installed, and her son-in-law rebuilt an LT1 engine for it. She said when she bought it, it had a truck engine in it. So, it is no where near original, but it is a FINE looking car.
It is pretty much what I want in a shark, but 79ProwlerOrange is right. I think I should build the one I have into the street rod that I want. I am part way there, I got the VB suspension halfway installed!
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 7,865
Likes: 9
From: PA
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (wytevett)
WOW! That is way orverpriced....even if the car is show worthy and built well. With a non original motor and all those body modifications, she is not even close to what that car is really worth.
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 33
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From: Cohasset MN
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (Brett K)
She said she had it appraised 7 years ago and it was valued at 12,500.
Since then, she added new paint, suspension, engine, and a stereo.
She mentioned something about a priceguide, and said the high value on it would be $32,000, low would be 14,000 or so. I think I better find out what "book" that is and maybe sell mine! :)
Anyway, she said she is going to list it in auto shopper, and possibly list it on EBAY. Maybe she will call me back if she does not sell it there!
Since then, she added new paint, suspension, engine, and a stereo.
She mentioned something about a priceguide, and said the high value on it would be $32,000, low would be 14,000 or so. I think I better find out what "book" that is and maybe sell mine! :)
Anyway, she said she is going to list it in auto shopper, and possibly list it on EBAY. Maybe she will call me back if she does not sell it there!
Drifting
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,620
Likes: 7
From: Orlando Florida
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (GDaina)
Man if I ever found one and purchased it because I loved it, as I do all C3's (more than my girlfriend most of the time) a Baldwin find would be a dream come true. I know paying 1k to get it authenticated would be no big deal. I wonder if there is some cars left that have not been rediscovered? Back to reality, they are killer cars. :cheers:
Safety Car
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 3,569
Likes: 1
From: Hawaii
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (wytevett)
When I bought my 69 vert, the owner was trying to sell it as a Baldwin Motion Vette. I didn't think it was, but, the car was my dream car and it was worth what he was asking to me. It was the right color, had the Baldwin Motion stripe, a 502ci/502hp crate engine, richmond 5 speed tran, soft and hard top, 3.70 rear end. For me to build this car would have costed me a lot of money and even though it was a little bit customized, it was definately what I have wanted for a very long time. Like what was said earlier, if it makes you heart pound, go for it.
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 65,492
Likes: 230
From: Orange Park Florida
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (Maurice)
As with any car, if someone wants a rusty original, fine with me,,,..have fun...
ME, I"ll take a good hotrod anyday over that, and be willing to pay more...for work done properly, and if the buyer can't tell if something is right or not...get hell out of the field, you in over your head....or get help from someone more knowledgeable....
GENE :D :D :D
ME, I"ll take a good hotrod anyday over that, and be willing to pay more...for work done properly, and if the buyer can't tell if something is right or not...get hell out of the field, you in over your head....or get help from someone more knowledgeable....
GENE :D :D :D
Racer
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 253
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From: Berlin,NJ,USA
Re: Baldwin Corvette? Please Help. (mrvette)
You said she thought it had a truck engine in it. If you decide to buy it I would make sure that old engine came with it. Some people see a letter T in the block number and think that it stands for truck. If it is a Baldwin car it is worth much more especially with the original engine.
