LED Headlight Conversion - Please Help
Thread Starter
Cruising
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 11
Likes: 3
LED Headlight Conversion - Please Help
My son bought a 92 last summer. He is 17 and wanted a vette since he was 5. He has saved for years to afford one. It needs some work but runs and drives nicely. He doesn't like driving it at night because the headlights suck. For his birthday we bought him an LED upgrade kit. Once installed they turned on and flipped open but when turned off they would not shut all of the way off and would not flip closed. I tried installing a load resistor but it did not help. I am assuming the kit I bought did not have enough load resistance in the lights.
Can any one recommend a LED kit that works and activates the flip lights? Any and all help is appreciated.
Thanks
Can any one recommend a LED kit that works and activates the flip lights? Any and all help is appreciated.
Thanks
Race Director
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 17,329
Likes: 6,509
From: Melbourne, FL
The led headlights shouldn't affect their flipping operation.
I ought some "osram" led housings from Amazon and have been very happy with them. I did have to ground the fog light relay to get that working.
I ought some "osram" led housings from Amazon and have been very happy with them. I did have to ground the fog light relay to get that working.
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 1,925
Likes: 610
From: Orange, CA
As has been said already, LED headlights will not affect the ability for the headlights to flip open and closed. The motors are on a totally different circuit. Improper installation of LED headlights--or LED headlights that aren't built to the proper housing spec--causing them to bind on the hood, however, would. But that has nothing to do with the LED part of them.
As for an LED headlight you don't need to modify, I have a pair that another user rumored to work. I haven't been able to test it in my dad's '94 just yet (I got him an LED conversion for father's day, since I'd already done one on my own car), but when I do I'll post the findings. Even if it doesn't work, as has also been said, you just need to cut the green wire at the fog light relay and connect it directly to ground (such as an exposed bolt nearby) in order to get the high beams and fog lights working again.
As for an LED headlight you don't need to modify, I have a pair that another user rumored to work. I haven't been able to test it in my dad's '94 just yet (I got him an LED conversion for father's day, since I'd already done one on my own car), but when I do I'll post the findings. Even if it doesn't work, as has also been said, you just need to cut the green wire at the fog light relay and connect it directly to ground (such as an exposed bolt nearby) in order to get the high beams and fog lights working again.
Thread Starter
Cruising
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 11
Likes: 3
OK, so I am going to try to ground the fog light relay and see what happens.
Just to clarify my issue. When both lights have LED's installed they open and turn on fine. The brights also work fine. When I go to turn them off the LED's stay partially lit (very very dimly) and the lights will not close. There is no binding or weight problem, the motors are not even turning on and trying to shut. The minute I install the old style bulb in one side and reconnect the power, both sides shut.
It almost seems like a ground problem. Maybe the old style lights, being metal, are grounding the circuit, but the new LED's, being plastic, are not? I am pretty good with mechanical problems but I am weak in electrical issues.
Any other suggestions before I go and try to fry the electrical system?
Just to clarify my issue. When both lights have LED's installed they open and turn on fine. The brights also work fine. When I go to turn them off the LED's stay partially lit (very very dimly) and the lights will not close. There is no binding or weight problem, the motors are not even turning on and trying to shut. The minute I install the old style bulb in one side and reconnect the power, both sides shut.
It almost seems like a ground problem. Maybe the old style lights, being metal, are grounding the circuit, but the new LED's, being plastic, are not? I am pretty good with mechanical problems but I am weak in electrical issues.
Any other suggestions before I go and try to fry the electrical system?
Race Director
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 17,329
Likes: 6,509
From: Melbourne, FL
Ahh! That makes a lot more sense. What's happening is the lower resistance of the led bulbs (you really should get led housings, not just bulbs) is causing to stay them on, dimly, even when off. This in turn is pulling a small amperage that prevents the housings from deciding to shut, because tech ically, they're on.
Send the bulbs back and buy led housings. There are many types out there at different price points.
Send the bulbs back and buy led housings. There are many types out there at different price points.
Last edited by FAUEE; Jul 23, 2020 at 04:31 PM.
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Thread Starter
Cruising
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 11
Likes: 3
Ahh! That makes a lot more sense. What's happening is the lower resistance of the led bulbs (you really should get led housings, not just bulbs) is causing to stay them on, dimly, even when off. This in turn is pulling a small amperage that prevents the housings from deciding to shut, because tech ically, they're on.
Send the bulbs back and buy led housings. There are many types out there at different price points.
Send the bulbs back and buy led housings. There are many types out there at different price points.
Are you saying I should get something like this instead?
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,193
Likes: 195
From: New Caney Texas
It's a resistance issue. LED's lights do not pull the same load as their incandescent counterparts which is why you must use inline resistors in any LED replacement where it does not pull comparable load and the circuit's resistance/capacitance is used to identify if a bulb is burnt out or not.
See what the actually wattage draw of your replacement LED headlight assembly. I'm betting it is not even half of your halogen bulb.
I have seen this same issue in my C6 when you replace the interior light bulbs in the rearview mirror with LED replacements. The circuit doesn't open after being dimmed so the interior lights stay on resulting in a dead battery.
See what the actually wattage draw of your replacement LED headlight assembly. I'm betting it is not even half of your halogen bulb.
I have seen this same issue in my C6 when you replace the interior light bulbs in the rearview mirror with LED replacements. The circuit doesn't open after being dimmed so the interior lights stay on resulting in a dead battery.
Last edited by RC4G; Jul 23, 2020 at 05:42 PM.
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 1,925
Likes: 610
From: Orange, CA
That is exactly the same headlight I use on my '95. If you use this headlight, you must ground the fog light relay in order to have the high beams and foglights working correctly. However, even if you did not do this, it would not affect the low beams and would not affect the ability of the motors to open or close the lights. I did not have that issue, so I would suspect there is something else wrong in the car.
While it is true that LEDs do not pull anywhere near the load of their incandescent counterparts (which is the huge reason to switch to them!), it is not true that you MUST use inline resistors. If you account for the circuit design when replacing, you don't need any resistors whatsoever. Every single exterior bulb on my '95 is LED, and I have zero resistors added. Adding resistors is slapping a band-aid onto the problem rather than identifying the actual cause.
In the case of the fog lights not working right and the high beam indicator staying dimly lit, that's due to the design of the fog light circuit, and can be corrected by cutting the green wire coming from the fog light relay under the passenger dash and connecting it directly to ground.
It's a resistance issue. LED's lights do not pull the same load as their incandescent counterparts which is why you must use inline resistors in any LED replacement where it does not pull comparable load and the circuit's resistance/capacitance is used to identify if a bulb is burnt out or not.
In the case of the fog lights not working right and the high beam indicator staying dimly lit, that's due to the design of the fog light circuit, and can be corrected by cutting the green wire coming from the fog light relay under the passenger dash and connecting it directly to ground.
Thread Starter
Cruising
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 11
Likes: 3
First, I want to thank all of you for your help. It is much appreciated.
Second, I GOT THEM TO WORK!! It was a resistance issue, as some of you suggested. I had tried a load resistor before because in doing research I heard this was an issue but evidentially I did not have it hooked up correctly. It took me a while to find a correct wiring diagram and when I put a load resister in parallel with the ground and low beam it worked!! Trying to decipher which was which was a nightmare because, as I said, I am not the "brightest bulb" when it comes to electrical. I found a diagram from a different post on this site and figured out that black is ground, green is high beam and red is low beams. Once I spliced into the black and red wires and connected the 6 ohm, Sylvania load resistor the lights immediately shut. I am going to place a resistor on the other side just for safety even though it doesn't appear to need it.
I can only hope that this thread will help some other poor electrical schmuck and save him/her a lot of headaches.
Once again THANK YOU!! It is nice to know there is a place to go and find answers. I am sure my kid and I will be on here frequently as he LOVES his C4 and loves working on it.
Second, I GOT THEM TO WORK!! It was a resistance issue, as some of you suggested. I had tried a load resistor before because in doing research I heard this was an issue but evidentially I did not have it hooked up correctly. It took me a while to find a correct wiring diagram and when I put a load resister in parallel with the ground and low beam it worked!! Trying to decipher which was which was a nightmare because, as I said, I am not the "brightest bulb" when it comes to electrical. I found a diagram from a different post on this site and figured out that black is ground, green is high beam and red is low beams. Once I spliced into the black and red wires and connected the 6 ohm, Sylvania load resistor the lights immediately shut. I am going to place a resistor on the other side just for safety even though it doesn't appear to need it.
I can only hope that this thread will help some other poor electrical schmuck and save him/her a lot of headaches.
Once again THANK YOU!! It is nice to know there is a place to go and find answers. I am sure my kid and I will be on here frequently as he LOVES his C4 and loves working on it.
Thread Starter
Cruising
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 11
Likes: 3
That is exactly the same headlight I use on my '95. If you use this headlight, you must ground the fog light relay in order to have the high beams and foglights working correctly. However, even if you did not do this, it would not affect the low beams and would not affect the ability of the motors to open or close the lights. I did not have that issue, so I would suspect there is something else wrong in the car.
While it is true that LEDs do not pull anywhere near the load of their incandescent counterparts (which is the huge reason to switch to them!), it is not true that you MUST use inline resistors. If you account for the circuit design when replacing, you don't need any resistors whatsoever. Every single exterior bulb on my '95 is LED, and I have zero resistors added. Adding resistors is slapping a band-aid onto the problem rather than identifying the actual cause.
In the case of the fog lights not working right and the high beam indicator staying dimly lit, that's due to the design of the fog light circuit, and can be corrected by cutting the green wire coming from the fog light relay under the passenger dash and connecting it directly to ground.
While it is true that LEDs do not pull anywhere near the load of their incandescent counterparts (which is the huge reason to switch to them!), it is not true that you MUST use inline resistors. If you account for the circuit design when replacing, you don't need any resistors whatsoever. Every single exterior bulb on my '95 is LED, and I have zero resistors added. Adding resistors is slapping a band-aid onto the problem rather than identifying the actual cause.
In the case of the fog lights not working right and the high beam indicator staying dimly lit, that's due to the design of the fog light circuit, and can be corrected by cutting the green wire coming from the fog light relay under the passenger dash and connecting it directly to ground.
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 1,925
Likes: 610
From: Orange, CA
Also located under this panel (at least on the 94-96) is the hazard flasher, which will also need to be changed to an LED-compatible version if you swap the turn signals with LEDs. If you intend to do this it's best to do it now and get it out of the way so you don't have to take this dash panel apart more than once.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,193
Likes: 195
From: New Caney Texas
While it is true that LEDs do not pull anywhere near the load of their incandescent counterparts (which is the huge reason to switch to them!), it is not true that you MUST use inline resistors. If you account for the circuit design when replacing, you don't need any resistors whatsoever. Every single exterior bulb on my '95 is LED, and I have zero resistors added. Adding resistors is slapping a band-aid onto the problem rather than identifying the actual cause.
I stated you must use resistors on any circuit where the resistance is used to determine the light's state (on or off) or to detect if a bulb is blown.
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 1,925
Likes: 610
From: Orange, CA
Which does not apply to the C4, as it has no such functionality. The illusion of this functionality (namely the 'blown bulb detection') is an artifact of the thermal flasher unit, and is corrected by using a proper solid state LED-compatible flasher.
Racer
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 362
Likes: 81
From: Indianapolis
danandmatt-- I'm having almost exactly your issue, the only difference is my lights won't open on the "p" position and now fogs at all. Could you be specific about the "6 ohm Sylvania resistor." where they these:
If not, could you link to what worked for you? Any idea if something more general, like these, would work:
And I'm wondering why we're trying to ground the fog's inside the cabin, rather than under the hood, with many more grounding opportunities. I know I'm missing something, but what...?
Thanks-- this thread is a lifesaver :-)
ronn
If not, could you link to what worked for you? Any idea if something more general, like these, would work:
And I'm wondering why we're trying to ground the fog's inside the cabin, rather than under the hood, with many more grounding opportunities. I know I'm missing something, but what...?
Thanks-- this thread is a lifesaver :-)
ronn
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 3,181
Likes: 286
From: Puyallup Washington
I bought these for my C4. They were plug and play. No issues at all. The light output is great.