Yep. I originally thought it would come up over the driver side when I was talking to CC about this, but it comes up in the dead center. If you put a straight stick in a clocked bell housing it comes up in your leg

-- Joe

 

I must have made a mistake in a measurement, because I'm coming up an inch off for the cbeam holes in the adapter. the T5 w/ bell housing measures 31 inches which is what I thought the 700R4 did - but the 700R4 must have been 30 inches.

The driveshaft can be installed, but was VERY VERY tight getting the ujoint to seat in the yoke. I'm probably going to cut an inch off the driveshaft just to be safe.

Anyhow, the cbeam adapter is on it's way back to pro street for final modification and then we're done. I should have it back by the end of next week, for final fitting.

-- Joe

 

The cbeam is going to prostreet, or the adapter is going to prostreet?

BTW, have you thought about how to disable the reverse-lockout on the ignition switch?

 

The adapter is on it's way back.

Reverse-lockout on the ignition switch? I'm using an automatic column, so other than disconnecting the cable i'm doing nothing. This is how i've done the swaps fbody's in the past.

Someone might jump up and say "you need to have a button on the ignition so you can't lock it while your driving". My 2007 Aveo doesn't have such a button, however if your really worried you can get manual-lock cylinder with a lever.

-- Joe

 

I thought disconnecting the cable would permanently lock the key in. I remember reading on Keisler's instructions for their swap (I could be wrong) that you have to lock the cable out. Anyone back me up on this one?

I don't have a button. The only way to turn the key completely off is to put the lever in reverse. That's what prevents you from accidentally locking the wheel. I'm not worried about accidentally locking the wheel. I just want to make sure I can get the ignition key in and out...

 

I never had a problem. The cable (on an auto) locks you from being able to turn the key all the way back unless it's in park. If you disconnect the cable in the park position, you should be fine.

Now with your setup being a stick, your going to have to disconnect it with the cable in the reverse position.

-- Joe

 

The only other thing I might have him change if possible, is to move the cbeam bolt spacing closer to the inside of the transmission. If you look at this picture, they are a bit farther out. It still bolts in since the torque arm even when bolted in the rear can swing side to side a few inches, but it almost rubs the transmission tunnel. (though thats probably not a problem, I don't like it)

-- Joe

http://members.cisdi.com/~anesthes/f...5/700r4-t5.jpg

 

I ended up buying a Dana44 driveshaft from vette2vette. Jason charged me $65 shipped, which is a pretty good deal I think. This solves the problem on a 700R4 to T5 swap.

For you folks with 4+3 cars, you have two options.

If you review Joby's site, he had the same inssue I ran into when he did a Dana44 swap. What he did was put the driveshaft in first, then jacked the tranny up a little and bolted the cbeam.

http://joby.se/corvette/mods/2001-0X11_diff/

You can do this, or if you are uncomfortable you can have your driveshaft shortened.

Even if your swapping from a 700R4 to a T5, you can do it Joby's way, but for the price of a D44 driveshaft why not? Doesn't add a whole lot to the cost.

I've also learned a lot more about offset shifters. Apparently you can use a mcleod shifter with a 2" offset rather than modifying a fbody shifter. You can even run a hurst shifter for a mustang T5, with an offset stick (for putting rail-shifted T5s in cars that had top loaders) by redrilling the front two holes just a hair back.

Check out the swap page from time to time for updates:

http://members.cisdi.com/~anesthes/f-car-t5/

I'll often do a step 3-4 times until I've found the best way, they document it and take pictures.

-- Joe

 

Where can I purchase a McLeod offset shifter? Do I have to contact them directly? Or, where would I get a Mustang T5 shifter?

As for the driveshaft, I assume you can use a D44 driveshaft on an originally 4+3 car for this swap the same as you could use it in a car that was originally an auto? If I were to have my driveshaft shortened, how much shorter does it need to be?

As a side note, I am picking up a supposedly good WC T5 from a 90 Firebird later this week for 50 bucks, complete with bellhousing/shifter/etc.


Oh, yeah, is the CBeam adapter back from ProStreet yet? Have they worked out the kinks and moved the holes? I'm ready to purchase one from them as soon as it's comemrcially available...

 

You can contact mcleod directly. Tell them you have a T5, and need
the 2" offset shifter. The shifter location in the C4 actually is not that uncommon. When researching things I found more folks putting T5's in cars/trucks/jeeps/golf carts than I ever imagined.

The Dana36 driveshaft is 33inches. The Dana44 driveshaft is 32inches.
The reason is because the Dana44 is roughly an inch longer. If you have a Dana36 rear end, you can use the Dana44 driveshaft and the clearance ends up being stock. If you have a Dana44 rear end you won't be able to get the driveshaft in with the cbeam bolted up, you just can't get the ujoint to clear the yoke. You need to lower the transmission, bolt the driveshaft, then jack it up and bolt the cbeam in.
This is a PITA, so if you can get the driveshaft shortened by an inch it will be like OEM fit.


Thats what I paid for my T5. Make damn sure it's out of a V8 car, unless you want have a custom clutch made...

Nah, I think it's getting delivered to him today. He's gonna probably need at least until Friday to make the changes I requested. Hopefully he will get it back to me by Tuesday or so, which should be about the same time I get my Dana44 driveshaft from vette2vette.

-- Joe

 

The V8 car has the 26 spline input shaft and the V6 has a different one, right? He said it's the 26 spline shaft so I think it has to be the V8 one.

 

Actually you can run a 11" clutch on any C4 vette flywheel. But of course the 10.75" push type pressure plate won't fit over it. Are there any cheap 11" push type pressure plates?

If your beam holes are off, are you sure your beam is the right one? Remember, the D36 beam is about 1" longer than the D44. The front holes of the beam should be in the same place regardless. The length difference only compensates for the length of the differential casing.

I forgot about checking that driveshaft yoke, I'll look at it when I get home. It's not on the car but I have one in my garage and I'm sure it's got a wear mark on it from the output seal. It sounds like you're saying plus or minus an inch on the driveshaft length is no big deal, but I'm not so sure. The spines inside the yoke don't go the full length of the yoke ID so you're at risk of not having enough spline engagement.

 

The pull-time clutch uses the same mounting holes on the 153 tooth flywheel? Thats interesting. I thought you needed a 'special' flywheel for the ZF..

I'm running a D36 w/ d36 beam. so nothing has changed there. The T5 is apparently just an inch longer than the 700R4 was. But it's also why I can get away with using a D44 driveshaft.

If I ever upgrade to a D44, i'll have to shorten the shaft - but after spending $600+ on gears/parts for my D36, if it breaks I'll trade it in for a C5.


-- Joe

 

Yeah, 26 vs like 14 or something like that. It's not the same as the early v8s either, it's a specific hub.

-- Joe

 

At least shortening the driveshaft is always easier/cheaper than lengthening it. I wonder if there's any junkyard applications that would work.

Yes,there are 3 types of C4 flywheels:
84-85 (2-pc crank seal)
86-88 (1-pc crank seal)
89-96 (Dual Mass)

And 3 types of clutch / pressure plate combos:
84 (10.4")
85-88 (10.75")
89-96 (11" pull type)

Any of the flywheels will work with any of the clutch setups.

 

I guess I've always missunderstood. I read a lot of hype in the FAQ about using singlemass fbody flywheel. If the zf clutch works fine with the stock 4+3 flywheel why all the hype?? Lack of a sprung hub causing more driveline shock?

-- Joe

 

I'm running just a straight-up billet steel aftermarket 2 pc. rear main flywheel, a RAM 10.5" organic clutch disc, and a RAM 3200 pound pressure plate. It's all normal sbc stuff and it works fine with the 4+3 and probably the T5 as well.

I didn't think you could use the ZF clutch stuff because of the hydraulic TOB.

 

It does seem to have an effect compared to my 4+3 with the sprung hub. Although I haven't driven a pull type clutch with the fbody flywheel to compare, so the short travel and higher pressure plate force could be partly to blame. The clutch is a bit more grabby, so it takes a little more finess to engage seemlessly from a standstill. (My car is a bad example, because my throttle body is all screwed up and binds when trying to feather it off idle.)

Basically what it means is if you toss someone your keys they'll probably stall it a few times while getting a feel for it. I haven't noticed any difference while racing.

 

ZF pull type clutch can only be used with the crappy ZF linkage.

On another note, some of those Fbodys have a hydraulic throwoutbearing/slave. Will any of these bolt up inside our bellhousing? I know the ZF bell is a little narrower than the 4+3 bell.

 

Joe, the 4+3/D44 yoke splines stop 1/2" before the front of the yoke. It looks like the output seal was riding almost exactly 1.25" in front of the balancer.

Also the first 1" of the yoke OD ahead of the balancer is pretty rough/rusty. I'm not sure if that means GM didn't polish that part of it, or just that it was shiny there and just corroded from being exposed to the elements for 20+ years.