Dies while driving
Safety Car
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,845
Likes: 30
Thanks guys! I replaced the ICM this morning and I ran down the coast highway with the top down!
You were right its a pretty simple fix and only $54 for the part.
This forum has gotten me through a couple of jams, still learning about this car and motor.
Thanks again,
Jeff
You were right its a pretty simple fix and only $54 for the part.
This forum has gotten me through a couple of jams, still learning about this car and motor.
Thanks again,
Jeff
Thread Starter
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 97
Likes: 2
From: Carlsbad Ca
died again
Ran great for about 2 weeks. Until yesterday, wife I and went for a cruise got about a mile and click, I am coasting. Pull it over and car wont start. It turns over but wont start. Towed it home, pushed it in the garage.
My buddy says tighten down the battery cable, and it starts. But it makes no sense. I had power for lights and windows but it wouldnt start. It cant be the battery cables?
Could the batter cables being loose or dirty cause the computer to fail?
I still hear in the back of my head, puel pump.
I dont have a code reader and dont want to tow it to a dealership, I guess I just dont want to pay a dealership.
My buddy says tighten down the battery cable, and it starts. But it makes no sense. I had power for lights and windows but it wouldnt start. It cant be the battery cables?
Could the batter cables being loose or dirty cause the computer to fail?
I still hear in the back of my head, puel pump.
I dont have a code reader and dont want to tow it to a dealership, I guess I just dont want to pay a dealership.
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 4,088
Likes: 0
From: Poop land
I think you would have to check if you have fuel pressure. I'd try to drive around monitoring it for awhile. It should be around 40-45 psi.
Check to see if you are getting spark. Since you replaced the ICM, your ignition coil or pick up coil could be going.
Check to see if you are getting reference pulses from the distributer. If the ECM sees none, the car won't start.
Check to see if you are getting pulses from the injectors with a test light when cranking. One shorted injector could prevent you from starting it up since it would be drawing all the current.
Don't we all love those intermittent problems...
Check to see if you are getting spark. Since you replaced the ICM, your ignition coil or pick up coil could be going.
Check to see if you are getting reference pulses from the distributer. If the ECM sees none, the car won't start.
Check to see if you are getting pulses from the injectors with a test light when cranking. One shorted injector could prevent you from starting it up since it would be drawing all the current.
Don't we all love those intermittent problems...
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 8,753
Likes: 9
From: Louisiana
I would now make sure the battery has a full charge and clean the battery cable contacts on the battery and engine ground. A low battery or poor connection can cause the problem you are seeing. The SYS light you see is more likely caused by a low battery. Though other things can cause it as well. No do not take it to a dealership...we can help you solve it if you are willing to work on it. Check/clean the connections at the alternator also.
As for the fuel pump...like I stated before, you need a fuel pressure guage to diagnose the pump. You state no signs of a fuel problem with the information you have given so far. After cleaning the battery cables and charging the battery, when you reconnect everything it will reset the ECM and the SYS should be gone.
As for the fuel pump...like I stated before, you need a fuel pressure guage to diagnose the pump. You state no signs of a fuel problem with the information you have given so far. After cleaning the battery cables and charging the battery, when you reconnect everything it will reset the ECM and the SYS should be gone.
Thread Starter
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 97
Likes: 2
From: Carlsbad Ca
Great! I am checking all the cables and cleaning them up now now. I will charge the battery tonbight, I may replace the Ignition Coil since I have it out again, eliminating another issue.
I can hear the fuel pump when I turn the ignition key, so I know something is working there.
This forum is great, I like working on the car. I just have no experience with a motor like this and limited equipment. Taking a lot of pressure off this rookie.
I can hear the fuel pump when I turn the ignition key, so I know something is working there.
This forum is great, I like working on the car. I just have no experience with a motor like this and limited equipment. Taking a lot of pressure off this rookie.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 97
Likes: 2
From: Carlsbad Ca
Still dies
The tale continues...
I checked all the cables, they look fine. BatterY terminals look fine. I replaced the Ignition Coil, having a few weeks ago replaced the ICM.
Button it up, it fires! Woo hoo! its running, idle for a few seconds, put in reverse, back it out Put it in Drive and it dies. No go, undue the battery cable, reconnect as before it fires right up, put in gear, pull it in the garage. Idle, Reverse and dies. Fires up, put in gear and it dies.....
I am charging the battery right now.... see what happens
I checked all the cables, they look fine. BatterY terminals look fine. I replaced the Ignition Coil, having a few weeks ago replaced the ICM.
Button it up, it fires! Woo hoo! its running, idle for a few seconds, put in reverse, back it out Put it in Drive and it dies. No go, undue the battery cable, reconnect as before it fires right up, put in gear, pull it in the garage. Idle, Reverse and dies. Fires up, put in gear and it dies.....
I am charging the battery right now.... see what happens
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,002
Likes: 5
From: No Opti Here Tn
St. Jude Donor '06
There have got to be some CF brothers out there near this poor guy who can help him with this
Carlsbad, Ca
Dont know where it is but I know its not close or else we would have it hooked up to the F-150 and pulled over here
Come on Lets show the power of the C4 community and get this fixed
BTW sounds like a ground to me
Carlsbad, Ca
Dont know where it is but I know its not close or else we would have it hooked up to the F-150 and pulled over here
Come on Lets show the power of the C4 community and get this fixed
BTW sounds like a ground to me
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Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 4,088
Likes: 0
From: Poop land
Check for vacuum leaks. They could be from the EVAP and back, to the cruise control. Does the car idle high and/or surge? So when you are putting it in gear, does pressing the gas pedal do nothing to stop it from dying?
Does the car idle roughly before it stalls? Will pushing the gas pedal help prevent it from stalling?
Check and see if you TPS voltage is set correctly. Is your TPS sticking?
Check to see if your IAC is working properly. It could be fouled up and a cause of stalling.
I'd also check to see if your MAP sensor is working properly. If its bad, it would need to be replaced.
Is the EGR valve sticking open? Block the EGR pipe and see if it can idle. Too much EGR or EGR at idle will cause a stall out or a rough running engine.
Even if the fuel pump is heard from inside the car, could it not be pushing enough fuel pressure?
Are your cats in good shape?
Does the car idle roughly before it stalls? Will pushing the gas pedal help prevent it from stalling?
Check and see if you TPS voltage is set correctly. Is your TPS sticking?
Check to see if your IAC is working properly. It could be fouled up and a cause of stalling.
I'd also check to see if your MAP sensor is working properly. If its bad, it would need to be replaced.
Is the EGR valve sticking open? Block the EGR pipe and see if it can idle. Too much EGR or EGR at idle will cause a stall out or a rough running engine.
Even if the fuel pump is heard from inside the car, could it not be pushing enough fuel pressure?
Are your cats in good shape?
Burning Brakes
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,211
Likes: 2
From: Dumas Arkansas
I've come to the conclusion that if I can't figure it out with any SES light, asking questions here, or reading thru the manuals then I'll probably never figure it out. So I take her to the local non GM wrench. 50 bucks later I’m on the road again. Any other problem I've ever had usually takes a day maybe two instead of 2 months for me to sit there and grind at it every night after work. But then again we know exactly what you’re going thru and that’s the fun part of it. Be careful though these cars when running right are just as addicting as ones not running sitting in your driveway. 
Thread Starter
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 97
Likes: 2
From: Carlsbad Ca
The car was actually idling great after I replaced the ignition coil yesterday. I let run a bit was able to put it in gear, but it died.
Again I have limited equipment, no testing equipment of any kind.
Fortunately everything so far has been inexpensive and relativly easy to replace. The MAP sensor I see, and can easily replace as well. Probably the IAC if I can find it and the EGR not exactly sure where it sits either.
The hunt contiues! Thanks guys,
Again I have limited equipment, no testing equipment of any kind.
Fortunately everything so far has been inexpensive and relativly easy to replace. The MAP sensor I see, and can easily replace as well. Probably the IAC if I can find it and the EGR not exactly sure where it sits either.
The hunt contiues! Thanks guys,
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 4,088
Likes: 0
From: Poop land
IAC is the big 32mm hex nut looking thing under the TB, screwed into a port. It has 4 wires connected to it. It will get dirtied up with carbon at times. I'd think about removing it and cleaning it up a little.
The EGR is the little pipe on the passenger's side that leads from the exhaust manifold to the intake manifold. It should have some insulation around it. Unbolt that pipe from the exhaust manifold, block it off with a sheet of metal cut to shape and bolt it back in with that piece of metal in place and check to see it it will still die in gear.
Now if the car feels like its about to stall, could you prevent the car from stalling by feathering the gas pedal a bit? Or does pressing the gas pedal have no effect? Or does it just die when you press it?
:
The EGR is the little pipe on the passenger's side that leads from the exhaust manifold to the intake manifold. It should have some insulation around it. Unbolt that pipe from the exhaust manifold, block it off with a sheet of metal cut to shape and bolt it back in with that piece of metal in place and check to see it it will still die in gear.
Now if the car feels like its about to stall, could you prevent the car from stalling by feathering the gas pedal a bit? Or does pressing the gas pedal have no effect? Or does it just die when you press it?
:
Thread Starter
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 97
Likes: 2
From: Carlsbad Ca
Feathering the gas does not really help, it still dies and its an Auto so dumping in gear just kills it.
This morning I fired it up and it idles great, put in gear, dead.
I got a hold of a cheap reader. But I get either a steady check engine light and System flashing 1 - 2 or in Engine I get the engine flashing a 1 - 2.
This morning I fired it up and it idles great, put in gear, dead.
I got a hold of a cheap reader. But I get either a steady check engine light and System flashing 1 - 2 or in Engine I get the engine flashing a 1 - 2.
Thread Starter
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 97
Likes: 2
From: Carlsbad Ca
IAC is out and in my hands, not sure what I am looking for here. But, there was no O-Ring or Gasket. It appears the master mechanic before me used some white loctite tape...
The ERG seems pretty straight forward. Just can not break the bolts loose.
We must be getting close!
The ERG seems pretty straight forward. Just can not break the bolts loose.
We must be getting close!
Last edited by beefC4; Jan 25, 2007 at 07:47 PM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 8,753
Likes: 9
From: Louisiana
Make sure to install the IAC with the tip of the pintle no further than 1 1/8" from the flange. There is no o-ring on it, but does have a round gasket. You might have to make one from gasket paper from an autoparts store. The IAC gasket itself is hard to find and I have found noone that sells it. Clean the IAC windings and inside where the IAC goes with TB cleaner. Also clean out the TB good with a tooth brush.
What is the RPM at idle? What is the TPS voltage?
It would be nice to put a scan tool on the ECM to view sensor function.
What is the RPM at idle? What is the TPS voltage?
It would be nice to put a scan tool on the ECM to view sensor function.
Thread Starter
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 97
Likes: 2
From: Carlsbad Ca
Update
IAC looked OK, I cleaned it up a bit. Some grime on the spring and around the pin. Put back in the car. Lot of gas smell at first and some out the pipe, I assume from screwing around with the TB. OF course it died in gear.
So I let it idle for at least 10 minutes. Gas smell gone, couple puddles of water under the mufflers, I assume just condensation. I put in gear, still running. back and forth to R and D, hold my foot on brake and let it stand in D so far so good...
Since I am home and my "push the car back in the garage buddies" are at work. I am going to wait to run it. (no *****)
If you see anything else, here let me know. You guys have been GREAT! Will update you this weekend when I try to run it.
Thanks
Jeff
So I let it idle for at least 10 minutes. Gas smell gone, couple puddles of water under the mufflers, I assume just condensation. I put in gear, still running. back and forth to R and D, hold my foot on brake and let it stand in D so far so good...
Since I am home and my "push the car back in the garage buddies" are at work. I am going to wait to run it. (no *****)
If you see anything else, here let me know. You guys have been GREAT! Will update you this weekend when I try to run it.
Thanks
Jeff
Thread Starter
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 97
Likes: 2
From: Carlsbad Ca
Time to tow...
Man it idles great, backed it out, down the driveway...dies. Started up and drove back in the garage. Put in R and it dies again.
So, its getting a tow some time this week.
Thanks for all the help!
Jeff
So, its getting a tow some time this week.
Thanks for all the help!
Jeff
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 4,088
Likes: 0
From: Poop land
So is the car dying unexpectedly when on throttle, hot or cold regardless? Or is it dying once you put it in gear? Is it possible to get the car to idle in gear with the throttle barely feathered?