Suspension Ideas
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,100
Likes: 2
From: Charlotte NC
I hate to jump in and continue polluting the original topic of this post, but maybe we could start a new one based on these coilovers? I am interested in learning more about them, and what the concept behind their operation is, how they differ from coil/mono springs, and how you might employ them in an earlirer model vette.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 5,135
Likes: 71
From: Umeå Sweden
there was a test in an magazine here in sweden where they tested the new porsche 911 and the C6 on the nuburgring,the long track
the vette was faster around,dont remember how meny seconds,But it was pretty much.
the vette was faster around,dont remember how meny seconds,But it was pretty much.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 784
Likes: 0
From: Santa Barbara California
Wait and once again about the VB&P suspension packages then? Was wondering about the system myself. Worth the extra cash? Anyone using it? Thoughts, opinions, about Performance Plus and others?
Race Director
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 10,643
Likes: 8
From: Foxfield CO 1970 Convertible
OK - I'm using the VB&P performance package. It's easy (relatively) to put on with the body on the frame. It is extremely adjustable - spring ratings from 300 - 500 lb. or so. One big advantage that I noticed immediately is that it weighs about half of the original suspension. For instance, the rear leaf spring is about 50lb (right?) and the new one is 14lb. Most new suspensions I see have tubular A-arms which is what comes in the kit also. It's just very solid and a definite improvement over the stock system.
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 653
Likes: 0
From: Dickinson (Houston) Texas
Wow!
I would have never thought this would have been such a heated topic!
I personally have tremendous respect for Twin Turbo, and Norval. I don't always agree with them, or anybody for that matter, but they speak with a background of knowledge that I could only wish to have.
The original purpose of this thread was to find out if I restored the original suspension, then later upgraded to the Performance Plus, could it be done easily with the body on the frame. I like the package from what I know about it. I have friends who have it and like it for the adjustability of it. It is just right now it is out of my price range.
Thanks Z-Man, you answered my question!
I would have never thought this would have been such a heated topic!
I personally have tremendous respect for Twin Turbo, and Norval. I don't always agree with them, or anybody for that matter, but they speak with a background of knowledge that I could only wish to have.
The original purpose of this thread was to find out if I restored the original suspension, then later upgraded to the Performance Plus, could it be done easily with the body on the frame. I like the package from what I know about it. I have friends who have it and like it for the adjustability of it. It is just right now it is out of my price range.
Thanks Z-Man, you answered my question!
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 8,220
Likes: 208
To answer the ORIGINAL question I'd say go with the new Jim Meyer coil over set up and rack n pinion in front and then give Guldstrand a call and see how fast they can produce you one of their 5-links with coil overs. That's the route I'm going next time, I've tried the VB&P Performance + kit and I have been very pleased with it, no complains what so ever, just like to try different things. As what this thread got hi-jacked to, I wanna say that the new C6 was awfully quick on the Top Gear test track, but still loosing to cars like EVO mitsubisi, this done with the stoneage suspension. Still I must agree with TT and Norval here, to get trully independent suspension that works, first you need to get rid of the leaf springs! They do work fine, but they are not THE solution for handling!
Race Director
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 16,945
Likes: 9
Originally Posted by groovyjay
To answer the ORIGINAL question I'd say go with the new Jim Meyer coil over set up
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Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,997
Likes: 1
From: WAY DEEP INSIDE AMERICO,YES YOU LIVE HERE TO!! TX
Originally Posted by groovyjay
then give Guldstrand a call and see how fast they can produce you one of their 5-links with coil overs.
Race Director
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 16,945
Likes: 9
The 5 link for 80-82 apparently has some major problems, that's hy it was enver sold. I heard 1 guy has one and they are having problems. I would like to get my hands on those castings or fabricated parts he uses over the rear hubs, the bracket is pretty easy to make yourself and so is the center bracket for under the diff. The rod ends can be bought, same for the rod ends. Just have to know the exact length of the rods, all 8 are the same length and if I'm not mistaking are 14" end to end.
Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,997
Likes: 1
From: WAY DEEP INSIDE AMERICO,YES YOU LIVE HERE TO!! TX
Originally Posted by Twin_Turbo
The 5 link for 80-82 apparently has some major problems, that's hy it was enver sold. I heard 1 guy has one and they are having problems. I would like to get my hands on those castings or fabricated parts he uses over the rear hubs, the bracket is pretty easy to make yourself and so is the center bracket for under the diff. The rod ends can be bought, same for the rod ends. Just have to know the exact length of the rods, all 8 are the same length and if I'm not mistaking are 14" end to end.
Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,997
Likes: 1
From: WAY DEEP INSIDE AMERICO,YES YOU LIVE HERE TO!! TX
Originally Posted by Twin_Turbo
The problem must be in the camber bracket, as that is the only critical component that is in another position relative to the 1/2 shafts, the 80-82 models use angled camber rods:
just trying to figure where to start. I already have a crap load
of money in my rear suspension, and still all new, but I will drop
it in a heart beat for the 6 link. 79 and older have different rears
as it would not be as easy to do as norvals.
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 11,872
Likes: 12
From: Waterloo ontario Canada
The 6 link is very easy to do and can be done for about $150 absolute maximum. It does require removing the rearend to remove the yoke clips and weld studs to the crossmember. It was a simple modification that really works and is very adjustable.
Installing the coilovers was alot of work but well worth the effort.
Installing the coilovers was alot of work but well worth the effort.
Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,997
Likes: 1
From: WAY DEEP INSIDE AMERICO,YES YOU LIVE HERE TO!! TX
Originally Posted by norvalwilhelm
The 6 link is very easy to do and can be done for about $150 absolute maximum. It does require removing the rearend to remove the yoke clips and weld studs to the crossmember. It was a simple modification that really works and is very adjustable.
Installing the coilovers was alot of work but well worth the effort.
Installing the coilovers was alot of work but well worth the effort.
Race Director
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 16,945
Likes: 9
The 6 link is not easy to do in the 80-82 as there is no steel crossmember to mount the upper mounts to, you will have to weld in a complete support structure of some kind to provide the proper moutns for the upper rods. Coil overs are not nevessary to take advantage of the effect of the 6 link, which is easy camber adjustment and taking the 1/2 shaft out of the suspension as a geometry component.
Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,997
Likes: 1
From: WAY DEEP INSIDE AMERICO,YES YOU LIVE HERE TO!! TX
Originally Posted by Twin_Turbo
The 6 link is not easy to do in the 80-82 as there is no steel crossmember to mount the upper mounts to, you will have to weld in a complete support structure of some kind to provide the proper moutns for the upper rods. Coil overs are not nevessary to take advantage of the effect of the 6 link, which is easy camber adjustment and taking the 1/2 shaft out of the suspension as a geometry component.
on corvettefaq. I would have to design my own.
I want to get rid of the bounce.(not much, but it's there)
I want to get rid of the squat.
I have all VBP and Bilsteins with the dual mount set up
Drifting
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,906
Likes: 0
From: Berlin
Originally Posted by Twin_Turbo
Why is the vette the only sportscar using that system? You can not deny that there are no problems w/ harmonics and the suspension not being truely independant same as running a big sway bar. IT's probably cheaper than a coil over system like almost any other serious sports car uses, you won't find those springs on porsches, ferraris, bimmers and so on.
That said, I don't think a composite leaf spring has any performance advantages for an OEM supplier. As I understand it, the multileaf springs were originally installed in 63's because the interleaf friction was useful for controlling the rear end (and for packaging reasons). Friction tends to resist motion the most at zero velocity, whereas shocks are generally designed to have almost no resistance at zero velocity. Since these springs were switched to "frictionless" composite later on, I'll have to assume that they were kept for packaging reasons (or maybe just tradition?). In any case, they work pretty well. And so would coil springs.
For an aftermarket system, though, the adjustability of a leaf spring seems quite an advantage over fixed coil springs (at least for the front where damping is not an issue).