Impact bar shims
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,290
Likes: 140
From: Salem NH
I always align the hood to the doors, and then the front bumper to the hood. My 95 has a little bit different #25, and I can't remember exactly how it is behind the bumper. All the assemblies I have off, are the earlier style as pictured. It may be the clips are on the bumper cover,if that is all there is. It's been a couple of years since I've had the 95 or 6's apart. If that is the case, I would adjust the #25 untill it aligns with the front of the hood all the way across with out the cover on. Put the cover on without the corners, and adjust with shims, then put the corners and the rest of the screws on, tighten and refine. If the car has been hit, you might need different shims on either side and maybe top to bottom to compensate for slightly mis-aligned frame horns. Check to make sure the area where the four bolts come out of the impact bar aren't cracked or crushed so as to move when you tighten up the asm, same with the front plate on the frame horns.
I ordered some more shims from GM and will continue tinkering when they get in. The car was tapped on the left side. think thats why the hood was set back. It was a 5-10mph collision, but I could tell it was tapped cuz the hood was set back and the horn was bent a hair. i straightened all that out yesterday.
I looked at a few 92-96 cars last night and they all seem to be a little off. Like the diameter of the gap between the cover and front of hood is different than the gap on the sides, and the cover doesn't appear to line up perfectly with the wheel well arch. perhaps mine is not as bad as I think, and they are all just a little bit goofy.
Thanks for the help!
-- Joe
Racer
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 443
Likes: 0
From: Pueblo Colorado
To start off your #25 needs to be riveted to the back side of the facia so that the little bolts (#6) pass through #9 and the facia into #25. You can not get a good alignment untill you get the lower impact bar (#11) mounted properly to the frame so that the lower bars(#13,15 and another not shown in your diagram) and skid plate (#21)pull the facia back up to help hold the gap. The biggest problem i had was getting #9 mounted to the top of the impact bar in a nice straight line. If any of the parts you are using (#25, #9, #11, or #22) are off by a little bit from even the slightest impact you will never get any-thing lined up straight.
After fighting all this for over 3months i still say get the fiberglass nose... But alot of patience and taking it apart over and over will show you how to get the alignment eventually.
I wish that i could get my paws on the assembly line manuals for the nose to see how they did it... It must have been a long learning curve for the couple of installers who did this.
When i can get to my garage again from the snow piled up i will get you a good measurement from the corners of #9 to the hood. That should get you VERY close on the shim question. Only use the large flat shims to get each side lined up unless you have some bending in the frame horns (#3)to address for up and down alignment. You will probably have to leave the 4 nuts going through #3 slightly loose(so you can bang it the impact bar up and down) on one install to get the hight right to the hood and top of facia... Hopefully not though.
Good luck.
After fighting all this for over 3months i still say get the fiberglass nose... But alot of patience and taking it apart over and over will show you how to get the alignment eventually.
I wish that i could get my paws on the assembly line manuals for the nose to see how they did it... It must have been a long learning curve for the couple of installers who did this.
When i can get to my garage again from the snow piled up i will get you a good measurement from the corners of #9 to the hood. That should get you VERY close on the shim question. Only use the large flat shims to get each side lined up unless you have some bending in the frame horns (#3)to address for up and down alignment. You will probably have to leave the 4 nuts going through #3 slightly loose(so you can bang it the impact bar up and down) on one install to get the hight right to the hood and top of facia... Hopefully not though.
Good luck.
Race Director
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 10,691
Likes: 71
From: Phoenix Arizona
After thinking about this today, I thought I'd add a little about the hood alignment. When I align the hood to the doors, I not only adjust for a certain gap(Hood frt to rear), but also for an even gap between the top and bottom of the rear of the hood.(This is done by adjusting the front of the hood up or down by using shims under the hinge.) Only after that is done, along with adjusting the hood latches do I adjust the front bumper.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,290
Likes: 140
From: Salem NH
To start off your #25 needs to be riveted to the back side of the facia so that the little bolts (#6) pass through #9 and the facia into #25. You can not get a good alignment untill you get the lower impact bar (#11) mounted properly to the frame so that the lower bars(#13,15 and another not shown in your diagram) and skid plate (#21)pull the facia back up to help hold the gap. The biggest problem i had was getting #9 mounted to the top of the impact bar in a nice straight line. If any of the parts you are using (#25, #9, #11, or #22) are off by a little bit from even the slightest impact you will never get any-thing lined up straight.
After fighting all this for over 3months i still say get the fiberglass nose... But alot of patience and taking it apart over and over will show you how to get the alignment eventually.
I wish that i could get my paws on the assembly line manuals for the nose to see how they did it... It must have been a long learning curve for the couple of installers who did this.
When i can get to my garage again from the snow piled up i will get you a good measurement from the corners of #9 to the hood. That should get you VERY close on the shim question. Only use the large flat shims to get each side lined up unless you have some bending in the frame horns (#3)to address for up and down alignment. You will probably have to leave the 4 nuts going through #3 slightly loose(so you can bang it the impact bar up and down) on one install to get the hight right to the hood and top of facia... Hopefully not though.
Good luck.
After fighting all this for over 3months i still say get the fiberglass nose... But alot of patience and taking it apart over and over will show you how to get the alignment eventually.
I wish that i could get my paws on the assembly line manuals for the nose to see how they did it... It must have been a long learning curve for the couple of installers who did this.
When i can get to my garage again from the snow piled up i will get you a good measurement from the corners of #9 to the hood. That should get you VERY close on the shim question. Only use the large flat shims to get each side lined up unless you have some bending in the frame horns (#3)to address for up and down alignment. You will probably have to leave the 4 nuts going through #3 slightly loose(so you can bang it the impact bar up and down) on one install to get the hight right to the hood and top of facia... Hopefully not though.
Good luck.
So #25 is threaded? That makes a lot of sense. I was using 6mm body clips. hrmm.
I better order that tomorrow.
Im starting to wonder if the bumper cover is aftermarket. inside it sais "chevrolet corvette" but it's made out of a black rubbermade type plastic, where as the back bumper cover is yellow eurathane.
Thanks guys!
-- Joe
Racer
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 443
Likes: 0
From: Pueblo Colorado
Actually mine is black inside also. If you think about it it makes sense... Since some of the inside of the facia is visable when the hood is up it is easier to mold them all black than to add another paint process to the line.
Instead of using the stock bolts for #6 i decided to buy a big bag of allen head button type bolts in black. This is cleaning up the open hood appearance and i find it easier to loosen and tighten them...A friend of mine tried them and said he thought it was harder to tighten them though... It is just personal preferance. I wish that i still had the box of the rivets needed to mount the reinforcement/screw bar to the facia. They were a very odd-ball large sized rivet and i can't remember the size to help you find them. I even had to get a large rivet gun to handel the large diameter.
I am trying to get my camera charged to get you some pics... But like i said before i can't get to my garage right now due to snow drifts. I will try to post them on my tripod site later this week, if i can even take some.
Do the ends of your facia seem too narrow on the hood like mine did? That drove me crazy... I had to use hot water to soften the nose while pulling out on the #19 bracket to try to get the extra 1/4" on both sides. The problem is that that has rusulted in a slight curving down in the top of the facia that i realy don't like and haven't gotten fixed yet. By the way, that #19 has to be sqeezed behind the facia in front of the bar (#25) in order to get it screwer in tight also. The 2 end screws go through it/them also.
Good-luck.
I have another facia in fiberglass and am still not sure that i wont give in and use it instead of the urethane... I have just done too much to give in now...
Instead of using the stock bolts for #6 i decided to buy a big bag of allen head button type bolts in black. This is cleaning up the open hood appearance and i find it easier to loosen and tighten them...A friend of mine tried them and said he thought it was harder to tighten them though... It is just personal preferance. I wish that i still had the box of the rivets needed to mount the reinforcement/screw bar to the facia. They were a very odd-ball large sized rivet and i can't remember the size to help you find them. I even had to get a large rivet gun to handel the large diameter.
I am trying to get my camera charged to get you some pics... But like i said before i can't get to my garage right now due to snow drifts. I will try to post them on my tripod site later this week, if i can even take some.
Do the ends of your facia seem too narrow on the hood like mine did? That drove me crazy... I had to use hot water to soften the nose while pulling out on the #19 bracket to try to get the extra 1/4" on both sides. The problem is that that has rusulted in a slight curving down in the top of the facia that i realy don't like and haven't gotten fixed yet. By the way, that #19 has to be sqeezed behind the facia in front of the bar (#25) in order to get it screwer in tight also. The 2 end screws go through it/them also.
Good-luck.
I have another facia in fiberglass and am still not sure that i wont give in and use it instead of the urethane... I have just done too much to give in now...
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,290
Likes: 140
From: Salem NH
Actually mine is black inside also. If you think about it it makes sense... Since some of the inside of the facia is visable when the hood is up it is easier to mold them all black than to add another paint process to the line.
Instead of using the stock bolts for #6 i decided to buy a big bag of allen head button type bolts in black. This is cleaning up the open hood appearance and i find it easier to loosen and tighten them...A friend of mine tried them and said he thought it was harder to tighten them though... It is just personal preferance. I wish that i still had the box of the rivets needed to mount the reinforcement/screw bar to the facia. They were a very odd-ball large sized rivet and i can't remember the size to help you find them. I even had to get a large rivet gun to handel the large diameter.
I am trying to get my camera charged to get you some pics... But like i said before i can't get to my garage right now due to snow drifts. I will try to post them on my tripod site later this week, if i can even take some.
Do the ends of your facia seem too narrow on the hood like mine did? That drove me crazy... I had to use hot water to soften the nose while pulling out on the #19 bracket to try to get the extra 1/4" on both sides. The problem is that that has rusulted in a slight curving down in the top of the facia that i realy don't like and haven't gotten fixed yet. By the way, that #19 has to be sqeezed behind the facia in front of the bar (#25) in order to get it screwer in tight also. The 2 end screws go through it/them also.
Good-luck.
I have another facia in fiberglass and am still not sure that i wont give in and use it instead of the urethane... I have just done too much to give in now...
Instead of using the stock bolts for #6 i decided to buy a big bag of allen head button type bolts in black. This is cleaning up the open hood appearance and i find it easier to loosen and tighten them...A friend of mine tried them and said he thought it was harder to tighten them though... It is just personal preferance. I wish that i still had the box of the rivets needed to mount the reinforcement/screw bar to the facia. They were a very odd-ball large sized rivet and i can't remember the size to help you find them. I even had to get a large rivet gun to handel the large diameter.
I am trying to get my camera charged to get you some pics... But like i said before i can't get to my garage right now due to snow drifts. I will try to post them on my tripod site later this week, if i can even take some.
Do the ends of your facia seem too narrow on the hood like mine did? That drove me crazy... I had to use hot water to soften the nose while pulling out on the #19 bracket to try to get the extra 1/4" on both sides. The problem is that that has rusulted in a slight curving down in the top of the facia that i realy don't like and haven't gotten fixed yet. By the way, that #19 has to be sqeezed behind the facia in front of the bar (#25) in order to get it screwer in tight also. The 2 end screws go through it/them also.
Good-luck.
I have another facia in fiberglass and am still not sure that i wont give in and use it instead of the urethane... I have just done too much to give in now...
I just ordered both #19's today and #25. $197 total with bolts (#6). w00t.
So #19 goes in between #25 and the bumper cover, then the bumper cover goes flush against #9. Correct?
I feel kinda retarded I couldn't figure this out myself.
My bumper cover actually seems a hair wider than the hood. But that might be because I'm missing #25 to straighten it out. The more I think about it, I really have it all goofed and need to get the right parts. I had planned on tightening it and putting in #19 last. Guess those need to go in right away huh. hehe.
On the skid bar plates, #21, can I just order the right ones for 91-96 and bolt them to the car, or do I need all the other 91-96 stuff they bolt too? Cuz the picture on this shows some weird brackets, but on my '87 it has like tube shaped brackets. ?
Thanks!
-- Joe
Last edited by anesthes; Jan 2, 2007 at 10:55 AM.
Racer
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 443
Likes: 0
From: Pueblo Colorado
Unfortunately you do need the lower crash bar for the skid plates to get to right alignment. The tube/bracket missing in your diagram is the only one you reuse from the 87 set-up... so at least you don't have to buy it. Yes you need the skid plates from the 91 up(my parts manual only goes to 93 so i am uncertain if they changed them later). But you will need #11, 13 & 15 along with the one(each side) from your 87 to get it mounted right.
On the lower crash bar, #11, you will find that your 87 only has 2 of the bolt holes in place. I drilled out the other 2 and tacked in nuts (a very hard job) to get all 4 in. It looks solid enough to forgo the extra 2 bolts though, if you don't feel like killing yourself doing them... I am just a little into overkill on this build.
If you search eBay you can find #11 with at least the #13s attached to save some cash.
On the lower crash bar, #11, you will find that your 87 only has 2 of the bolt holes in place. I drilled out the other 2 and tacked in nuts (a very hard job) to get all 4 in. It looks solid enough to forgo the extra 2 bolts though, if you don't feel like killing yourself doing them... I am just a little into overkill on this build.
If you search eBay you can find #11 with at least the #13s attached to save some cash.
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Racer
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 443
Likes: 0
From: Pueblo Colorado
Here is one i found real quick,
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/91-92...spagenameZWDVW
These skid plates look different than what i used though,
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1993-...spagenameZWDVW
Maybe there are 2 different types??? I will try to get to garage to look for certain.
This is the one that you reuse from your 87,
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/C-4-C...spagenameZWDVW
I hope this helps you out.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/91-92...spagenameZWDVW
These skid plates look different than what i used though,
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1993-...spagenameZWDVW
Maybe there are 2 different types??? I will try to get to garage to look for certain.
This is the one that you reuse from your 87,
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/C-4-C...spagenameZWDVW
I hope this helps you out.
Racer
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 443
Likes: 0
From: Pueblo Colorado
Some-one tell me how i can do some-thing like this for mine???
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/CORVE...spagenameZWDVW
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/CORVE...spagenameZWDVW
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,290
Likes: 140
From: Salem NH
Here is one i found real quick,
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/91-92...spagenameZWDVW
These skid plates look different than what i used though,
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1993-...spagenameZWDVW
Maybe there are 2 different types??? I will try to get to garage to look for certain.
This is the one that you reuse from your 87,
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/C-4-C...spagenameZWDVW
I hope this helps you out.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/91-92...spagenameZWDVW
These skid plates look different than what i used though,
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1993-...spagenameZWDVW
Maybe there are 2 different types??? I will try to get to garage to look for certain.
This is the one that you reuse from your 87,
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/C-4-C...spagenameZWDVW
I hope this helps you out.
Thanks for the info! I don't get why GM changed soo much.
-- Joe
Racer
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 443
Likes: 0
From: Pueblo Colorado
Well, I finnally got into my garage today and took you some pics and looked things over real close. Please don't get mad but i made a mistake, You don't need #15 on the skid plates.
The reason the skid plates on ebay looked wrong was that the have #13 from your diagram attached.
I don't understand what mean by welding ears. The 87 skidplate bolts horizontal to the impact bar while 91up bolt verticaly to gain clearance for the facia to wrap around them i tried to get a pic of mine in the car but there was no room with-out removing the facia. Try these pics; http://todd-vette.tripod.com/mycarpics/index.album?i=15
http://todd-vette.tripod.com/mycarpics/index.album?i=14
I tried to show the impact bar upright mount(#9) and the upper facia side brace(#19) in this pic,
http://todd-vette.tripod.com/mycarpics/index.album?i=12 &
http://todd-vette.tripod.com/mycarpics/index.album?i=13
You should look at these as well since you will start to see how the inner fender mounting was changed also,
http://todd-vette.tripod.com/mycarpics/index.album?i=16
http://todd-vette.tripod.com/mycarpics/index.album?i=23
http://todd-vette.tripod.com/mycarpics/index.album?i=24
Unfortunately this also means changing the hood hood support strut and some custom welding on the passanger side to extend the support out to the next bolt hole.
I got aproximately 11/16" from front of impact bar upright to the leading edge of the hood. Taken at each end of #9. This gave me 3/16" gap to facia.
I hope this helps some.
I gave serious thought to trying to make up a custom skid plate with wheels like above to reach down to the bottom of the ground effects going on the nose...I finnaly came back to reality though.
This job will drive you nuts!
THESE PICS WERE CHANGED TO NEW ONES FOR SPACE REASONS!
The reason the skid plates on ebay looked wrong was that the have #13 from your diagram attached.
I don't understand what mean by welding ears. The 87 skidplate bolts horizontal to the impact bar while 91up bolt verticaly to gain clearance for the facia to wrap around them i tried to get a pic of mine in the car but there was no room with-out removing the facia. Try these pics; http://todd-vette.tripod.com/mycarpics/index.album?i=15
http://todd-vette.tripod.com/mycarpics/index.album?i=14
I tried to show the impact bar upright mount(#9) and the upper facia side brace(#19) in this pic,
http://todd-vette.tripod.com/mycarpics/index.album?i=12 &
http://todd-vette.tripod.com/mycarpics/index.album?i=13
You should look at these as well since you will start to see how the inner fender mounting was changed also,
http://todd-vette.tripod.com/mycarpics/index.album?i=16
http://todd-vette.tripod.com/mycarpics/index.album?i=23
http://todd-vette.tripod.com/mycarpics/index.album?i=24
Unfortunately this also means changing the hood hood support strut and some custom welding on the passanger side to extend the support out to the next bolt hole.
I got aproximately 11/16" from front of impact bar upright to the leading edge of the hood. Taken at each end of #9. This gave me 3/16" gap to facia.
I hope this helps some.
I gave serious thought to trying to make up a custom skid plate with wheels like above to reach down to the bottom of the ground effects going on the nose...I finnaly came back to reality though.
This job will drive you nuts!
THESE PICS WERE CHANGED TO NEW ONES FOR SPACE REASONS!
Last edited by todd_vette; Jan 15, 2007 at 07:10 PM.
Racer
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 443
Likes: 0
From: Pueblo Colorado
Anestes/Joe,
Let Me know when you are done with the pics so that i can switch them out with others i need to show on my rear-end install. Thanks.
Did you get all your answers from my confussing posts? Or do i need to make a better atempt?
Let Me know when you are done with the pics so that i can switch them out with others i need to show on my rear-end install. Thanks.
Did you get all your answers from my confussing posts? Or do i need to make a better atempt?
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,290
Likes: 140
From: Salem NH
Yes I'm done with the pics, and thank you for posting them. I got it all now, and appreciate your feedback. i've ordered all the parts, and hopefully will get this together sooner (than later).
-- Joe
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,290
Likes: 140
From: Salem NH
I've got it all together.
I used a buddy's snap-on air powered rivet gun to do the #25 to the crash bar. Everything is together and aligned, using all flat plates. Gap looks great!
I'm confused about what you said about the skid plates. I ordered 2 #21's from the dealer, they were like $13 each. They bolted to the bottom of the impact bar, and to the linkage that my old 1987 parts bolted to. I didn't need any additional components. Why did you? I used part #'s from a 1991. I wonder if maybe they changed them in later years, and you used the later model parts?
I have the front part of the inner fenders, but don't have the center or rears, or any of the brackets + hood support. I think what i'm gonna do is use some cardboard to mock up some adapters and make some out of fiberglass. Bolt paint 'em flat black and bolt 'em in, and nobody will know.
All and all it's coming along. I'm hoping to paint it within the next two weeks now that everything 'fits' together.
Thanks for the help!
-- Joe
I used a buddy's snap-on air powered rivet gun to do the #25 to the crash bar. Everything is together and aligned, using all flat plates. Gap looks great!
I'm confused about what you said about the skid plates. I ordered 2 #21's from the dealer, they were like $13 each. They bolted to the bottom of the impact bar, and to the linkage that my old 1987 parts bolted to. I didn't need any additional components. Why did you? I used part #'s from a 1991. I wonder if maybe they changed them in later years, and you used the later model parts?
I have the front part of the inner fenders, but don't have the center or rears, or any of the brackets + hood support. I think what i'm gonna do is use some cardboard to mock up some adapters and make some out of fiberglass. Bolt paint 'em flat black and bolt 'em in, and nobody will know.
All and all it's coming along. I'm hoping to paint it within the next two weeks now that everything 'fits' together.
Thanks for the help!
-- Joe
Racer
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 443
Likes: 0
From: Pueblo Colorado
Well, I finnally got into my garage today and took you some pics and looked things over real close. Please don't get mad but i made a mistake, You don't need #15 on the skid plates
I am sorry that i made that mistake before posting the change...There was ALOT of confusion durring this build of what would be re-used and what needed to be replaces...I just forgot that that was one of the changes untill i got to look at it. I hope that you can return them...I know most will not let you on special order. That is why i posted the change as soon as i saw it...Usually you can get get your money back if you don't accept/pick-up the part from the counter.
I wish that mine was going to paint soon...I am begining to wonder if it ever will.
Racer
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 443
Likes: 0
From: Pueblo Colorado
I used a buddy's snap-on air powered rivet gun to do the #25 to the crash bar. Everything is together and aligned, using all flat plates.
#9 bolts to the impact bar. The bolts pass through #9 into #25????
I hope that you just miss-typed this.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,290
Likes: 140
From: Salem NH
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,290
Likes: 140
From: Salem NH
.
I am sorry that i made that mistake before posting the change...There was ALOT of confusion durring this build of what would be re-used and what needed to be replaces...I just forgot that that was one of the changes untill i got to look at it. I hope that you can return them...I know most will not let you on special order. That is why i posted the change as soon as i saw it...Usually you can get get your money back if you don't accept/pick-up the part from the counter.
I wish that mine was going to paint soon...I am begining to wonder if it ever will.
I am sorry that i made that mistake before posting the change...There was ALOT of confusion durring this build of what would be re-used and what needed to be replaces...I just forgot that that was one of the changes untill i got to look at it. I hope that you can return them...I know most will not let you on special order. That is why i posted the change as soon as i saw it...Usually you can get get your money back if you don't accept/pick-up the part from the counter.
I wish that mine was going to paint soon...I am begining to wonder if it ever will.
I didn't order anything extra.
-- Joe
Race Director
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 12,107
Likes: 50
From: SW Michigan
your working on a 87 bumper via these pictures?
I have my front bumper off and I can take some pictures for you my car is a 90
9 is attatched to the impact bar, when you put the bumper cover over the impact bar you thread the bolts through #25 it is only a support like a sandwich it is not rivited to the bumper or its not on my bumper.
let me know if you need some pics or if you have it all together then so be it!
johnny
I have my front bumper off and I can take some pictures for you my car is a 90
9 is attatched to the impact bar, when you put the bumper cover over the impact bar you thread the bolts through #25 it is only a support like a sandwich it is not rivited to the bumper or its not on my bumper.
let me know if you need some pics or if you have it all together then so be it!
johnny