Auto Cross
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Joined: Mar 2022
Posts: 63
Likes: 7
From: Lubbock, Texas
Auto Cross
I have been invited to participate in an autocross event next month. I'm sporting a 92 vert, pretty much stock. Im curious if anyone anto x'ed with their C4? I X'ed with my73 stingray, but it was purpose built for auto cross, suspension was custom built and it was an awesome competitor.
Now Im wondering what are the strengths and weaknesses of my C4 what I can expect with the C4? Is the ASR a help or turn it off?
Thanks
Now Im wondering what are the strengths and weaknesses of my C4 what I can expect with the C4? Is the ASR a help or turn it off?
Thanks
Advanced
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 78
Likes: 35
From: Evans Georgia
2022 C4 of the Year Finalist - Unmodified
I have been invited to participate in an autocross event next month. I'm sporting a 92 vert, pretty much stock. Im curious if anyone anto x'ed with their C4? I X'ed with my73 stingray, but it was purpose built for auto cross, suspension was custom built and it was an awesome competitor.
Now Im wondering what are the strengths and weaknesses of my C4 what I can expect with the C4? Is the ASR a help or turn it off?
Thanks
Now Im wondering what are the strengths and weaknesses of my C4 what I can expect with the C4? Is the ASR a help or turn it off?
Thanks
Race Director
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 17,278
Likes: 6,469
From: Melbourne, FL
Strengths will be power, weaknesses will be size and the A4. I'd turn ASR off, it won't help you as it's a very crude system.
I would just go out and have some fun..youre likely notngoing to be fast there in that car, so just have a good time doing it.
I would just go out and have some fun..youre likely notngoing to be fast there in that car, so just have a good time doing it.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 6,086
Likes: 1,972
From: St. Charles MO
Interesting takes here. The C4 is a small car: only a 96" wheelbase. It's also relatively narrow compared to modern cars. These things help with autocross capability. They are pretty low-powered compared to modern cars, too, but power doesn't matter that much for typical autocross courses. Back when C4s were new, the autos were at least as good as the manuals for autocross use. Turn your ASR off! A C4 is miles ahead of the C2/3 in terms of suspension design. The C4 was one of the very best stock autocross cars in the 80s and early 90s. Newer cars are faster now, but it's a very capable car. Have fun!
Race Director
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 17,278
Likes: 6,469
From: Melbourne, FL
Interesting takes here. The C4 is a small car: only a 96" wheelbase. It's also relatively narrow compared to modern cars. These things help with autocross capability. They are pretty low-powered compared to modern cars, too, but power doesn't matter that much for typical autocross courses. Back when C4s were new, the autos were at least as good as the manuals for autocross use. Turn your ASR off! A C4 is miles ahead of the C2/3 in terms of suspension design. The C4 was one of the very best stock autocross cars in the 80s and early 90s. Newer cars are faster now, but it's a very capable car. Have fun!
It was one of the things that led me to do more road courses than autocross, the courses they laid out just weren't fun, road courses were. YMMV of course.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 6,086
Likes: 1,972
From: St. Charles MO
The average car insee at an autocross is a miata or maybe s2000. Some fiat Abarth, mini cooper's, etc. May be based on location, but when i was doing autocrosses, it was basically for miata guys, by miata guys. Compared tho this ears, a c4 is a large and powerful vehicle, lol.
It was one of the things that led me to do more road courses than autocross, the courses they laid out just weren't fun, road courses were. YMMV of course.
It was one of the things that led me to do more road courses than autocross, the courses they laid out just weren't fun, road courses were. YMMV of course.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 21,543
Likes: 3,216
From: Park City Utah
Big time.
Back when I was a Masshole, the New England Region made small tight courses...I never got out of second gear. Now that I am a Utar'd, here in UT, 3rd gear is...WAS common (apparently there is some new rule that "you can't use 3rd gear"(?). Courses are WAY more open and fast. I've hit 80 MPH on one course (Pocatello air port)...where I also, incredibly, got FTD.
Back when I was a Masshole, the New England Region made small tight courses...I never got out of second gear. Now that I am a Utar'd, here in UT, 3rd gear is...WAS common (apparently there is some new rule that "you can't use 3rd gear"(?). Courses are WAY more open and fast. I've hit 80 MPH on one course (Pocatello air port)...where I also, incredibly, got FTD.
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Instructor
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 175
Likes: 38
I used to autocross my old ZR1 a lot and it was very competitive, even when miata drivers setup the course (although I preferred when a fellow corvette owner did). No matter what, you're going to have an awesome time. If you hope to be fast, make sure you've got a good set of tires. Without good tires all the handling and power mean nothing. Also, if you haven't done so already, be a good idea to have the car aligned with some more aggressive specs.
Let us know how it goes! I don't think the A4 will be a hinderance at all, depending on the course and your axle gear, you may not even get out of 1st.
Let us know how it goes! I don't think the A4 will be a hinderance at all, depending on the course and your axle gear, you may not even get out of 1st.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 6,086
Likes: 1,972
From: St. Charles MO
Just as a tangential clarification, there is no SCCA rule or NCCC rule that you can't use 3rd gear, or that you can't design a course the entails the use of 3rd gear in most cars. I'm the Safety Chief for the St. Louis Region SCCA Solo program (god help us all!), so I am familiar with course design rules (I have to approve every course we have for safety). The SCCA rulebook (Section 2.2.A.) says:
That's not a hard rule, since they hedge with "normally." They also say in Section 2.1:
Caps are theirs, so they are very clear that these are guidelines and that the ruling principle is whatever will be safe and within the spirit of low-speed time trial events. Plenty of small cars have to grab 3rd gear by 52mph or so, whereas my Camaro and my 96 C4 before it could extend 2nd gear to 78mph or thereabouts. Not allowing 3rd gear would be a ridiculous rule. If someone in the Utah Region is saying that's the rule, then you should suggest they ask Mike Carpenter, Mark Cornelius, Tracy Pitkin, or some of the other group that attend national events!
Originally Posted by SCCA
Courses must be tight enough so that cars run the entire course in their lower gears. Speeds on straight stretches should not normally exceed the mid-60s (mph) for the fastest Street and Street Touring® category cars.
But it is quite possible to set up a course on which speeds do not exceed 45 mph, but which is more hazardous than another course on which 65 mph is attainable...IT WOULD BE POSSIBLE TO SET EXTREMELY STRICT AND RIGID LIMITS ON SOLO® EVENTS REGARDING SPEED AND/OR COURSE DIMENSIONS. HOWEVER, IT IS NOT THE INTENT OF THESE RULES TO OUTLAW EVENT SITES WHICH CANNOT ACCOMMODATE A COURSE OF CERTAIN STATED DIMENSIONS OR CREATE THE IMPRESSION THAT, SO LONG AS SOME “MAGIC” SPEED LIMIT IS NOT EXCEEDED, THESE RULES ARE ADHERED TO.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 21,543
Likes: 3,216
From: Park City Utah
Just as a tangential clarification, there is no SCCA rule or NCCC rule that you can't use 3rd gear, or that you can't design a course the entails the use of 3rd gear in most cars. I'm the Safety Chief for the St. Louis Region SCCA Solo program (god help us all!), so I am familiar with course design rules (I have to approve every course we have for safety). The SCCA rulebook (Section 2.2.A.) says:
Not allowing 3rd gear would be a ridiculous rule. If someone in the Utah Region is saying that's the rule, then you should suggest they ask Mike Carpenter, Mark Cornelius, Tracy Pitkin, or some of the other group that attend national events!
Not allowing 3rd gear would be a ridiculous rule. If someone in the Utah Region is saying that's the rule, then you should suggest they ask Mike Carpenter, Mark Cornelius, Tracy Pitkin, or some of the other group that attend national events!
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 6,086
Likes: 1,972
From: St. Charles MO
I blame our road rules and driver (lack of) training system in the US for this. We get hammered with the message that speed kills, and yet almost nobody understands how to actually control a car or what actually destabilizes it. So we get idiotic chicanes, kinks, and slaloms where people worry about proximity to objects (fences, timer lights, light poles, etc), which leads to accidents. In one season as Safety Chief, I've literally made our course designer and setup guys remove slaloms before the finish at three events (so far).
Safety Car
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,752
Likes: 190
From: Indiana PA
The average car insee at an autocross is a miata or maybe s2000. Some fiat Abarth, mini cooper's, etc. May be based on location, but when i was doing autocrosses, it was basically for miata guys, by miata guys. Compared tho this ears, a c4 is a large and powerful vehicle, lol.
It was one of the things that led me to do more road courses than autocross, the courses they laid out just weren't fun, road courses were. YMMV of course.
It was one of the things that led me to do more road courses than autocross, the courses they laid out just weren't fun, road courses were. YMMV of course.
North Hills Sports Car Club's lot and the former Wyotech campus in Blairsville, PA. My C4 was hard to beat. The guys that could on occasion.....many have gone on to win jackets and trophies.
Shoot Steel Cities Region had 3 NEW Champions crowned in Lincoln, NE this year. ESP Ben Edminston, AS Jake Glover-22nd in PAX!!!, SSC Mike Fercheck. Not to mention Sam Strano won another FS Championship. If I drive my Camaro right I'm only a few tenths slower than he is on a 30 second course in the same car.
A well setup C4 isn't going to win but its far from slow in capable hands.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 823
Likes: 106
From: Somewhere near Fort Wayne, Indiana
I ran a 96 auto for a couple races. It was my bad luck to have been in the morning group, which meant that all the grit and parking lot gunk hadn't been knocked off the course yet, and despite newish tires I had a hard time keeping the rear end behind the car. While not the fastest, it was fun to slide and I'm sure it was entertaining for the course workers.