I was looking at how my TV cable will have to be set up on my 200-4R and I've determined that my carb has a shorter throw than that of the TV cable. So I'm wondering if it will be a problem if I have it set up so that the cable is fully extended at WOT, but not all the way in at idle? I think pushing the button to set the cable will make it all work correctly, right?

 

No! I'm doing this to mine at the moment. At WOT (set by fully depressing the throttle pedal & verifying that the carb actually reaches WOT - mine didn't so minor adjustments were needed :smash: ), the TV cable must be fully extended ie if you tug on it while somebody keeps the throttle to the floor, there will be no movement (which is what the ratchet mechanism should ensure). That sets up the TV & throttle cable relationship at WOT but not at idle. Ideally you need the tranny running its minimum pressure at idle but for the pressure to increase as soon as the throttle starts to open. Having the pressure too low will trash your tranny quite soon & having it to high will give strange shifting effects (don't take that as Gospel as I'm still trying to work it all out, but I thinks that's the right way round!). The TV cable must be set up correctly. It's crucial.
The throw on the throttle bracket is the problem (Bowtie do a kit to solve it) but I can't see why you couldn't bolt a bracket, with a stud for the TV cable, to the throttle shaft. By varying the position of the new TV cable stud (move it to/away from the centre of the throttle shaft to vary the radius of arc) you should be able to get the correct cable relationships with trial & error. The easiest thing to do is hook a pressure gauge up to the tranny & experiment with mounting the cable at various positions by making up an adjustable bracket. If you slacken the TV cable right off the pressure will be constant at idle. With the throttle closed, pulling slowly on the TV cable will eventualy result in the pressure starting to rise. The point at which the pressure starts to rise needs to correspond with the throttle starting to open (after the WOT setting has been done with the ratchet thingy). It could be a fiddly job!
:cheers:

 

It will depend on how much short it is. The trans will run at about 70psi with the cable disconnected. You should only see 4-5psi increase with it hooked up. I made a plate and attached it to the carb so I could fine-tune it. The amount of travel for the valve is suppose to be 1.610". If the cable does not have enough travel the shift points will be hard and could cuase damage.

 

OK, Schmucker. I know you want to do it the cheap (but right) way. So here we go.

First, go to a junkyard and find a throttle arm of a later-model car that had a QJet and a 700R4 tranny. Some Camaros and Firebirds from the 80's had this. Alternatively, someone makes a little spring thing that goes on the end of the TV cable at the carb to compensate for the difference. I don't happen to know who it is. Perhaps you could do a forum search. Not as good a solution, but it works

To adjust the TV cable, you MUST have a tranny pressure gauge. NEVER use the WOT method of adjusting the cable. Period. You're going to use the black plastic adjuster to set TV pressure at idle (with a warm tranny). What you do is move the adjuster forward until the pressure drops and goes down no further. Then start moving it back until pressure increases 2 psi -- that's it, just 2 psi. Then lock it down and test drive the car. If it shifts OK, remove the gauge and enjoy driving! If not, come back and ask us more questions. :smash:

 

Hi Page,
Setting up the relationship between the cables at idle is well explained by Bowtie & we're left in no doubt that not doing it right (with a pressure guage) will result in torment, expense & heartache. But I was wondering about the WOT settings? If the cable travel isn't quite correct then the valve may never reach its WOT position. There's some new gumf ("Gumf" = technical description) on their website that explains all this. While I'm confident that the TV Made EZ kit solves these little ****les, it's something worth checking if setting it up without the kit.

Schmucker,
Can you IM me your email address? The one in your profile didn't work & I tried to send a pic that you may find useful.
:cheers:

 

Good thread, I have been playing around with the tv postion in my formula and may have set it to wrong. When i bought it the car would not down shift properly when hitting the gas so I adj using the ratchet method. It then shift way too had on take off (just about bark the tires at only part throttle) and at too high rpm I felt. I now have it shifting softer (still jerks the car when shifting 1-2)but think the tranny was set up for super hard shifts so I think I need to do the pressure check.

Signguy, got anymore info on using a tranny pressure gauge, not familiar with them.

Thanks


[Modified by Fevre, 9:27 AM 5/9/2003]

 

Man, TV cables are a PITA! We are going to make an adjustable bracket to hold the TV cable so we can move it forward and back if needed, I need to go to the junkyard and get an extra bracket, so I'll try to get it off of an F-body and some other brackets too. Maybe pick up an extra shifter bracket. Try a different dipstick too... I just wish I could go and look the car over and get this stuff, we don't have anyplace where we can pull the parts off.

 

Paul, the TV Made EZ kit resolves those WOT ****les. After all, for a hundred+ bucks, it had better resolve 'em! :yesnod: That's supposed to be the "EZ" part of the kit, I guess.

All of this explains why Schmucker is better off finding a QJet throttle arm from an '80s car with a 700R4 (or 200-4R). It'll provide the proper travel range for the TV cable. If he chooses the spring thingy :smash: it'll reach WOT pressure prematurely. It works, but it ain't perfect.

BTW: The bottom line of all that gumf is that it's more critical to have proper off-idle pressure than correct WOT pressure. I am very happy with the shifting action with my 200-4R (except that I have to lockout OD in the city, but I've learned to live with that).

 

Hi Page,
Yup the idle is the crucial part, but Schmucker really wants the WOT synchronisation to be correct as gear changes may not occur as/when wanted. I'm expecting that mine is set OK with the kit, but I'll check it anyway: I'm going to have Headers with wide open dual pipes initially :D & I don't want odd or random gearchanges amusing any pedestrians or motorists within earshot (about a 3 mile radius)! :lol:

Fevre,
There's a pressure port in the tranny a few inches above the manual change shaft. The pressure gauge screws in there. Bowtie sell a nice one with 7' of hose crimped to it so you can read the pressure easily when working on the throttle linkage.
:cheers:

 

:thumbs:

 

Schmucker,
There's an email on it's way to you with a pic that you should find helpful.
As I understand it the end result should be this:
The trottle cable moves from throttle fully closed to WOT.
The TV cable moves through distance x. The starting point for x is the point where the pressure just starts to rise (increases by 2 psi as Page said) & the end point is when the valve in the tranny is at its WOT position. The starting point of x should correspond to throttle closed. That's the easy bit (but you'll need a pressure gauge to do it). The tricky part (which the TV Made EZ kit resolves) is to ensure that at WOT the end point of Y is just reached. To verify that the TV cable has reached WOT at the correct time, hold the throttle at WOT (via a helpers foot on the pedal) & see if you can move the TV cable out anymore by pulling on it. If you can then it's not at WOT. If not then it's OK. I assume that if it reaches WOT early then it will stop the carb going to WOT???? This should all be accomplished by carefully positioning the cables attachment point, which could be a time consuming job.
What concerns me slightly is that my experience of cables (especially when new) is that they tend to stretch over time (or the strands close up, thus increasing the length), so I guess that the alignment must be checked sometime in the future?
:cheers:

 

I got the TV madeEZ from bowtie. Im sure theres other ways to do it correctly though. The key word is "correctly" however you decide to do it, make sure its right. Improper adjustment or bad setup of TV sys is probably the #1 cause of early trans failure. I took my pan off to index the dipstick with a new mark. At the same time I verified that the TV valve was fully depressed when the throttle was floored. Also, if you have too much pressure at light throttle then there would likely be delayed and extra harsh upshifting at light throttle.



[Modified by Jvette73, 3:49 PM 5/9/2003]

 

I hooked up my pressure gage under the hood using 3/16 brake line and fittings. That way I can check it out if I need to do any adjusting. Derek, Did you get my E-mail? did it help. Paul, The problem with the TV madeEZ is they don't have a setup for every carb. They told me they didn't have one for my Holley or Rochester Q-jet. I had to make my hook up to the carb. I used the bracket and cble which worked great. It is ahrd to tell someone exactlly what to do when there is not clear difined way of doing it without some trial and error.
Good luck.

 

I had an old diagram from B&M transmissions from back when OD's first came out. It said that the TV cable should be 1.09 inches +/- .10 inches from the centerpoint of the throttle shaft and only travel through a 60 degree arch. That is how I have mine set up and it has worked fine for four years now. As previously posted, I also have mine on a small bracket attached to the Q-jet linkage to get the proper distance and arch. I also used the TV cable mount from a mid eighty's fullsize Buick, Olds, Pontiac with V-8, Q-jet, and200-R4. This set the TV cable the proper distance from the carb. Hershey :chevy

 

Yeah, that helped. My dad said those carb brackets are a bear to drill. I think I should be okay making my own cable mounting bracket to hold the cable, then make a fairly short extension to the hook up on the carb to get more travel. A quarter inch is all I think I'll need, but I'll design in adjustability. I just need to extend the arch. I'm using the factory GN cable, so I don't have too much extra cable hanging out so they'll be fairly close. I'll have to hit up a junkyard next week.

 

You can also run a geometry correcting setup like I do with my Demon. It allows higher a bit more control over your around town settings, but when you mash it you know you are getting WOT TV enagement without stretching the cable or bending the linkage. These are available from most trans supply houses. For those interested in pruchasing I can check on prices locally, email me if interested - atkin11j@yahoo.com

 

Yeah, but I cannot think of any time where I've been passed half throttle and not had it buried to the floor. If I'm going down that far it's going all the way, so the issue with the tranny being at WOT but the carb not won't be an issue because it will never happen. UKPaul, you sound like what I'll have... 3 inch open sidepipes (after I build and install a 383 or 406), I'm going to turn them down into the ground (making them myself like everything else) so hopefully they won't be as loud then, but I'm still going to go through the doctor's lot at the hospital and set off car alarms with the noise :D :rofl: The dumb things I do as a kid :D

And Dman, I think I'll do that, but I'm going to have a gander at F-body plates anyway. The benefits of not wrecking that cable are enough even if I don't have to use the spring as much. It'll also be helpful when I switch engines and have a different intake and carb so I'll have to adapt all of this stuff to the new engine.

I have to get a pressure guage ready, what size is the fitting in the transmission?


[Modified by Schmucker, 7:04 PM 5/10/2003]

 

The fitting in the trans is a 1/8th NPT. The throttle plates are mild steel and drill easy if you need to.