es

I'm shopping for a "medium project" C3 due to my budget so I have looked at lots of higher mileage and not perfectly cared for cars. One thing I've seen alot is gaps that are very wide between the front fender and the top of the door tapering to normal going toward the bottom. The gap at the back of the door is even and the door seems to work OK. Sometimes this is on only 1 side of the car, other times it appears on both sides. Makes the car look "bent" in the middle. What is the cause and is it easily fixed or should I stay away from the car?

Thank you in advance for your input.


[Modified by es, 4:37 PM 10/23/2002]

James

I'm sure people will correct me if I'm wrong but this is what I think the answer is.
These cars were assembled by 2 different people as they went down the assembly line. One guy did all of the panel work on the passenger side and one guy did all of the panel work on the drivers side. What one guy thought was a good door gap another guy thought was a bad door gap.
Since they were all hand assembled you get different tolerances.
My car is the same way. Drivers side gap is bigger.

Mack

The fit and finish of these cars is not what it could have been. You can adjust the doors. It may or may not indicate a frame problem, but 99% of the time it's just fit, not the frame.

es

The cars that I've looked at that had this problem sure seemed to be more than bad panel fit. The gap at the top was close to 1/2" and at the bottom was less than 1/8". The odd things are that; 1) the margins along the bottom of the door and up the back edge of the door are even and normal (just the front edge of the door is out of line) and 2) I have seen this on several cars. It looks like the car was lifted up by the area under the front of the door and got bent.

Could this separation be the result of rust in the windshield posts or door pillars? Could the car be weak in this area?

NHvette

My 75 was like that since I bought it. In my case, I think it was due to the
underlying body frame rot. Mine wasn't as big as 1/2", but it was noticable
and only at the top of the door front. If a rotted birdcage is suspected, then
you should be able to see evidence by looking under the dash with a
flashlight. Look in the upper corner for rust through. See my website for examples like this: http://webpages.charter.net/davekimt...river_dash.JPG

Body panel alignment wasn't the greatest back then, but the factory would
never let something like 1/2" out the door.

Good luck shopping
:seeya


[Modified by Daves_rusty_75, 10:23 PM 10/23/2002]

CorvetteAnswerMan

Many, many years ago, my local club visited a plant in Indiana that actually made the C3 body panels. While we were there, we got to see a video that was supposed to be shown to the assembly line workers on how to align the Corvette's doors. At one point, they showed a worker BEATING on the lower part of a door to get "proper" alignment! He was whacking away at it with a rubber mallet! This bit of trivia may not help with your problem, but it sure does explain WHY C3 door alignment has never been an exact science and inconsistant gaps are the norm with these cars. Things have certainly changed!

paintdaddy

Look at the gap at the back edge of the door first to see if they are even.If they are and the front edges are close on one side and not the other ,it has probably been wrecked .This basically means that the door openings are not equal.A better way to do this would be to measure each side from 1/4 panel to fender ,they should be the same. :yesnod: :seeya

fontking1a

Corvettes are essentially custom made cars. The body panels aren't stamped out, they are "hand made" by people, craftsmen if you will and people aren't perfect. People aren't machines and you will find some variance in the parts people make. My personal opinion is that Corvettes are meant to be driven and enjoyed and not made to be picked at or worried about. They are only cars and cars are mean't to drive. If it's so important to have a perfect car, by a Honda. It's made by robots and each car and each part is identical. If having a perfect Corvette is really that important...and I'll never know what it would be...then go ahead and spend some time and money to correct the little flaws you find. One thing to remember....once you go down that "road of perfection"....you never get to your destination because there is ALWAYS something more to fix. You can be one of those guys who takes the whole car apart, spends money up the wazoo in parts and labor and then puts the whole car back together only to find that he missed a couple of things and is disappointed that his perfect car still really isn't perfect. My suggestion would be to enjoy the fact that you own a Corvette and to enjoy driving a car which was designed and built to be driven. But....hey...that's just my opinion.

es

I think you may have misunderstood the intentions of my question.
I'm far from a perfectionist. My current 'Vette is a 1988 vert that I bought with 130,000 miles on it. It was mechanically sound and had been decently cared for but it was still an old car that had spent its life as a daily driver, outside in the Florida weather. I spent 2 years working on various exterior and interior cosmetic items and minor systems (brakes, steering, etc.). What I have now is a thoroughly enjoyable driver that everyone says "looks good for it's age and mileage". It is far from perfect but it's mine!

I now would like to find a C3 in the same basic condition and go through the process again (I'm keeping the '88 by the way). On the cars I have looked at that display the door gap problem, it is obvious that there is more than a "hand made" situation at work. I'm talking about cars with a gap at the top of the door big enough to slide your hand into while the gap at the bottom is a normal 1/8" or less. This looks like a problem to me and I'm just trying to learn if it is major or minor. I have seen it on otherwise decent looking cars but if it indicates the need for major structural work, I will pass on that one and look for a straighter example.

Thanks for everyone's help.

HEARTBEATUSA

i GOT GAP!
3/8"@ top of each door
1/8"@ bottom of each door
seems to defy gravity :confused:

Paul L

You might be interested in the factory (recommended) gaps for body junctions.
http://temp.corvetteforum.net/c3/pau...rspace_002.jpg

JB

The gaps are very, very common. My '78 had a gap there you could stick your index finger into up to the first joint. There's been some good discussion of this in the past--you might take a look in the archives.

I've been told that what most often causes it is one of three things, or a combination of them: windshield frame rust "bubbling" the upper edge of the fender up, rotting rubber body mounts causing sag, and sagging hinges.

JB

es

JB you said your '78 "had" gaps there...does this mean you got rid of the gaps or the car? If you got rid of the gaps, how did you do it?

'79ProwlerOrange

What is this "Door Gap" you speak of? :jester mine used to have it, but we adjusted the doors, and boohya! the lines are perfect. its a fairly simple fix, i wouldnt let it keep you from buying the car. oh yea, the door also no longer hits the sil plates either. :cheers:

JB

Got rid of the car and let someone else worry about it. :D

JB

LS1-Corvette00

ES,

These varying DoorGaps are quite normal I assure you. I have seen countless
hundreds of C3's and the only C3's I have ever seen with perfect door gaps
have been the one's where they filled the door edges and did the best door
alignment possible. I have seen NCRS cars with varying gaps, Frame off cars
with varying gaps.. Survivor cars with varying gaps..

Anyone that says it has a bad gap because it was wrecked, well must not
have seen hundreds of C3's in varying shades of "care" because to some
extend they all have it... End Of Story :)

Yeah it bites... But that's part of owning a C3 (among a million other quirks)

HEARTBEATUSA

WHAT HE SAAAID!!!!!!

MARKUS_P

Just remember that you can adjust gap by raising/lowering the rear body mounts of the body (underlay or substract some shims)
Maybe that´s just the amount you are searching for if you have reached the limit of door adjustability.
BTW I have a perfect gap on my car because I glassed the front edge of the door and cut out a new one which fits perfectly and is smaller than 1/4 ". You need that amount of gap to open the door without damaging it in the upper section, because it´s getting very tight up there when you close the door.


[Modified by MARKUS_P, 12:30 AM 10/25/2002]

Tomi72

I had gap similar to what you described and I got it looking a lot better by just adjusting the door. The problem was worst at the very top where the door opening curves back. Because the front of the door is slightly wedge shaped, adjusting the door up will make the front lower side gap bigger and the upper smaller. Then you just need to find the sweet spot where the rear gap is ok, the body line near the door handle is ok and the waist line is not too crooked...

rgds Tomi

fontking1a

Please don't misunderstand. I'm not saying we should drive Corvettes that look like crap. God knows I've spent a zillion hours on mine making it look as good as possible. I'm just saying that "perfect" and "Corvette" are two words that aren't usually used in the same phrase. Once your door is adjusted as good as possible, you can even the gap by taking a straight file and filing down the door edges that are "too close". That's what I had to do on mine. The gaps look fairly even, but they are nothing like a Lexus or Honda. It's also possible to add fiberglass to a door edge if the gap is way too wide. My gaps are somewhere around .2 or .25 inches and if you look at the car, they don't look bad. If you really, really look at the gaps, then of course you can spot some inconsistencies. But, hey....that's a Corvette for you. Not perfect, but still one helluva car! And, for those of us driving big blocks....there's nothing more fun than standing on it in second gear while traveling at 40-50 mph and feeling that oomph kick in until you shift into third gear at 110 and do the same thing all over again. So...you said something about.....irregular gaps......?