Power Steering help:
Drifting
Joined: May 2020
Posts: 1,661
Likes: 701
From: Baton Rouge, Louisiana, metro area
Are your hoses installed with correct routing from cylinder to control valve?
Is the steering jerking or fighting you when you make a turn?
Post detailed pictures of the hose routing.
Is the steering jerking or fighting you when you make a turn?
Post detailed pictures of the hose routing.
Advanced
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 59
Likes: 12
From: London Ontario, Canada
Control valve
This is how the steering feels. To make a 90 degree turn from stop or a slow speed, it takes both hands. You cannot do it with one. When you make a turn on the highway and go to straighten back up, you have to actually force it back straight. The wheel feels very heavy. I don't think my wife could steer the car.
Mark60
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 13,143
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From: Sunshine Coast, Queensland, Australia
2025 C3 of the Year Finalist - Modified
2024 C3 of the Year Finalist- Modified
2022 C3 of the Year Finalist - Modified
Cruise-In VIII Veteran
Well, clearly something is wrong here. The stock system, although widely criticised really does work.
A number of people still track these cars with this system in place.
So, it sounds like your not getting power assist even though you have installed all these new parts.
1. Is the pump really producing fluid under the correct pressure?
2. Is the control valve sending the pressurised fluid to the ram, in both directions?
3. is the internal seal between the two halfs of the ram blown.
4. Was the new control valve adjusted with the ram's rod unhooked from the frame to insure that not only the valve is centered, but that the ram indeed pushes and pulls?
A number of people still track these cars with this system in place.
So, it sounds like your not getting power assist even though you have installed all these new parts.
1. Is the pump really producing fluid under the correct pressure?
2. Is the control valve sending the pressurised fluid to the ram, in both directions?
3. is the internal seal between the two halfs of the ram blown.
4. Was the new control valve adjusted with the ram's rod unhooked from the frame to insure that not only the valve is centered, but that the ram indeed pushes and pulls?
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 14,282
Likes: 8,087
From: Napa Valley California
If nothing is leaking, I would look at either no pressure or the incorrect pressure from the pump.
Another issue could be as simple as the adjustment screw on the top of the steering box is screwed down too far and needs to be properly adjusted.
I would start with the adjustment screw so you don’t damage the box, then look into the pressure.
I think the OP said he purchased a “new steering box’, but I’m not sure I’ve seen any new steering boxes for C3 corvettes, rebuilt yes but not new.
I would look and make sure the steering box is new and not a badly rebuilt box.
I sent Gary my oem 73 steering box to rebuild only to find out it was not the oem box and a poorly rebuilt box from an 80.
Another issue could be as simple as the adjustment screw on the top of the steering box is screwed down too far and needs to be properly adjusted.
I would start with the adjustment screw so you don’t damage the box, then look into the pressure.
I think the OP said he purchased a “new steering box’, but I’m not sure I’ve seen any new steering boxes for C3 corvettes, rebuilt yes but not new.
I would look and make sure the steering box is new and not a badly rebuilt box.
I sent Gary my oem 73 steering box to rebuild only to find out it was not the oem box and a poorly rebuilt box from an 80.
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 11,877
Likes: 4,467
From: Virginia
Good catch! I missed the OP saying "and the steering box".
So $3500- for non guaranteed garbage components from a garage that won't stand by their work? Ouch.
Try to get a free Borgeson system from them, at least, and go drive your car! If I can figure out how to do it, any shade tree mechanic can do the same.
Merry Christmas!
So $3500- for non guaranteed garbage components from a garage that won't stand by their work? Ouch.
Try to get a free Borgeson system from them, at least, and go drive your car! If I can figure out how to do it, any shade tree mechanic can do the same.
Merry Christmas!
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 163
Likes: 1
From: Port Allen Louisiana
I jacked the car up, jack stand, and compared how the hoses are routed to the diagrams in my 1980 GM Corvette shop manual. Yes, they are correct. Don't really feel any jerking. Thanks.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 163
Likes: 1
From: Port Allen Louisiana
401KVette
Sounds to me like your power steering is not working (or assisting very little if at all).
Is it leaking or not?
If it is NOT leaking you can try to bleed the system. If it is leaking then fix the leaks first. Read the whole thread --- there are other pointers in there (like making sure the lines are criss-crossed at the control valve {CV})
Read this thread on bleeding: https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...er-assist.html
Sounds to me like your power steering is not working (or assisting very little if at all).
Is it leaking or not?
If it is NOT leaking you can try to bleed the system. If it is leaking then fix the leaks first. Read the whole thread --- there are other pointers in there (like making sure the lines are criss-crossed at the control valve {CV})
Read this thread on bleeding: https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...er-assist.html
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 163
Likes: 1
From: Port Allen Louisiana
Good catch! I missed the OP saying "and the steering box".
So $3500- for non guaranteed garbage components from a garage that won't stand by their work? Ouch.
Try to get a free Borgeson system from them, at least, and go drive your car! If I can figure out how to do it, any shade tree mechanic can do the same.
Merry Christmas!
So $3500- for non guaranteed garbage components from a garage that won't stand by their work? Ouch.
Try to get a free Borgeson system from them, at least, and go drive your car! If I can figure out how to do it, any shade tree mechanic can do the same.
Merry Christmas!
Yes Sir, I know that on a C3 it's a power assisted steering. I purchased my C3 in 2008. Up until the hose's starting leaking, the steering was good, are what I would call normal for a C3. When I thought it was just the hose's leaking it was discovered to have other leaks. The control valve and cylinder. The first parts I purchased was from Corvette Brakes, C.S.S.B. INC.. The power steering control valve, the PS steering cylinder was rebuilt parts. After that it steered ok. I drive the car very little now. A year passed and the steering was starting to fad. The PS pump was leaking, along with the PS control valve, which was changed 1 year earlier. I then purchased parts from Top Flight Automotive/Corvette America. The PS pump was a reman., the control valve was suppose to have been new, and I also changed the PS Box, which was also new. When I drove it away this time, I was not impressed with the steering, but I let it ride. As I said, I don't drive the car very much. A few months ago I took it out, and I had No steering at all. It took just about everything I had to turn the wheel. My mechanic said it had to be the pump. So I ordered a new PS pump from Corvette Central. When I picked the car up, they said the PS cylinder was now leaking. Again.. When I drove the car away the steering was a little better, but not as it should be. I then ordered a new PS cylinder from Corvette Central. After picking the car up yesterday, the new cylinder made no difference. This is how the steering feels. To make a 90 degree turn from stop or a slow speed, it takes both hands. You cannot do it with one. When you make a turn on the highway and go to straighten back up, you have to actually force it back straight. The wheel feels very heavy. I don't think my wife could steer the car. No, I have not had the alignment checked or realigned. But all seemed good before the leaks started. The $3500 I have so far spent is parts and labor. I don't know what the problem is nor my mechanic shop. They are good people. My wife and I have used them for the last 15 years. Have always had good results from them. But they are not known to work on older cars such as a C3. They agreed to do this job because we are long time customers. I don't know what is the problem and neither do they. Asking for help and suggestions.
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Race Director
Joined: Mar 2017
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From: Virginia
I removed the stock power steering from both of my cars. If you were my neighbor, I'd be happy to fix your problem. $2K,Borgeson swap, all new parts, with a guarantee. I wouldn't touch the stock system, and you've seen why. Perhaps @4-vettes can keep his stock system on the road, but he's a professional mechanic.
If you want to keep the stock system, you'll likely need your current steering box rebuilt by @GTR1999 . Perhaps you still have both? Hopefully one of them is rebuildable. He built one for me with all new parts, and that is the core of my manual swap.
I'm sorry for your predicament. But you can either continue to waste money on this system with a mechanic that can't fix stuff short of throwing parts at it, or you can refund whatever parts you can, and start from scratch with Borgeson, or manual steering.
I'll add,my wife has no problem driving my 80, with manual steering and a 4-speed. Do you have somewhere that can do an alignment?
If you want to keep the stock system, you'll likely need your current steering box rebuilt by @GTR1999 . Perhaps you still have both? Hopefully one of them is rebuildable. He built one for me with all new parts, and that is the core of my manual swap.
I'm sorry for your predicament. But you can either continue to waste money on this system with a mechanic that can't fix stuff short of throwing parts at it, or you can refund whatever parts you can, and start from scratch with Borgeson, or manual steering.
I'll add,my wife has no problem driving my 80, with manual steering and a 4-speed. Do you have somewhere that can do an alignment?
Last edited by Bikespace; Dec 26, 2023 at 03:46 PM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,274
Likes: 481
From: Salmon Arm, BC
The first thing I'm going to suggest is to review the POWER STEERING STICKY at the top of the tech page. There is a bunch of information there from Jim Shea who was an engineer (I think) for Saginaw, who made our steering boxes. He's an absolute wealth of information and pretty much the Guru of steering information on the forum.....he retired some time ago and the web page he had isn't available anymore but some of it is here on this forum in the archives.
Here is a vid about going through the balancing procedure for the steering assist, it starts at the 5:50 mark, but it's a good video to understand the system. If your somewhat handy with a wrench it's easily doable.
I'll also attach a video about the steering box.....although no a Corvette box it does provide info for general knowledge.
It does sound to me (from your description in post #19) that your steering box is not adjusted correctly, and you could be fighting a misadjusted control valve.
Here is a vid about going through the balancing procedure for the steering assist, it starts at the 5:50 mark, but it's a good video to understand the system. If your somewhat handy with a wrench it's easily doable.
I'll also attach a video about the steering box.....although no a Corvette box it does provide info for general knowledge.
It does sound to me (from your description in post #19) that your steering box is not adjusted correctly, and you could be fighting a misadjusted control valve.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,695
Likes: 270
From: New York
That is I first thought. I need the help of others here. To diagnosis it, can he just get the front two wheels off the floor or does he have to disconnect part of the steering?
I remember watching a video where the Power steering control valve was not adjusted. The steering would move over to a side. You had to balance it by removing the cap and adjusting it back and forth until the steering is centered.
Or you could call the vendor (Corvette Brakes, C.S.S.B. 352-554-5470) where the valve was purchased. They told me “You will have to center the new valve. refer to your GM service manual if you are not familiar with that procedure.” So I would ask your mechanic if he balanced the power steering control valve. If he has no idea what you are saying, he probably didn’t. He may have assumed they were balanced from the rebuilder.
I remember watching a video where the Power steering control valve was not adjusted. The steering would move over to a side. You had to balance it by removing the cap and adjusting it back and forth until the steering is centered.
Or you could call the vendor (Corvette Brakes, C.S.S.B. 352-554-5470) where the valve was purchased. They told me “You will have to center the new valve. refer to your GM service manual if you are not familiar with that procedure.” So I would ask your mechanic if he balanced the power steering control valve. If he has no idea what you are saying, he probably didn’t. He may have assumed they were balanced from the rebuilder.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 163
Likes: 1
From: Port Allen Louisiana
I concur. Find a different shop or do it yourself. This is why I do most of my work myself. BUT really--- if you're willing to pay that much money just do the Borgeson conversion.
There is nothing tough about the Power Steering -- I have had 2 leaks on mine since I installed it 32 years ago. And I caused one of those leaks myself. I was replacing the leaking hose and "twisted" the reservoir body on the pump..... ordered a replacement at autozone and slapped it on...hasn't leaked in the following 11 years. (I brought the replacement home before returning the core since I had to transfer 1 rear bolt from the old to the new--- i only mention that in case you end up replacing the pump/reservoir).
There is nothing tough about the Power Steering -- I have had 2 leaks on mine since I installed it 32 years ago. And I caused one of those leaks myself. I was replacing the leaking hose and "twisted" the reservoir body on the pump..... ordered a replacement at autozone and slapped it on...hasn't leaked in the following 11 years. (I brought the replacement home before returning the core since I had to transfer 1 rear bolt from the old to the new--- i only mention that in case you end up replacing the pump/reservoir).
Thank you.
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 13,143
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From: Sunshine Coast, Queensland, Australia
2025 C3 of the Year Finalist - Modified
2024 C3 of the Year Finalist- Modified
2022 C3 of the Year Finalist - Modified
Cruise-In VIII Veteran
Based on this question alone I would have to say you are very new to this forum. I believe there are 2 or 3 current threads on the topic. And many, many more threads from the past.
Basically it's a powersteering box that gives the car true power steering, like a more modern car.
The factory setup is power assist steering, a manual box with a assist ram. The Borgeson box is a true power box. Eliminating the manual box, the control valve on the drag link and of course the ram.
instead of 4 hoses, the Borgeson only has 2. Less places to leak.
You may wish to read a few of the many threads on this topic.
Basically it's a powersteering box that gives the car true power steering, like a more modern car.
The factory setup is power assist steering, a manual box with a assist ram. The Borgeson box is a true power box. Eliminating the manual box, the control valve on the drag link and of course the ram.
instead of 4 hoses, the Borgeson only has 2. Less places to leak.
You may wish to read a few of the many threads on this topic.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 163
Likes: 1
From: Port Allen Louisiana
Thanking everyone for their input and help. After the 1st of the year, I am going to take my 1980 back to the shop that's been doing the work, asking them to look at the information yall have been providing me to try and figure this out. Before they tell me I need to reorder another part that they may think is defective, they will need to go through the information yall have provided. Video's and all.
As everyone can probably tell, when it comes to something like this I am not mechanically able to solve this. IF in the end, I was to decide to go with a Borgeson conversion, how many hours would yall think it would take a shop to install? I've seen on Corvette Central's website the kit is around $900.00. Also, what is the difference between the Borgeson and a Rack and Pinion conversion, which is also available? Yes I know, I'm a idiot.
Again, thanking everyone for their help.
As everyone can probably tell, when it comes to something like this I am not mechanically able to solve this. IF in the end, I was to decide to go with a Borgeson conversion, how many hours would yall think it would take a shop to install? I've seen on Corvette Central's website the kit is around $900.00. Also, what is the difference between the Borgeson and a Rack and Pinion conversion, which is also available? Yes I know, I'm a idiot.
Again, thanking everyone for their help.
Last edited by 401KVette; Dec 28, 2023 at 10:40 AM.
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 14,282
Likes: 8,087
From: Napa Valley California
Its not being an idiot, its just working on a vehicle isn’t your forte.
Just do a search for rack and pinion steering conversions here in the C2 and C3 forums and you’ll be able to see the differences.
Basically you would be installing a modern steering system into your classic or modifying your oem steering system.
Just do a search for rack and pinion steering conversions here in the C2 and C3 forums and you’ll be able to see the differences.
Basically you would be installing a modern steering system into your classic or modifying your oem steering system.
Pro
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 571
Likes: 101
From: Texas
I feel for you man. I myself went through 3 Control valves, 3 power steering pumps, and 2 slave cylinders on my 1980. Not to mention 3 new busted hoses. Luckily I did the work all my self. The problem I was having was that the power steering fluid would heat up and bust my lines. I really didn't figure out 100% what was causing it but my guess is that I was buying all my items at your local auto part stores because of the warranty. On the 4th purchase of my Power steering pump, I decided to go with Tpflght OEM part that had less psi. As a precaution I decided to wrap my headers with DEI wrap and I also ordered some heat sleeves for my power steering hoses. Knock on wood, everything seems to still be working after about 6 months.
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 11,877
Likes: 4,467
From: Virginia
Here's the longest running Borgeson thread I'm aware of.
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...n-install.html
For a proper install, on a lift, perhaps 6 or 8 hours of labor? Maybe less (maybe a lot less) if you've done it before.
I had to pull my steering column to partially collapse it. YMMV.
The Borgeson solution is a replacement powered steering box. Rack and pinion works differently, and AFAIK for C3 applications, requires several U-Joints to line up. There are threads where folks have gone through this as well, and most seem pleased with that solution, too.
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...n-install.html
For a proper install, on a lift, perhaps 6 or 8 hours of labor? Maybe less (maybe a lot less) if you've done it before.
I had to pull my steering column to partially collapse it. YMMV.
The Borgeson solution is a replacement powered steering box. Rack and pinion works differently, and AFAIK for C3 applications, requires several U-Joints to line up. There are threads where folks have gone through this as well, and most seem pleased with that solution, too.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,695
Likes: 270
From: New York
Check this post on balancing the PSCV: PS Control Valve - CorvetteForum - Chevrolet Corvette Forum Discussion
