Hey guys need some helping deciding if I should gather the parts and build my BBC or just buy a crate. I built the 454 for my 71 with the help of many on this forum back in mid 2000. Some may remember me as “blackrat”.
the build for the 71 was the first complete build I did in my own and it ended up making 448 HP on the dyno.

Assembly and tuning was fun and educational. The nightmare was sourcing a good block and then finding a machine shop in the Charlotte NC that had a clue and cared about quality work. Thats a whole story for a much longer post!🤬

fast forward to now I have a 1969 convertible with an SB 4 speed. The plan is a BBC with a 5/6-speed. I’m leaning toward fuel injection this time. I ran Edelbrock aluminum heads and a custom solid flat tappet cam. This time with the kids grown and out of the house I can swing the roller.😉

A buddy has a GEN V complete motor that I can get but I know I won’t need the heads. It was running when it was pulled but not sure how many miles were on it.

So the question is do I buy my buddies motor and:
A - rebuild it using aftermarket heads?
B - clean it up, figure out what pistons are in it and just replace the cam and run aftermarket heads?

or

C - Buy a crate motor?

if C then who does everyone recommend to buy from?

Here are some pics of my buddies engine in my garage now.

 

You could send the whole thing to VortecPro (Mark Jones) in TX and let him build you a killer 496 using those 049 heads. 650+ HP is easy enough with those heads and a hyd roller. Or just see if he has one ready to ship already. Or you can go with aftermarket heads in the 700+ range....

JIM

 

EFI, aluminum heads, and a roller cam? Every junkyard GM truck engine since about 2000 has all of that, and every Corvette since 1997.

If your 69 was originally a big block car, and this lets you restore it, then that's likely the route you should take. Otherwise, consider that an LS (or LT) conversion gives you the benefit of 40+ years of engine development, is lighter and smaller than the big block, and can be serviced by any local garage mechanic with a code reader.

You can buy a new LS3 or LT1 direct from GM, or one of their resellers. Or go the junkyard LS route.

 

Not sure what your budget is. If you are looking at used motors as a build your own core I’d personally start with a Gen 6 motor. One piece rear main plus roller valve train ready. I can find big blocks all day around me for $500-$750 in running shape. Im not too far from the ocean so I have the boating community to also look for motors in also. Boat motors you have to be alittle more careful about (possible salt water).

No LS is going to hold a candle to a properly built big block. It’s not even a discussion. A decent set of oval port heads and you would be well on your way.

 

A couple things just in case your not aware. Gen V is a bit of a bastard engine. No fuel pump provision, no clutch ball hole if you run a stick, and the biggee, coolant holes in block deck won’t line up with 049 or other Mark IV heads. Require special head gaskets, no longer available or other mods so you don’t get water in the oil. None are insurmountable problems just a pain in the ***.

 

I had my block rebuilt and it didn't last. BBC 427 to a 496 with aluminum heads and roller cam.

This time I went crate and I'm happy with it. I went with a 502 but Summit has the 540 in stock.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/mll-ps5401ct

 

Thats an excellent point. I forgot about the Z-bar mount. Most of the Gen 6 blocks either have the Zbar mount already drilled or the pad is there on the block to drill and tap it. As I mentioned before some of the OE Gen 6 blocks out of trucks have the fuel pump provisions some don’t. Depends on when and where it was cast etc.

GM Aftermarket block should already have all that stuff though and almost all the marine Gen 6 blocks are that way. Part number 19170538

 

i was always a huge fan of building your own engine, however after seeing what its cost me to build my last BBCs, im leaning more toward dropping a crate engine in next time.
i wouldn't use a Gen 5 block. yes it can be done, but it just opens up too many possibilities for issues with mismatched parts.

a good roller cam swap is pushing $2k. good heads are $2k+, probably $3k or more. stroker kit probably another $2k. machine work on my last BBC was $2200, one before that was i think $2500 including pistons.

very easy to get to $8k quick, the crate motors start looking better and better

 

I rebuilt my 427 versus replacing the BB engine that came with my C3. Rebuilding a BB is not always the easiest or cheapest way to go but it can be a great experience to do it yourself or with help. I had a buddy who owned a Speed Shop help me build the engine as it was my first big block rebuild. My buddy was able to get better prices than I could and knew the local Machine shops. We built my engine in his shop so whenever it was quiet we could work on the engine. After a few months we had a beautiful 427 all decked out on display for his shop's Christmas Party.

The engine was installed by a very reputable Corvette shop and the engine compartment was detailed prior to the re-install. After it was all done I spent closer to $10k but built a L88 clone engine that makes crazy fun power. Even with a 3.36 rear with my 4 speed the car can lay down higher 10 second quarters.

 

If you want to build your own engine, then do so, and I applaud your effort. If your not so enthusiastic about the idea then I'd recommend looking at the GM Performance line of BBC's, they have quite the laundry list of choices and are one of the few I would recommend with any confidence of a successful outcome.

If the pricing seems high as compared to some other cheap offering, understand, that particularly in this market, "you get what you pay for"!

Now, how about that "572"!

Scott.

 

Thanks guys! Excellent info especially in the gen V. I knew about the x bar and fuel pump mount issue but not the head gasket.
i built my last BBC and I have done numerous cam swaps over the years. I enjoy doing it myself but like some have said the price is really about the same and also there is no warranty.

i am a BB guy so the LS. Swap is out of the question.

i have looked at Vortecpro, he has some cool combo’s. Other than summit, Jegs and Vortecpro any other suggested builders? I am in the Charlotte NC area.

thanks
Wade

 

I build my motors because its all I can afford, that and it saves thousands of dollars in labor. What is your budget, are you a builder/ mechanic or an assembler of parts. If you can afford one thats built and money is no object go that route. but go with a manifold that has direct port injection and a roller cam. Dont bother with the sniper style carbs, they arent worth it. And plan on $1000 plus to get it professionally tuned

 

I would say I am somewhere between mechanic and assembler. I grew up in the 70’s I learned the basics. Worked for Super Shops in high school. Western Auto and PepBoys as a mechanic after the military while in college. I still do my own vehicle maintenance and repair.
i definitely know how to use a mic, plasti guage and ring file.😉

my weakness is probably designing the right combo.

i can find BB’s around here but last time I built one was probably 2008. Finding a good machine shop was difficult. The block I used needed a sleeve. Not a big deal but the machinist screwed it up. He was the son of a machinist that was “The Guy” when I was growing up. I thought his son would be just as good. NOT!!
He actually used a grinder to level out the top of the sleeve. I did not notice it and when I assembled the engine and started it, the head gasket blew! I ended up taking the block back to a different machinist since I could not get a head gasket to seal. He showed me the problem and several other problems. He did a great job but has since retired.

i love assembling my own but when I look at the price of some of the crate motors I think I am only saving about $1200 to $1500 and I have a warranty.

i prided myself in saying that the only thing I didn’t do on my 71 was install the new convertible top.

Wade

 

I second Vortecpro. i have one of his 496's in my car and love it.
Pat

 

If thats the case then look for the best warranty and go with the crate motor that gives you everything you want and dont skimp on the details. I would call them for a list of the actual parts installed as well as the minor details like bearing manufacturers and types of bearing ( bimetal versus trimetal). Also the spring makers for the heads and valves as well as all the fasteners. Some companies will skimp on the parts that you dont think about to increase the profit margin.

And companies that use all their own in house label parts are probably getting them all from china

 

I wouldn't advise one to make a purchase decision based on the "warranty", as although it would seem to perhaps be an indication of the confidence that the supplier might have in their product, or even just might be a demonstration of potential investment security for the purchaser, it actually has become (particularly as of the internet) nothing more than a promotional tool, and my personal exposure has been that all to often the warranty will evaporate the moment you have a problem; exception generally being when dealing with the "BIG-THREE"!

Scott.

 

Another route you might consider is a quality shortblock and then finish it off yourself.

 

Warranty on a crate motor is probably not quite what you expect , they play name game on who's fault it is first and have the final say, they will try to come up with some phony reason why it's not covered , they do nothing on the units with excessive blow bye out of the breathers or oil consumption, I'm with the build your current engine by a reputable builder guys

 

Yes and the small print usually voids all warranties in engine built for "performance" applications.


The cheaper the engine the more mixed the reviews will be regardless of actual quality in part due to how the consumer handles/ installs and treats the engine typically not being as careful as someone who paid much more. I bought some rotors for my car and got an amazing deal on the rear rotors. I could not find the matching brand front rotors so I ordered another brand which was almost 3 times the price but appeared to match cosmetically... well low and behold the front rotors came in the exact same box with the same part number and they are clearly the very same black box chinese rotors (the seller screwed up and send me the rears like I had already bought only under another branding.) Anyway the rotors that were being sold under the other brand name for much more had better reviews than the same rotors sold for less.. This is a very common trend as people that buy something cheap are quick to blame that product if anything goes wrong regardless of what caused it. At the same time many engine shops that charge much more for the warranty are going to have more room to replace that engine without being as picky and stay in business but in some cases your almost prepaying for that potential replacement whether you are going to need it or not. But the result is better reviews and customer satisfaction.

 

I am the one who decided to build a L88 Clone and started by re-building my engine as such.

When I re-built my 427 I knew the "quality" of the parts, I chose and paid for every part and then I helped "put it together". We spent weeks rebuilding the cylinder heads with all new parts after they were cleaned up by a cylinder head specialist. Measuring, disassembly and re-assembly only to measure once again. My mentor/engine builder had been a mechanic for Porsche back in the 1960-70's with their Can Am racing efforts. He had so many little tricks of helping the engine that were proven tricks used in the racing world. I feel more confident in my engine having been involved in it from step one. I have built dozens of air and water cooled engines over the past 50 years but being my first 427 I decided to pay for help to ensure success. I learned a lot from my buddy but the most important point was that you want a Machinist to help if you are not comfortable. If you do hire someone be sure they are a "detail" person.

I chose the parts, I bought the parts and I helped install them. There is NOTHING we scrimped on, everything was done right. We built this engine with power and longevity in mind. No warranty...WHO cares??? I break it, I fix it.

I personally like my Holley Stealth Sniper and it works very well even on an L88 engine. In the future I might go to a multi-port system. The Holley was my introduction to basic EFI systems and it has been great and I have learned Volumes about throttle body (simple) EFI in the time. I bought my EFI system from a company that supports you AFTER the SALE so I had lots of expert help available from a Tier Three Holley Technician so I did not have to wait on the phone for hours. The tech gave me his cell number and email address the day I bought my parts from them. $1000 for a professional Tune Up after the EFI system is installed? Did not have to thank you very much. I have been working on EFI systems for decades and they are not that complicated, I have been fixing and helping others fix their L98's for years. The Sniper throttle body will flow 1000 cfm which is just a bit less than my engine needs and it works fine.