HPS or Ceramic?
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 538
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From: Orlando FL
HPS or Ceramic?
I just got my parts in from BSI for my 95 LT1 with the HD brakes, and I strained a couple times 'Ceramic, ceramic, ceramic!'. What do I get? HPS. Well, before I jump the gun and send them back, I will see what you guys think.
I wanted ceramic as it's low heat, and less mess. How much more dust would I expect with the HPS? As well as, would the ceramics be noisier?
I wanted ceramic as it's low heat, and less mess. How much more dust would I expect with the HPS? As well as, would the ceramics be noisier?
Racer
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 312
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From: San Antonio Texas
True.....but that's because ceramic pads are hard as hell on brake rotors; will cause rotor warpage in short order.
Also, ceramics don't work very well when cool. When I say 'cool', I mean at normal street driven temps.
Unless you're on a motorcross or road-racing corse, you won't see the pad tempuratures that ceramics work best at; they aren't a particularly good choice for the street. Been there, done that
.
I say keep the HPS pads!!!
KW
Also, ceramics don't work very well when cool. When I say 'cool', I mean at normal street driven temps.
Unless you're on a motorcross or road-racing corse, you won't see the pad tempuratures that ceramics work best at; they aren't a particularly good choice for the street. Been there, done that
.I say keep the HPS pads!!!
KW
Last edited by Kevin Woods; Feb 9, 2008 at 07:42 PM.
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Feb 2007
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From: Orlando FL
I will probably keep them then, I just once had a BMW and it had performance brakes that were dirrrrrty! Ever since then, I been sticking with ceramics. Well on my old truck, but it had 35 inch wheels 
, so I know the ceramics were gettin a workout!
Thanks for the input!
, so I know the ceramics were gettin a workout!Thanks for the input!
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 15,344
Likes: 4,009
From: Texas
True.....but that's because ceramic pads are hard as hell on brake rotors; will cause rotor warpage in short order.
Also, ceramics don't work very well when cool. When I say 'cool', I mean at normal street driven temps.
Unless you're on a motorcross or road-racing corse, you won't see the pad tempuratures that ceramics work best at; they aren't a particularly good choice for the street. Been there, done that .
I say keep the HPS pads!!!
KW
Also, ceramics don't work very well when cool. When I say 'cool', I mean at normal street driven temps.
Unless you're on a motorcross or road-racing corse, you won't see the pad tempuratures that ceramics work best at; they aren't a particularly good choice for the street. Been there, done that
.I say keep the HPS pads!!!
KW
Using ceramic street pads on a track (road race) is asking for trouble.
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Feb 2007
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From: Orlando FL
So how much dust do the HPS throw? I wonder as my fronts currently will be dirty after just one run to work and back in one day. It's reaally annoying!!! I mean I want good brakes, but I don't want brake dust all over the components and parts of which I have cleaned up.
Safety Car
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 3,651
Likes: 10
From: Apple Valley MN
I ordered the Hawk ceramic pads from BSI, but won't be installing them for a while yet. I wanted a low-dust street pad - I had good luck with ceramic pads on a Lincoln Mark VIII I had some years back.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,564
Likes: 6
From: Woodstock Georgia
I have about 15,000 dust free miles on a set of Bosch ceramic pads with solid OEM rotors. No dust, no rotor problems, stops great, etc.
If you want to road race they are not for you, for the daily driver they are fine. In fact I was dooing laps at high speeds at Atlanta Motor Speedway last October and they performed great. And yes, they stop fast when you need it.
If you want to road race they are not for you, for the daily driver they are fine. In fact I was dooing laps at high speeds at Atlanta Motor Speedway last October and they performed great. And yes, they stop fast when you need it.
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Race Director
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 15,344
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From: Texas
People are confusing low dust ceramic street pads with carbon ceramic racing pads. BIIIIIIIIIIIIIG difference in performance and $$$$.
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 538
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From: Orlando FL
Yea, I just wanted a low-dust street ceramic. Which is why seeing they gave a choice between Hawks HPS and Hawks Ceramic, I wanted Ceramic. Hopefully they won't make that nasty brake squeal though!
That's why I was asking, to see if anyone else was running them.
That's why I was asking, to see if anyone else was running them.
Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,624
Likes: 431
From: Dale City VA
Ceramics are fine for the street. People who think they're at 10/10s by driving aggressively on the street are equivalent to someone driving 5/10s on a road course.
People are confusing low dust ceramic street pads with carbon ceramic racing pads. BIIIIIIIIIIIIIG difference in performance and $$$$.
People are confusing low dust ceramic street pads with carbon ceramic racing pads. BIIIIIIIIIIIIIG difference in performance and $$$$.
When I converted my 92 to C-5 Z06 front brakes, the GM Dura Stop ceramic pads that came in the kit interested me so I used them, "just to see" how good they were. BAD IDEA!
After 2 weeks of normal driving and one local AutoX competition I completely destroyed the front rotors. Infact I had to pass on my 3rd run that day and go home because the rotors were warped so badly after only 2 attempts.
Ceramic pads are good for show cars or daily drivers that will never be driven hard but thats it.
Will
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Feb 2007
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From: Orlando FL
Wow man. I am confused now. I don't want to do brakes again! OK, what do you suggest then? Hawks Ceramics or Hawks HPS?
I don't want brake squeal, don't want noticeable brake dust covering the wheel, but don't want to have anything that will lead to warped rotors....
Suggestions???
I don't want brake squeal, don't want noticeable brake dust covering the wheel, but don't want to have anything that will lead to warped rotors....
Suggestions???
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,290
Likes: 6
From: St Marys GA
Wow man. I am confused now. I don't want to do brakes again! OK, what do you suggest then? Hawks Ceramics or Hawks HPS?
I don't want brake squeal, don't want noticeable brake dust covering the wheel, but don't want to have anything that will lead to warped rotors....
Suggestions???
I don't want brake squeal, don't want noticeable brake dust covering the wheel, but don't want to have anything that will lead to warped rotors....
Suggestions???
I just bought a set of HPS pads that I'm going to install this weekend; I have black wheels anyway!
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Feb 2007
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From: Orlando FL
Well I don't race, just run around town. Nothing over 80-90 at the most ever. I have black wheels as well. My current Napa Delco's put dust on EVERY time I drive, and it's annoying as all hell. Why I wanted to switch up...
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 15,344
Likes: 4,009
From: Texas
FWIW, it's the heat one worries about with track pads. High temps break down the pad compound and result in fade. After a 2.1 mile cool-down lap, my front rotors are still well in excess of 500*F even with 3.25" brake cooling ducts feeding cool air directly to the center of the rotor. One can imagine how hot the rotors are under full braking from 140+mph to less than 50mph.
Last edited by 96GS#007; Feb 14, 2008 at 11:36 PM.
Team Owner
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St. Jude Donor '08-'09-'10-'11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16-'17
NCM Member '09
I run Hawk Ceramics on both my Z28 and Vette (both have C5 brakes),
and my wife's little Pontiac uses Raybestos Ceramics (economy version,
better than teh premiums). I sell Raybestos ceramics all day long,
probably 30-40 sets/day, and they are by far, teh best pad since asbestos was banned. My cars stop hard, very hard, and last for damn
near ever, quietly and cleanly. Teh ceramic element helps to cool teh
pad quickly, so repeat stop and go is very consistent.
I wouldn't consider them as an autocross pad, but as a daily, they are
tough to beat.
and my wife's little Pontiac uses Raybestos Ceramics (economy version,
better than teh premiums). I sell Raybestos ceramics all day long,
probably 30-40 sets/day, and they are by far, teh best pad since asbestos was banned. My cars stop hard, very hard, and last for damn
near ever, quietly and cleanly. Teh ceramic element helps to cool teh
pad quickly, so repeat stop and go is very consistent.
I wouldn't consider them as an autocross pad, but as a daily, they are
tough to beat.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 6,937
Likes: 21
From: Waldorf MD
I bought rotors from BSI and I wanted ceramic pads, they sent Hawk HPS. I didn't realize this until AFTER I installed pads.
I previously had GM Ceramic pads and my stock rotors were "warped". These Hawk HPS pads produce very little dust, probably the same as GM Ceramics, BUT Ceramics dust is lighter and shows up less on my polished wheels.
BTW, Hawk HPS pads stop MUCH better than GM Ceramics, something I did not admit when I ran GM Ceramic pads.
I previously had GM Ceramic pads and my stock rotors were "warped". These Hawk HPS pads produce very little dust, probably the same as GM Ceramics, BUT Ceramics dust is lighter and shows up less on my polished wheels.
BTW, Hawk HPS pads stop MUCH better than GM Ceramics, something I did not admit when I ran GM Ceramic pads.
Drifting
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,294
Likes: 37
I changed to ceramic pads in my GRand Cherokee just to see how they were. Results: Better stopping power, no dust, no fade on hard stops. I love them and will use them for now on. You must take a pneumatic rotary scouring pad (or use 180 sandpaper) and scuff the rotors before putting them on.....otherwise, squeal city.
Team Owner
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 20,393
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St. Jude Donor '08-'09-'10-'11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16-'17
NCM Member '09
at all.....
Burning Brakes
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 777
Likes: 1
From: Fort Worth Texas
I have Hawk HPS on my 96 LT4 and they stop Great for street use. As good or better than GM. Very low dust on my wheels.
Google Hawk HPS as there are a ton of places selling them.
My Vette has been setting for several months and I drove it hard yesterday and I am still Happy with the hawks.140 MPH to 70 MPH Hard and no brake fade. I thought I was going to have to sell my LT4 after the Dow went into the crapper. But I sold some of my motorcycles so I could keep her......
Google Hawk HPS as there are a ton of places selling them.
My Vette has been setting for several months and I drove it hard yesterday and I am still Happy with the hawks.140 MPH to 70 MPH Hard and no brake fade. I thought I was going to have to sell my LT4 after the Dow went into the crapper. But I sold some of my motorcycles so I could keep her......
Last edited by Louis Bartay; Nov 8, 2008 at 09:49 PM.