I know I'm not so you must be. They use automatics for consistancy, which is what they need for this stupid bracket racing they do nowadays, but certainly aren't faster than a manual.

Top fuel and funny cars uses direct drive with a one-use-only clutch that slips a lot at first and slowly melts and fuses itself together as you go down the track so change the gear ratio without the need to shift. Well, it isn't really slow as it takes a few seconds to get down the track, but you get the idea.

 

I thought i could get some spirited discussion going. I want someone to convince me its worth dumping my 700r4 automatic the next time it dies and going to a 5 speed or whatever. Is it worth the extra effort and expense. Will i really be any faster.

I drove a friends 70 LT1 back in 1979. It had a zoom clutch and was a real bear. Drove it around the neighborhood for about 15 minutes and when i got back, i was just wasted. Cramp in my leg from the clutch. Felt like i was driving a dump truck. I bought my 75 auto in 1980 and since then i have probably put at least 300k miles on it. I wonder if i would have used it as much if it had the 4 speed. Would it have been as practical for me driving to work in traffic so on and so forth.

How much weight would i save with a 5 speed? How hard is it to mount a clutch pedal so on and so forth?

Or should i hold out another 10 years and wait for the clutchless tranny with the steering wheel mounted button shifting?

 

Auto trannys eliminate the margin of error in shifting, therefore, for most drivers (who don't shift perfect every time) the auto WILL give better results. In my opinion ANY transmission that doesn't require shifting is an auto.

 

Automatics are used for reasons much more than bracket racing. I garuntee 95% of the time the fastest cars at the track (those running 7's and 8's in the 1/4 mile) are running automatics, most being modified Th350's and Th400. A "Race Prepped" Th350 and Th400 will shift faster than any human can I can asure you that. A "built" auto w/ a large stall will almost win over a 4spd with all things equal.


[Modified by Corey 68, 9:39 PM 4/6/2003]

 

Manual tranny all the way...

 

I went backwards from most. I already knew I couldn't shift worth a crap. When my '76 was only a year old, I pulled the T-10 and put in a TH350 with a 3000 stall A-1 converter along with a 4.11 gear. Years later when it got a built 406, I went with a TH400 and KenneBell switch pitch 3000 stall that drops to 1800 stall at the flip of a toggle switch. Worked well for me. Best 12.14 on radials and mufflers.

 

It's just that all the professional drag racers that I've talked to all say that a manual is faster. It doesn't have to be a four speed, but the automatic doesn't have to be a three speed either. I know that a lot of people can shift pretty fast, and with less parasitic loss it means they have more power. Another thing to keep in mind is clutchless manuals. These are fair game and fall into manuals, especially the one I'm about to refer to. My dad was asked to help a fellow racer (who also had a '64 Corvette), who was also currently the national record holder for his class, with something or another on his car. My dad then asked him about the clutchless setup he had on his Doug Nash 5spd (same tranny my dad ran also) it was operated by a spring (sort of like a slinky) and such. I can't quite explain it as I couldn't get a good enough picture of it in my mind as my dad explained it, but it worked and he needed no clutch.

 

As big as I am into drag racing you would think that I would love automatics....I hate them. I really enjoy driving my car and there is no better way to really "feel" your car than with a standard transmission. Aside from that, you lose more power through an automatic transmission than a standard transmission (anywhere from 2% - 5% more).

It's also very gratifying to look at my timeslips and know that I was the one banging those gears. Also, a few times while drag racing my buddy told me the announcer said "there goes that shifting Stingray!" :D

Now if only I could muster up enough money to get an M22 rockcrusher :) .

 

Well I can assure you I am NOT the authority of transmissions in terms of drag racing. But I do have some knowlege (father is an old racer, raced Mopar's .ie Hemi's in the late 60's and '70's and now races Chevy's) along with many I know at the track. All the guys I know ( about 50 or so) who race EVERY weekend are all running automatics in their RACE cars, I'm not talking about guys like many of us who go to the track once a month or couple times a year. Without a doubt a stick is more fun to drive but the margin of error and lengthy shift times slowed them down. They ALL, every single one of them, has ran lower E.T.'s with a built auto and a high stall.

Think about it it's so hard to lanuch a high hp car with a stick even with slicks. Too much power you spin, too little you bogg. With an auto it's more forgiving, accurate shifting (no missed shifts) and faster shifts (race prepped auto's) than a manual tranny. 3 racers I know: one with a '00 Camaro SS, a '98 Trans Am, and a '98 Viper GTS twin turbo all had 6 speeds. With such erratic times and slower than expected E.T.'s they have since switched to Auto's. Th350's for the G.M. and 727 for the Viper. All three have picked up and average of .5 seconds in the 1/4 except the Viper where he picked up a full 1 second in the 1/4! :eek:

All the guys at the local track that are running single digets in the 1/4 are running auto's, though there are always exceptions. But over 90% of them are running auto's at least at this track.

:cheers:


[Modified by Corey 68, 11:04 PM 4/6/2003]

 

It isn't the transmission, it's the driver in those situations. My dad dumped his clutch at 11,000 rpm and didn't spin, then he proceeded to powershift his way down the track.
My references are all guys that race and try their best to make some money in the process. Many of them also race every weekend. A lot of them race automatics also. But if you ask any of one of them why, they will say it's because it's more consistant, but not as fast as a manual. They want that consistancy because it's all bracket racing.

 

Dumping the clutch at 11,000rpms with no spin? :skep:

What kind of motor is he running? Provided he doesn't break anything on the launch and has enough power to spin how is he not spinning? It doesn't add up?

In all of my years I have NEVER heard of dumping the clutch at 11,000 rpms off the line. :nonod:

I mean no disrespect, honest, but I have to say :bs

And if you think the hundreds of thousands of racers across the world are running auto's because "They can't shift" is just wrong, sorry.

Once again I'm not trying to flame, just have to strongly disagree.
:cheers:


[Modified by Corey 68, 11:57 PM 4/6/2003]

 

700R4 Good choice as I oput the shift kit in it and I really did not want to convert to a manual.

 

:iagree:

 

So can I assume from all the responses in this thread that the SOLE measure of a car is its speed in the 1/4 mile. Let me tell you, you are missing out on a lot!

For me, and me alone aparently, I dont give a wet slap how fast my car is in the quarter, and wouldnt trade to an auto for a 10 second improvement in my times let alone a few hundredths.

I'll be the first to admit that an auto is far superior in bracket racing if thats your thing. And I'm sure if you spend a fortune building an auto it'll get you down the track. but then how many of us are spend fortunes and "one-time use" clutches like the top fuel guys, or hydraulicly shifted servo operated 40k rallye race manuals - well 0 I'd say.

Lets just call it personal preference and leave it at that.

 

id have to say stick even tho the first time i sat in my vette my leg cramped up :lol: i more less drive for the style not to race, sure its nice once and awhile , but thats what your other cars for (79 Monza 2+2 70 LT-1,Auto od 4-11's) *ricers have no clue what kinda car it is :lol:

 

Fauxrs

If you look at my sig you will see I'm running a 4 speed. :D The only point I was trying to mak was that in SOME cases automatic transmission has some advantages and the owners of these cars have them for a reason and it's NOT because they are lazy or can't shift.

:cheers:

 

4-speed of course! :cheers:

 

Stcik, much more fun to drive :cheers:

 

I really enjoy driving my car and there is no better way to really "feel" your car than with a standard transmission.
:iagree:

learn to drive a standard shift and you can drive almost anything. :steering:

 

Mine is automatic (the first auto I've had), but I'm considering converting it to manual. Auto is perfect for cruising and normal driving, I also believe it's faster or atleast easier to drive and more consistent on the dragstrip, but I miss the control you have with manual trans when your driving those twisty country roads...