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Seems all the dampers inside the valve springs decided to self destruct for some reason. Pulled these 3 springs with a spring compressor and air in cylinder. Most of the rest are broken also. Rockers looked fine.
these are some dart iron eagle 180 heads. They have about 5000 miles on them. Running a Howard’s hyd roller .510 lift. Springs were on the heads when I purchased them. Any idea why this happened. Maybe Chinese junk.
ordering a new Howard’s spring kit.
of course an oil change too.
Last edited by speedreed8; Nov 24, 2020 at 12:54 PM.
Ouch. Do you know what your installed height was/is? Perhaps you were binding? That's not good and you're quite lucky. If you purchased the heads and just slapped these on with the existing valve springs I'd be doing some serious checking before I put that motor back into operation. Dodged a hell of a bullet there. I would follow the recommended heights and pressures to a T.
I'm guessing .510 lift was a little too much for your valve springs, which is pretty much in line with what everyone else is telling you here. I had some bad valve springs about 20 years ago, but they just broke. Nothing like the damage you've got.
You can see in the pictures that those are small diameter 1.26 diameter. Not put together very well. You need spring cups when you have larger valve pockets.
Those are probably lighter h-flat springs. You should find 1.46 diameter springs with about 130 seat pressure for up to .600 lift
Thanks everyone. I’ll be checking the installed height and checking for coil bind on reassembly.
and I’ll check into getting a bigger spring día.
the heads have a 1.5” spring pocket area.
Last edited by speedreed8; Nov 8, 2020 at 06:17 PM.
You can see in the pictures that those are small diameter 1.26 diameter. Not put together very well. You need spring cups when you have larger valve pockets.
Those are probably lighter h-flat springs. You should find 1.46 diameter springs with about 130 seat pressure for up to .600 lift
thanks for that info. Definitely look into that.
could you make a recommendation on those springs.
the springs Howard’s recommends for their hyd. Roller are 1.250 día. Do I need that locator for those?
Last edited by speedreed8; Nov 8, 2020 at 06:34 PM.
It is feasible that your retainers and locks might work. Then those springs are $50 something. The bottom side of the retainer has to match the coil size and what ever is inside the spring. I have a installed spring pressure checker. The installed height of those springs is 1.80 inches So coil bind must be 1.200 Higher rpm H-rollers need more than 130# seat. You could put in .020 shim and increase the seat pressure to say 135#. You would then be limiting the spring to a max lift of .580 Not a big deal for .510 lift cam of yours. AFR h-roller heads have 145# seat closed pressure. I've set up heads with 150# on new HR motors because springs degrade over time and use. Ideally Beehive can maintain valve control with less spring pressure and I would recommend them for high end builds. They do cost considerably more
I don't see broken springs. I see broken dampeners.
And that's really not a radical lift cam at .510 and the rockers are stock ratio.
So,
Two things that might have destroyed the dampeners: They might have hung-up on the valve guides, being too small of a diameter?
Or the retainer itself was not designed to support a dampener. Retainers have ledges for each to ride on, so to speak.
That spring retainer might have been designed for dual springs, which you do not have.
Hard to say what people slap on heads. I agree with gkull that with those spring pockets, go ahead a get the larger diameter springs, better retainers.
Last edited by HeadsU.P.; Nov 9, 2020 at 10:02 AM.
You are right it was the dampers inside the spring. The springs themselves all look ok. I’ll check the retainers but I’ll be buying a complete spring & retainer set. Thanks for your info. The spring pockets are quite large 1.5” for the spring I have 1.25”. The dampers also destroyed all the Press on valve seals too.
There is no question that your springs were dancing around in those large pockets. There are two kinds of spring cups: one that hold the spring on the outside and one that hold the spring on the inside. Obviously that have to fit your spring and your valve guide. So before you order your spring kit, make sure that you can get the appropriate spring cups to match. I have Comp Cam springs but had to get the cups from somewhere else to fit my head. This might take a little research. Talk to the rep from where ever you get the springs to get one with the appropriate spring pressures.
The cups also come in different thickness, so make sure that this all fits your spec install spring height.
I talked to a tech at Howard’s cams. They set me up with a matching spring / retainer set for my cam and spring locators & seals. Hopefully it will work well. I’ll keep post updated after repairs. Thanks for everyone’s advice it was very helpful. Especially about the spring locators. 👍
Just my opinion but, I do not believe you need to max-out the spring pocket and spring diameter. That larger pocket is for springs in the 600 lift range with some really hefty steel coils. Keep in mind, the more spring pressure, the more wear & tear on the cam lobes, retainers, valve seats, lifters, etc.
Unless you plan on turning over 6,000 RPMs all day long, using the huge spring pocket is an overkill.
Just a larger spring will work. Some aluminum heads have three spring diameter pocket options. Looks like your springs are the small, one and a quarter like others have said..
Last edited by HeadsU.P.; Nov 9, 2020 at 07:49 PM.
The springs they recommended is 1.265 día. That’s why the locator for the spring pocket I assume. It has a 120 lb seat load and 350 lb open according to the specs. I hope it works well. This engine may see 5000 rpm sometimes. Thanks for everyone’s advice.
I’ll update after repairs.
Last edited by speedreed8; Nov 9, 2020 at 01:47 PM.
wow
Valve spring carnage :update w/pics.
