SunCr

If it was "useless" it wouldn't be there and if you had a solution, you'd wouldn't be here - the OEM's would have showered you with so much cash a C4 would be just a distant memory (or yours would at least be a perfect example of what it once was).

jsup

WTF?

GREGGPENN

I think he's saying -- if I had a better solution (than the AIR), I'd have made a lot of cash and would be driving a newer/better car by now.

williammackean

http://www.mamotorworks.com/corvette...rame=3.141.844

jsup

So use this with the air elimination bracket?

They claim 15 HP from the pulleys. I find that pretty aggressive.

Can anyone verify real results?

williammackean

There is much put on cars in the 80's that was useless. The AIR system did not significantly change the numbers, but it was sure a 'feel good' legislation. All it did was change the PPM rating, but did nothing to reduce the mass of particles. It was like putting a turd in your sink or a turd in your sink with a bucket of water. You still have a turd in your sink!

BTW: I'm a greenie environmentalist. Mileage, emissions, and energy efficiency is paramount important to me.

williammackean

I didn't get a baseline to test it. If nothing else, it removes some drag and that is just as good as adding power, IMO. Like any other mod, alone it may be useless, but combined with others, it compliments it.

GREGGPENN

Are you saying the additional hydrocarbons aren't burnt thru this technology -- only that the PPM polution is smaller because there's more oxygen to dilute the measurement?

SunCr

The literature suggests otherwise - that oxygen has an afterburner effect. Watson - in Chevy Fuel Injection: "when the pumped in air hits the CO and HC, their temperature increases dramatically . . . and it consumes much of the CO and HC. As a side benefit from this afterburning, a greal deal of heat is used to assist in bring the catalytic converter and the oxygen sensor up to their proper operating temperature . . . Note: On many applications the air from the air pump, after completing its role of preheating the catalytic converter, will be directed between the front reducing section and the rear of the converter to supply extra oxygen, thus improving the efficiency of the oxidizer."

The raw numbers are buried in some PDF file at www.epa.gov - but more modern technology has replaced the need for pumping air to the CAT and every car I can think of is now using an electric pump at start up only. That gets it off the accessory drive train and the engineers can pretty much bury it anywhere they want to (on the last one I worked on, a '96 VW GTI, it was nearly inaccessible. I remember the flat rate being something like 3 or 4 hours because you needed to take off the front end to get to it).

I know that when you're behind a car with an inoperative one (lot's around here given our proximity to the Border) - or just working on it in your garage - they seemingly stink forever and having had to live with an air cooled Beetle during my poverty days that smell doesn't bring back fond memories. And as stated, if I or anyone has a better mouse trap, we'd be living quite comfortably.

williammackean

Upon startup: Yes. A cold Cat does nothing.

At operating temperature: The Cat does reduce HC emissions. At this temp, there is no need for extra air injected into the Cat, as the O2 sensor system is making sure of ample O2. In closed loop, I detected no air pressure in the cat supply line, so I surmised that it was only a cold operating device to speed its warmup.

rrubel

About three years ago I did a complete engine overhaul/rebuild and installed headers with a brand-new hi-flow cat in my 86 and the factory AIR system. Didn't have the programming quite right at the time. Had to take the car through MD's 'sniff test' and it failed but not by a lot. After I got home, I found that a new hose I'd installed between the AIR pump and the cat had kinked so there was little to no airflow (where the stock hose has a 90-degree bend, I'd put in a straight piece and bent it a little but when it got hot it closed up). I replaced the kinked part with a true bend and went to get it re-tested. Passed with flying colors. That was the ONLY thing I'd changed, even to just starting the car and driving straight to the emissions place.

So from where I sit, it's a darned useful 30 lbs of metal...

[RICHR]

williammackean

IMO, the AIR system IS the mouse trap. It does little to solve the root cause, and only treats the symptom. Fuel purity standards have reduced the need for AIR systems. Much like the drug companies. They make billions off of suppressive therapy. They make ZERO off of small pox & polio vaccines.

Why cure the disease when treating the symptom is such a cash cow? There would be no house mice if they developed a birth control delivery system into insulation and/or lawn fertillizer. Where's the mouse trap $$ in that?

williammackean

In your case, you did not reduce your emissions. You merely dilluted them. Net savings to the environment: Zero.

This is why MN dropped the emissions testing all together. We figured out that it is better to legislate cleaner fuels and engine technology than to screw the consumer by making them upkeep inferior technology.

jsup

If your car was tuned right, do you think it would have passed?

SunCr

Since when is any part a money maker? Are all of you too young to remember the Pinto???? Their current rage is against Green House emissions laws - CO2 - mileage. Amazingly, they've agreed to reductions with the Canadians and Europeans but continue to duke it out here in the States with the old adage - it's gonna cost too much. Geeez - if the OEM's had their way, we'd all be wearing the King's new clothes. Thinking about it, there's at least some of that in the Vette. Lusted after by us Boomers since birth, the things sold/sell in spite of toasted feet, blown head gaskets, ring "flutter" and a host of other items that's put most of America in a Toyota - but even they use the same emissions equipment. Someday, someone one's going to be laughing (actually I'd prefer a medal), but for now it's GM on the way to the Bank.

GREGGPENN

I stand corrected. The tube is the front is a dump.

GREGGPENN

How hard would it be to dump the AIR pump, then add an electric pump w 5-minute timer to feed the L98? Could the two existing leads (to the diverter) be used as an on/off timer?

My AIR mounting bracket broke during removal (POS) . With the prospect of getting a new pump AND a bracket, I'm more inclined to modification/removal now.

williammackean

Just remove it.

Look at the pic I posted. It will show a long tube cut in 3 pieces. I used a hammer & flathead screwdriver to pierce it, then it bends back and forth to break free.

GIJoe

Leave it to a Kali driver to defend the AIR pump

-----

I was going to make a smog pump and Kali fire joke, but that would have been bad taste since I see you live in SanDiego

rrubel

Um, if the increased air flow to the cat allowed it to run hotter, burning off the excess emissions as it was designed to, then I'd say I did more than just dilute them.

As for whether my car would have passed had it been in better tune, I don't know and hopefully will never know... I normally get a height exemption (got one this past visit) and hope to keep getting them. Letting a minimum-wage weenie drive my Vette on the rollers is a high-stress proposition.

[RICHR]