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Hi Ron, I know there are better transmissions out there....... but for the $$$$ the World Class T5 trans from the camaros and firebirds have worked great for me for years.
Did 2 vettes with them and no problems. Not a direct out of the box bolt in, required just a few minor mods for installation but nothing major. Shorten driveshaft, rear mount, and shifter location.
Plenty of threads and pics here on the forum showing all of these.
Use your current bell housing, fork, speedo cable and clutch linkage and modify your current rear mount. If you want to keep it stock looking attach the vette stick to a T5 shifter.
My T5WC has manuel tach (one ear only for WC and manuel tach out), so I also bought a Speedometer and Tachometer Cable Adapter X2521
I also replaced the flywheel, to a SFI 23 lbs flywheel. NICE upgrade.....
My m21 had 10 splines shaft, the T5WC has 26 splines, so I bought a new Clutch Friction Disc, and used the rest of the clutch, since it was almost new.
My 69 is a manuel 4 speed from the factory, so the crossmember is welded on the frame.
Should I do the same today, with a welded crossmember, then I would take the engine out, that would be the fasted, and easiest way, as I see it. I ended up doing that.
But I can tell you, with my 3.70 rear from the factory (L46 factory car) and now with 0.63 in 5th gear it is soooooooooo nice. (m20/21 has 1:1 in 4th gear, so it's huge drop in RPM)
And also not to forget, the fast 2.95 ratio in 1th gear, compared to the 2.20 in 1th gear in my m21 makes it a very nice upgrade.
3:70 is a great street gear....After a few miles on an expressway,it gets old.......This is something I would consider down the line...
Which 5 speed trannies would match up to my car?
73 Vette 350 4 speed.....I imagine the transmission is the original....It came with 3:36 but they blew up one day...
I love 3.70 (or even 4.11) but I would say, with a 3.70 you can make it with a M20/21 with 1:1 in 4th gear. But above 3.70 then I would need a 5 speed.
You can go many different ways, depending on what you would like to have.
If you go for 3.08/3.36 rear, then maybe the T5WC that is for sale in parts for $500 would be the way for you.
It has a nice 1th gear(for a 3.08/3.36 rear), and 0.72 in 5th.
Or you can go for 3.70/4.11 and find a transmission like my T5WC with 0.63 in 5th.
Hi Ron, I know there are better transmissions out there....... but for the $$$$ the World Class T5 trans from the camaros and firebirds have worked great for me for years.
Did 2 vettes with them and no problems. Not a direct out of the box bolt in, required just a few minor mods for installation but nothing major. Shorten driveshaft, rear mount, and shifter location.
Plenty of threads and pics here on the forum showing all of these.
Use your current bell housing, fork, speedo cable and clutch linkage and modify your current rear mount. If you want to keep it stock looking attach the vette stick to a T5 shifter.
Hi Guys!
I definitely want a 5 speed as well but there is no way I am going to pay the $4-5K for the what the conversion kit vendors want.
I have been eyeing the GM WCT5 boxes for a while but need to know more about the exact year and model tranny from which GM cars and trucks will work and the different ratios that would be best? Maybe not specific part numbers but the car models to shoot for? I have a 4 speed with 3.70 gears presently...OEM.
Seems that the WCT5's came from the V6 F body cars? Should I buy a remanufactured one or a used one and then have it rebuilt by my expert builder near me...he could beef it up substantially, if necessary. My 355 L-82 with AFR heads and roller cam makes 425+ Gross HP but I am still using the OEM Doug Nash Super T-10.
Sounds like pulling the motor again for the install is best? I do have a 26 spline RAM HDX clutch with the rebuilt/upgraded motor now. I do not abuse the drivetrain now and roll into the throttle always...no clutch drops ever!
Besides the shortened driveshaft, what is involved with using the OEM shifter?, cutting of the tunnel (hopefully not)?, and hooking up the shifter rods with the GM WCT5.
Sorry lots of questions here, but the WCT5 conversion seems the best way to go for most of us since the conversion kits are way out of line. I can probably source a used GM WCT5 from another friend in the salvage car business for <$200. If my other friend rebuilt the used boxes and beefed it up, I would have a stronger than new WCT5 for <$1K. Estimates for the total conversion with me doing all the work?
I have been eyeing the GM WCT5 boxes for a while but need to know more about the exact year and model tranny from which GM cars and trucks will work and the different ratios that would be best? Maybe not specific part numbers but the car models to shoot for? I have a 4 speed with 3.70 gears presently...OEM.
You will want a "U" code T5 as they have a 1st gear that is best for a V8 torque. You might be able to get by with one of the V6 WC units if you have a 3.08 rear gear.
There is a tag on the side of the trans that says what the specific model number it is. I also have a -176 as it uses a classic manual cable for the speedo. Found in 1987-88 F bodies.
There are two common methods to installing these. Because of the 17 degree angle of the rear mounting pad you have to either make a custom tailshaft bracket or cut the pad off strait with a Sawsall and use wedge/beveled washers to account for the bolt hole angle.
There is also a rare 1983-only Camaro bellhousing that does not have the provision for a slave cylinder so can be used with your existing Z bar.
As posted above the T5 uses a 26 spline input shaft so if installing in a 68-73 then need a new clutch disk. Later C3's already use a 26.
When using an F body unit the shifter length is about right but it will be centered in the console so you have to either buy an offset shifter assembly for a mustang ($) or fab an adapter to move the shifter a couple inches towards the driver.
There are several older threads on these topics with pics and measurements so make sure to search. That's what I did to research my install. I found my trans locally on CL.
Last edited by Dynra Rockets; 12-13-2017 at 08:27 AM.
This might be helpful from the F Body forums: Direct Copy guys
Lets see if we can come up with a definitive list of everything known about the T5. I'll try to keep it neat, but I'm just going to list things as they come to me right now.
GM used the Borg Warner T5 5-speed overdrive transmission in thirdgens starting in late 1983. It replaced the Muncie Super-T10 4-speed.
1983 to 1987 was the first design, rated at about 280 ft/lbs of torque. 1988 to 1992 was the second design, also called the World Class T5. It featured revised synchros and Timkin bearings, and was rated around 300 ft/lbs of torque. T5 transmissions were used only behind V6's and 305 V8's. The TPI 350 V8 put out more torque than the T5 was rated for, so GM did not offer that combination to the public. (Any replies about comparisons to Corvettes, or emissions reasons, etc, will be deleted)
The T5 offered in V6 engines has a different bellhousing to match the V6, as well as a 10 spline input shaft, compared to the V8's 27 spline input shaft. The V6 T5 also has different gear ratios. The V8 T5 usually has a 2.95 first gear, although I have heard rumors of a 2.75 first gear. 5th gear is .63 in the cars with 3.08 rear ends, and .75 in the cars with 3.42/3.45 rear ends. I have also heard of a .83 5th gear in the 1LE cars.
For 3.42/3.45 rear ends, you need a 7 tooth drive gear and a 19 tooth driven gear to make the speedo accurate.
For 3.70/3.73 rear ends, you need a 7 tooth drive gear and a 21 tooth driven gear.
For 3.08 rear ends, you need a 9 tooth drive gear and a 23 tooth driven gear.
The 83-87 T5's recommend gear oil for fluid, while the 88-92 T5's recommend ATF.
Mustang V8 T5's are different externally, with a 10 spline input shaft and a straight up bellhousing, while the F-body V8 T5 is a 27 spline input and slanted to the right about the 2 o'clock position. They are not compatible with each other externally, but the gears inside are the same. The speedo gears are different as well.
Correction on the input spline counts. V6-14 splines, V8-26 splines. Also, here's a really good ratio chart that was posted on the site quite some time ago. Figured it'd make a great addition to this sticky. Quote [Saw several questions regarding T-5 info so I gathered up some information that some might find useful and figured it would be nice to have all this information in one location rather then searching thread after thread.]
I definitely want a 5 speed as well but there is no way I am going to pay the $4-5K for the what the conversion kit vendors want.
I have been eyeing the GM WCT5 boxes for a while but need to know more about the exact year and model tranny from which GM cars and trucks will work and the different ratios that would be best? Maybe not specific part numbers but the car models to shoot for? I have a 4 speed with 3.70 gears presently...OEM.
Seems that the WCT5's came from the V6 F body cars? Should I buy a remanufactured one or a used one and then have it rebuilt by my expert builder near me...he could beef it up substantially, if necessary. My 355 L-82 with AFR heads and roller cam makes 425+ Gross HP but I am still using the OEM Doug Nash Super T-10.
Sounds like pulling the motor again for the install is best? I do have a 26 spline RAM HDX clutch with the rebuilt/upgraded motor now. I do not abuse the drivetrain now and roll into the throttle always...no clutch drops ever!
Besides the shortened driveshaft, what is involved with using the OEM shifter?, cutting of the tunnel (hopefully not)?, and hooking up the shifter rods with the GM WCT5.
Sorry lots of questions here, but the WCT5 conversion seems the best way to go for most of us since the conversion kits are way out of line. I can probably source a used GM WCT5 from another friend in the salvage car business for <$200. If my other friend rebuilt the used boxes and beefed it up, I would have a stronger than new WCT5 for <$1K. Estimates for the total conversion with me doing all the work?
Thanks for your input.
I used T5's from late 80's camaros and firebirds with V8 motors. Perhaps 1990 even. They still had the screw in speedo cable. Both behind big blocks. Shifter is no problem, no rods outside, all internal. If you dont mind the stick not coming through the stock gate you can mount it as is. Heres what I did for the shifter, it was from a ford t5. You can see it has to be brought over to the left. The hurst stick has been changed to the dummy corvette stick.
Heres my modification to the rear mount. You can see where the rubber pad bolts to is now tilted, so the trans is straight up and down in the tunnel.
Quote: I do not abuse the drivetrain now and roll into the throttle always...no clutch drops ever!
Then you should get many years service from a WC T5.
UTSo you made an offset mounting pad for the shifter stick so that it moved it to the left a bit? And that is a side view of the shifter not a straight from the back or the front? I knew I needed to buy another welder. Man it sucks to have to buy tools.
Last edited by derekderek; 12-10-2017 at 11:28 AM.
12-08-2017, 09:03 AM
Low budget 5 Speed upgrade?
