Timing Chain Set Delimma
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 9,715
Likes: 27
From: Kempner Texas
Timing Chain Set Delimma
I bought a brande new Cloyes True Roller Timing Chain set - 9-3145 - as part of a package deal which included ported AFR heads. Now I find that the only way to run that TC set is to remove all the water pump parts from behind the timing chain cover and install an electric water pump.
WHAT A BUMMER!
So, here I am again, asking, with the EXCEPTION of the LT4 Extreme Duty set, (which I've read so many negative posts about - see I've been doing my homework), what are my options?
The Cloyes 3039 set???
What are you LTx guys running (I don't suspect many are running that $500+ dollar setup CompCams offers).
Thanks for any help.
Jake
WHAT A BUMMER!
So, here I am again, asking, with the EXCEPTION of the LT4 Extreme Duty set, (which I've read so many negative posts about - see I've been doing my homework), what are my options?
The Cloyes 3039 set???
What are you LTx guys running (I don't suspect many are running that $500+ dollar setup CompCams offers).
Thanks for any help.
Jake
Intermediate
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
From: Near Daytona Florida
Been there, done that! I believe the Cloyes 3039 is a link chain timing set. If you want a roller timing set, the Cloyes 3151 is one choice (about $350)! Why not use the 3145 and with the money saved by not buying a different timing set, buy a electric water pump? That's what I did. (Cloyes manufactures the GM parts and GM p/n 12371043 is equivalent to the Cloyes 3145, and can be found new for about $40. Interestingly, the GM 12371043 uses the same crank gear and chain as the Severe Duty timing set!) Mark
Burning Brakes
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 777
Likes: 1
From: Fort Worth Texas
I bought a brande new Cloyes True Roller Timing Chain set - 9-3145 - as part of a package deal which included ported AFR heads. Now I find that the only way to run that TC set is to remove all the water pump parts from behind the timing chain cover and install an electric water pump.
WHAT A BUMMER!
So, here I am again, asking, with the EXCEPTION of the LT4 Extreme Duty set, (which I've read so many negative posts about - see I've been doing my homework), what are my options?
The Cloyes 3039 set???
What are you LTx guys running (I don't suspect many are running that $500+ dollar setup CompCams offers).
Thanks for any help.
Jake
WHAT A BUMMER!
So, here I am again, asking, with the EXCEPTION of the LT4 Extreme Duty set, (which I've read so many negative posts about - see I've been doing my homework), what are my options?
The Cloyes 3039 set???
What are you LTx guys running (I don't suspect many are running that $500+ dollar setup CompCams offers).
Thanks for any help.
Jake
I saw the pictures and read about a few of the Cloyes sets that were not heat treated correctly. I just had my 96 LT4 rebuilt and I used the LT4 ED Single Roller (Cloyce) set. My orginal set was still in good shape after 80,000 hard miles. It has been about 6000 miles now on my new LT4 and no problems(cut open four oil filters after the changes and no metal). Read the same thing about our clutch slaves but I purchased a new AC Delco slave three months ago, removed the the piston only to find my seal was installed correctly. Lucky? We read about just a few bad stories but there are thousands that are just fine. Read about how Melling High Volume standard PSI oil pumps were defective too. Mine is just fine.But I do not Drag race with Slicks or use NOS. Just use the correct parts and have the pick up 1/2 inch off the bottom of the oil pan. I also read you had to have some fab and welding work done to install a electric water pump on a 96 LT4. Fact or BS, don't know on that one. Jim Mason on GS Registry . com runs electric on his 96 LT4 GS. Ping him he surfs here too.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 5,713
Likes: 105
From: Manassas VA
Jake, I have the 3145 set and the electric pump. The cost of the electric pump and 3145 chain set, vs std. LT1 chain set and std. pump works out to about the same or a little less for the electric setup.
IMO the trick to keeping them reliable is to use good wiring and a good relay. I purchased a factory fan relay and plug kit from ecklers. This relay has a few advantages again IMO. First off, the fans pull more amps then the pump will, so its design is plenty heavy. Second, its a factory design, so if it was to die on the road, I can swap one of my fan relays in place to limp home.
Also, there are advantages to the electric pump. For me, its real easy to cool the motor down between rounds at the track using the pump and fans with the motor off. It eliminates the weep hole so leaking on the opti-spark is not going to happen due to the pump. It does free up a small amount of hp in the upper rpms. And finally if it ever does die, its much easier to change it out vs the stock pump.
If you are interested in the relay kit, let me know and I will dig up the part no for you.
IMO the trick to keeping them reliable is to use good wiring and a good relay. I purchased a factory fan relay and plug kit from ecklers. This relay has a few advantages again IMO. First off, the fans pull more amps then the pump will, so its design is plenty heavy. Second, its a factory design, so if it was to die on the road, I can swap one of my fan relays in place to limp home.
Also, there are advantages to the electric pump. For me, its real easy to cool the motor down between rounds at the track using the pump and fans with the motor off. It eliminates the weep hole so leaking on the opti-spark is not going to happen due to the pump. It does free up a small amount of hp in the upper rpms. And finally if it ever does die, its much easier to change it out vs the stock pump.
If you are interested in the relay kit, let me know and I will dig up the part no for you.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,596
Likes: 19
From: Portland Oregon
I have used several GM ED kits in various LTx builds. Knock on wood I have never had a problem. Most of my engines ranged anywhere from near stock to 620+ rear wheel Hp. I have one of the ED sets in my personal blown LT4, its been in there for 4 years and haven't been any problems.
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 9,715
Likes: 27
From: Kempner Texas
Thanks for all the responses guys. Lots of good information in an area that I had ziltch knowledge. This Ltx stuff is like a can of worms.
So it looks like these are my options:
Re-use my existing T/C set (reuse or buy a new stock W/P)
Use the 3145 and install an electric W/P
Buy a 3039 and sell my 3145 (reuse or buy new stock W/P)
Buy a LT4 ED set (reuse or buy a new stock W/P)
Best bet in all of these options is to use a new W/P regardless of whether I go electric or stock.
Jake
So it looks like these are my options:
Re-use my existing T/C set (reuse or buy a new stock W/P)
Use the 3145 and install an electric W/P
Buy a 3039 and sell my 3145 (reuse or buy new stock W/P)
Buy a LT4 ED set (reuse or buy a new stock W/P)
Best bet in all of these options is to use a new W/P regardless of whether I go electric or stock.
Jake
Race Director
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 10,641
Likes: 13
From: Slidell Louisiana
Go with the Mezierre HD electric water pump and don't look back!
The HD flows a little more than the standard mez pump and I have had no problems with coolant temps on long high speed highway runs.
Mike
The HD flows a little more than the standard mez pump and I have had no problems with coolant temps on long high speed highway runs.
Mike
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Pro
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 536
Likes: 0
From: Bardstown Kentucky
Jake,
Here is a little bit of what you are going to get into with the electric pump. You really need a hydraulic press to do this right. You remove the cover from the pump and press the shaft out of the pump. Them press in the supplied freeze plug, the plug covers the weep hole. Since I have mine down so far I knocked the water pump shaft out of the block. Then tapped and plugged the timing chain cover with a 1/2 npt brass plug. To test my plug I filled the cover with trans fluid and let it sit over night, no leaks.
http://s105.photobucket.com/albums/m232/tapyz250/
I cant beleive I tore down a 49,000 mile LT4
Here is a little bit of what you are going to get into with the electric pump. You really need a hydraulic press to do this right. You remove the cover from the pump and press the shaft out of the pump. Them press in the supplied freeze plug, the plug covers the weep hole. Since I have mine down so far I knocked the water pump shaft out of the block. Then tapped and plugged the timing chain cover with a 1/2 npt brass plug. To test my plug I filled the cover with trans fluid and let it sit over night, no leaks.
http://s105.photobucket.com/albums/m232/tapyz250/
I cant beleive I tore down a 49,000 mile LT4
