I have a 71 small block. Not the original engine, although I have it somewhere. I have an edlebrock 4bl carb on it now. If the car sits for any length of time it’s a bear to start. Lately I can only drive it for short distances before it starts stalling. As soon as I push the clutch in for a stop sign she stalls. Sometimes I tow it home or it will start later on, but it will never start right away after a stall. I have owned her for 10yrs. I do regular maintenance and fix things that break, but I have never worked on the carb or overhauled anything preventively.

I have a friend that owns and classic car restoration business. He wants me to fuel inject it and do away with the carb, points, and dist. He thinks the mechanical fuel pump combined with old fuel lines is not helping the cause. He also said the carb should be rebuilt. Removing all the old technology for something more modern and dependable is a great idea and will make the car very dependable.

I trust him, but wanted to see what the pros here think. Would the injection fix my fuel delivery/stall/start issues? It’s not a cheap endeavor and I don’t want to spend the money to have the same problem persist. I enjoy driving the car. I enjoy taking my kids for rides and they love taking them. I am not interested in having a period correct car, just a solid, dependable driver. I truly appreciate any insight. Thank you.

 

Well, there are millions of carburated cars out there, running reliably every day.
Certainly nothing wrong with the period technology. But it needs to be maintaned once in a while just like any other system. If $$$ is any matter to you at all, correct/rebuild the system you have for hundreds not thousands. They are very simple to work on.
Cheers, Greg

 

this is part of the argument I am having with myself.

 

So, a friend who is in the classic car restoration business says to dump the old technology and replace it all with new technology. Let us know where this expert is so we can never go there.
Why not just trade it in and get a new car?

I think what you really need to do is to take it to a good mechanic that knows older technology and see what is wrong with your car.
Stalling might be something as simple as fuel starvation, whether from fuel lines or carb that is in need of a rebuild.

 

EFI gonna cost you thousands of $$$. Which Edelbrock carb? Brand new performer series carbs are fairly cheap. This reads like you are not interested in repairing/maintaining the carb yourself. Have you searched for carburetor specialists in your area? How bout your local corvette club for referrals?

 

I agree with this. Make sure there are no vacuum leaks anywhere either. If you have a good carb and no vacuum leaks, your engine will run fine. I say that even though I am a big fan of EFI, so if you will be happy with a carbureted engine that runs well, just fix what you have.

 

Following your friend's advice, you will have created a "one-of-a-kind" car, for which every mechanic you take it to will scratch his head in wonderment as to what possibly could be going wrong.

I already have one of those cars. I expect to pass it on to my son but I've struggled with the thought of writing a service manual detailing all the changes, especially to the wiring. I have kept copious notebooks and photos.

For those of us on this forum I would be curious who has thought to document ALL the changes they've made and put it ALL together in ONE reference document. Right now I have all the supplier documentation together in notebooks and with some supplemental notes of mine, it wouldn't be too bad..

 

Sounds like heat soak or ethanol in the fuel or both. Which Eddie carbs are very susceptible to. Before spending a lot of money put a heat insulator plate under the carb and empty gas tank and get some NON ethanol fuel and see what happens. Also of course make sure A/F ratio is correct and no vacuum leaks. Good Luck. You may be surprised.

 

I think most of his recommendation was based on my desire to make the car dependable and somewhat maintenance free. Sadly I don’t know how to rebuild the carb or start chasing vacuum leaks in a time efficient manner. I am sure I can get there, but I also want to use the car. I can say without hesitation there is a fuel issue. I don’t believe it’s an ethanol problem. My guess would be heat soak combined with inadequate fuel delivery. I am sure the carb should be cleaned as well. I don’t have ethanol free gas near me. I am vigilant about treating the gas that goes in there and how long it stays in there.

In all fairness he suggested electronic ignition and some more cost friendly approaches. Once we began discussing injecting it, I became enamored. I guess I am getting confused now and just looking for some options and insight. He’s the only shop in my area and I kinda trust him. He’s not pushing anything on me. He explains everything, but I get confused sometimes. I really don’t want to blow 4K on something that won’t fix my problems.

This car will stay in the family. My son will get it one day just like I got it from my dad. We love the look, sound, and ride of the C3. I have been debating getting a C7 to compliment it, but I will never shed the C3.

 

Tune up, plugs, points, condenser, cap, rotor, spark plugs, spark plug wires, air filter, fuel filter and carburetor rebuild. Fuel pump and fuel tank sock if needed.
You will be ahead thousands of dollars and have a dependable car.

 

Fix what you have and enjoy the learning experience doing it. There are lots of youtube videos explaining how to take an edelbrock carb apart, clean it then reassemble. Learn a little watching those before you dive in.
Carbs are fairly easy to work on and tune, you just have to study some to learn how they work.

 

replace fuel pump and repair the carb and adjust- replace springs and vacuum can in the distributor. About a thousand less than efi before any labor...

 

Check the timing first!

If the carb can pass enough gas (no pun intended) to drive down the street, why would it be at fault at a stop light?

Before you spend a bunch of money, email @lars on this Forum, get a copy of his timing papers, and follow them to the letter. Your mechanic may learn something, too. If this has already been done, great! It may be as simple as moving the vacuum advance can from ported to manifold vacuum. That can make a huge difference on these cars, despite being "wrong".

All in (mechanical) at 3000 rpm at 36 degrees advanced, manifold vacuum to the vacuum can. Give it a try!

 

You don’t know what’s wrong with the engine so it is impossible to know if what you are proposing is going to fix it. Throwing $4K at the problem without any semblance of a diagnosis is just stupid. Get the car running properly first and if you still want fuel injection, do it then.

 

I had the same issues with my car and heres what I went through fixing it.

1. When was the last tune up?
2. When did you put the carb on it compared to the stalling problem?
3. What kind of choke do you have connected to it?
4. what is you idle speed at cold start vs when it starts to stall

Some of your problems could be easy as a vacuum leak, just needing to turn up your idle speed at the throttle lever, or a bad fuel pump. Carter pumps suck adn break easily which can strand you. Your idle set screws could be not set correctly. Your timing could be too low. Can you post pic of the intake and carb. It could be a spreadbore intake with a square bore carb, big vacuum leak right there without the proper flange plate.

I would start with your latest tune up. Has it ever been done? Make sure the points are set correctly and your cap and rotor are looking good. I got rid of my points and went with a pointless system. Lot of them for sale. I believe mine was from Lectric limited....Went to MSD eventually....
Then check the timing and set it around 14 btdc. Set it with the vacuum advance hose disconnected and plugged at the carb then reattach and reset idle speed. Then set your warm engine idle RPM at about 750 rpm. Then check your idle speed screws counting how many full turns they go in until they stop. Dont crankk them down, just let them bottom out under very little pressure. Then turn them back out so they are even. You should have them both the same and if you have a vacuum gauge it should be set to the highest vacuum at idle. If you dont have a gauge, turn them out until the rpm is at its highest. then rest the idle and do the other side to match.

If all that doesnt solve your stalling problem then you need to start looking at vacuum leaks, fuel pressure and engine temperature relative to the carb.

If your car starts and idles fine and runs great before it gets too hot then it could be fuel boiling. You will either need an aluminum heat shield or a phenolic/ wood spacer. This will push the carb closer to the hood so you may need a drop base air cleaner base. If it still starts rough or has stumbling issues and is running really rich then you should look at your fuel pressure. Edelbrock, Carter and Qaudrajet carbs like a lower fuel pressure. To high and it can push past the floats/ needles and seats and cause a rich, stumbling or fouling condition. If your get a lot of black soot out the tail pipe this could be an issue. If its too low it can stumble as it tries to refill after a good drive as you come up to a light or falls flat at higher rpm and stumble as it tried to get more gas. Install a fuel pressure gauge or use one as a tool will help you a lot in trouble shooting

I currently have an L88 hood scoop so I can fit a 1 inch wood spacer and still have plenty of room. Most people just need an alumiinum shield or a 1/4 inch spacer.

Keep us updated and let us know whats up. Remeeber shops only make money as long as youhave them work on your car. So of course some want to upgrade parts and keep you coming back. EFI is great but you may need alot of money to get there

1. new intake that will work well with EFI
2. the EFI system itself
3. electric fuel pump
4. fuel pressure gauges
5. fuel pressure regulator
6. new tank, pickup and sender
7. paying for the install $$$$$

Im looking at EFI just for the cross country benefits of not having to change the jetting at different altitudes as I will be going from sea level to 8000 feet on my visits. Around here I dont need it. I have an Edelbrock quadrajet that I modded wth the help of the Cliff Ruggles book and its very impressive. Dont throw moneyat your car, just try adn figure out what it needs and you both will be happy

 

Were me, only bit of modern i would do is replace the mechanical points and truth is there reliable if you dont mind messing with them. I suspect aftermarket fuel injection both costly to do up front and can still fail down the road. Besides fuel injection like a teenage lover, ok but overated.

 

i repaired a set of points with duct tape once. they went away from points because as the rubbing block wears, the timing changes. as timing changes, the emissions get worse. EPA didn't like that. then, as they wear more, the spark gets weaker. i knew people that junked their cars cuz the points needed gapped. we don't do 1000 miles a year on these cars for the most part. your points ignition will serve you well and inexpensively for a long time.

 

Here is my plan,
When it stalls out... remove air cleaner and pour 3-4 ounces of gas down carb try to restart if it starts then stops it is fuel related..... if it fails to start its electrical
Now.... find another good mechanic and explain what you found
If it was electrical he should start with a full tuneup
If its fuel related he will look into the carb.... fuel pump and lines
Either way it will be MUCH cheaper then going to efi
Let us know what you find

 

Are you sure that engine stashed in the corner isn't an LT-1? If it is, you will potentially be losing a lot of value in the car by doing a bunch of conversions. And, if it is, do not let it get separated from the car!

Anyone who recommends changes like thisis not a restoration shop. Restoration means to put it back to original, not change it out to anything else. Sounds like more of a speed shop to me. Replacing fuel pump & lines, rebuilding carb and distributor is apples and oranges to the modifications you are thinking about. The problem with today's "mechanics" is that they were not schooled in mechanics; their education centered on electronics. The mechanical systems on these cars work very well, are very dependable, and can usually be rebuilt when necessary. The big difference is that instead of reading a trouble-code set by a computer, the mechanic needs to troubleshoot the symptoms presenting and use experience to diagnose.

Lastly, you mentioned not being interested in originality and that it'll stay in your family. Be very aware that the value of these cars is based on originality - someday it will be sold.

<stepping down from my soapbox now>

 

i believe the fuel pump is not the issue. if it didn't pump enough fuel, it would quit running then and there. clutch in or foot on gas or not. when pump doesn't provide fuel, the heavier the load, the sooner it quits. ignition is much the same. an engine will run with a very light load with weak spark, but step on it and it will sputter and quit. you have carb issues. many of us are not real fond of the Carter AFB you know of as an Edelbrock. they work. reasonably well. i am a Holley guy. most everybody else here drinks the q-jet kool aid. but that Eddy is a simple sturdy carb. get your buddy to rebuild it or put a brand new one on there. OR-my turn on the soap box... FIX THE DAMN THING!!! every job you pay somebody to do costs more than the tools and parts. and when you are done you still have the tools. and you have the ability you just got off this forum and youtube to deal with the issue. here is a quickie version. there are much more detailed ones plus tuning the fuel metering rod videos. but get it running well enough to shut it off and restart it before you try to become the Lars of AFB's...