Valve Seal Install attempt
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,815
Likes: 10
From: New York New York
Valve Seal Install attempt
I have decided to learn how to wrench my car and attempt to replace my leaking valve seals since I have white smoke on start up. I have read Ronsred88's thread http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c4-t...8-finally.html and gain a lot of knowledge. I also reviewed Lemme's thread http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c4-t...-start-up.html which was also helpful.
Is there anything these else I need to know or to be aware of while doing this job?
where can I order the best valve seals for the job?
Here is another link I found that is informative on this type of job:
http://www.newenglandclassics.org/Ar...eplacement.pdf
This is how my car looks on start up:
And like this:
Any thoughts?
Is there anything these else I need to know or to be aware of while doing this job?
where can I order the best valve seals for the job?
Here is another link I found that is informative on this type of job:
http://www.newenglandclassics.org/Ar...eplacement.pdf
This is how my car looks on start up:
And like this:
Any thoughts?
Last edited by uptown193; Jul 19, 2010 at 01:02 AM.
Race Director
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 16,475
Likes: 270
From: Kingman AZ
Cruise-In VII Veteran
Cruise-In VIII
St. Jude Donor '06-'07-'08-'09-'10-'11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16
Felpro from NAPA is what I used on an 87. I had a hard time getting the valves to stay pressed up against the seats while I compressed the springs. I was unable to get the air hose adaptor to fit in some of the spark plug holes so I used the rope trick.
I did not read the above threads to see if this was suggested so here it is anyway. Remove all the plugs. Use the proper sized socket and a breaker bar on the crankshaft snout to rotate the engine. I started out with #1 cylinder and threaded a piece of nylon rope into the spark plug hole until I had several inches in there. I then rotated the engine until the piston presses the rope against the valves. This allows you to compress the valve spring without dropping the valves down into the cylinder. I used a lighter to melt the end of the rope first and formed it into a point. This made it easier to get the rope into the spark plug hole.
At someone's advice I bought 2 sets of the valve seals and used the intake valve umbrella seals on both the intake and the exhaust valves.
This is a good time to install new spark plugs, wires and some 1:6 ratio roller rockers.
I did not read the above threads to see if this was suggested so here it is anyway. Remove all the plugs. Use the proper sized socket and a breaker bar on the crankshaft snout to rotate the engine. I started out with #1 cylinder and threaded a piece of nylon rope into the spark plug hole until I had several inches in there. I then rotated the engine until the piston presses the rope against the valves. This allows you to compress the valve spring without dropping the valves down into the cylinder. I used a lighter to melt the end of the rope first and formed it into a point. This made it easier to get the rope into the spark plug hole.
At someone's advice I bought 2 sets of the valve seals and used the intake valve umbrella seals on both the intake and the exhaust valves.
This is a good time to install new spark plugs, wires and some 1:6 ratio roller rockers.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,815
Likes: 10
From: New York New York
Felpro from NAPA is what I used on an 87. I had a hard time getting the valves to stay pressed up against the seats while I compressed the springs. I was unable to get the air hose adaptor to fit in some of the spark plug holes so I used the rope trick.
I did not read the above threads to see if this was suggested so here it is anyway. Remove all the plugs. Use the proper sized socket and a breaker bar on the crankshaft snout to rotate the engine. I started out with #1 cylinder and threaded a piece of nylon rope into the spark plug hole until I had several inches in there. I then rotated the engine until the piston presses the rope against the valves. This allows you to compress the valve spring without dropping the valves down into the cylinder. I used a lighter to melt the end of the rope first and formed it into a point. This made it easier to get the rope into the spark plug hole.
At someone's advice I bought 2 sets of the valve seals and used the intake valve umbrella seals on both the intake and the exhaust valves.
This is a good time to install new spark plugs, wires and some 1:6 ratio roller rockers.
I did not read the above threads to see if this was suggested so here it is anyway. Remove all the plugs. Use the proper sized socket and a breaker bar on the crankshaft snout to rotate the engine. I started out with #1 cylinder and threaded a piece of nylon rope into the spark plug hole until I had several inches in there. I then rotated the engine until the piston presses the rope against the valves. This allows you to compress the valve spring without dropping the valves down into the cylinder. I used a lighter to melt the end of the rope first and formed it into a point. This made it easier to get the rope into the spark plug hole.
At someone's advice I bought 2 sets of the valve seals and used the intake valve umbrella seals on both the intake and the exhaust valves.
This is a good time to install new spark plugs, wires and some 1:6 ratio roller rockers.
How thick of a nylon rope do I need and how long should it be?
can you tell me exactly which valve seals you bought please. Maybe part number?
I just had new plugs and wires installed 2 months ago so I am good there.
Which 1:6 ratio roller rockers do you suggest I get. Do you have part number?
Sorry for the many questions but I appreciate the help. I am just learning to work on my car myself. At least work on things that I am capable of doing.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 5,043
Likes: 8
From: Tampa Florida
No offense but it is not a "great" idea to rotate an engine by the snout's crankshaft bolt as you can strip the crank threads out....even with the plugs out. Not that I haven't done it that way and gotten lucky but I've stripped a few too.
Use one of these to turn the crank by the flywheel instead: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/WMR-W80510/
or
One of these:
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MIL-27000/
Use one of these to turn the crank by the flywheel instead: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/WMR-W80510/
or
One of these:
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MIL-27000/
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,815
Likes: 10
From: New York New York
As from Ronsred88 thread I will be ordering these seals:
Part # SS72877, Exhaust seals and Part # SS72577, Intake seals
from here: http://www.napaonline.com/Search/Res...+50012+2012030
Does anyone know if this is the proper valve Spring Compressor to get?
http://www.napaonline.com/Search/Det...189_0006393020
Part # SS72877, Exhaust seals and Part # SS72577, Intake seals
from here: http://www.napaonline.com/Search/Res...+50012+2012030
Does anyone know if this is the proper valve Spring Compressor to get?
http://www.napaonline.com/Search/Det...189_0006393020
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 17,699
Likes: 1,667
From: moraga ca
No offense but it is not a "great" idea to rotate an engine by the snout's crankshaft bolt as you can strip the crank threads out....even with the plugs out. Not that I haven't done it that way and gotten lucky but I've stripped a few too.
Use one of these to turn the crank by the flywheel instead: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/WMR-W80510/
or
One of these:
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MIL-27000/
Use one of these to turn the crank by the flywheel instead: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/WMR-W80510/
or
One of these:
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MIL-27000/
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,815
Likes: 10
From: New York New York
Safety Car
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,328
Likes: 15
From: Jacksonville FL
Ron, I am also interested in more details on the rope trick. Dia. please and what like a parachute cord or ski rope or am I overthinking this? What is it actually doing, stopping the piston from hitting the valve or serving as a cushion between em? I love tricks like this, kinda like filling the pilot bearing hole with grease and using the clutch alignment tool to pop the bearing out.
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Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,815
Likes: 10
From: New York New York
Ron, I am also interested in more details on the rope trick. Dia. please and what like a parachute cord or ski rope or am I overthinking this? What is it actually doing, stopping the piston from hitting the valve or serving as a cushion between em? I love tricks like this, kinda like filling the pilot bearing hole with grease and using the clutch alignment tool to pop the bearing out.
I am guessing the rope has to be the circumference of a spark plug so it will be able to fit through the hole and stuff it (no pun intended.)
Last edited by uptown193; Jul 16, 2010 at 01:32 AM.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 800
Likes: 2
I learned that the rope trick is used to keep the pistons in place while while you are installing the new seals. You can use air to if you have a shop. But if you don't use either rope or air the piston will fall through and then you will have to take the heads off completely to retrieve the piston.
I am guessing the rope has to be the circumference of a spark plug so it will be able to fit through the hole and stuff it (no pun intended.)
I am guessing the rope has to be the circumference of a spark plug so it will be able to fit through the hole and stuff it (no pun intended.)
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 8,735
Likes: 412
From: WV
Am I the only one that noticed the OP said in his original post that he has (White smoke) coming from his exhaust at startup??? White smoke would not be valve seals!! Sounds to me like coolant is leaking from somewhere ( Maybe a head gasket)???....WW
Last edited by WW7; Jul 16, 2010 at 09:23 AM.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,815
Likes: 10
From: New York New York
I guess you can say it is a white/bluish color smoke, mix of both and it is right on start up just a puff then it goes away and when I turn off the car and say have a beer or 2 and start her up again the puff of smoke happens. I read everywhere that when this happens it is a valve stem seal. Am I wrong?
Team Owner
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 90,675
Likes: 304
From: SE NY
Cruise-In II Veteran
Indeed the nylon rope need only be a bit smaller dia than the spark plug thread and maybe 18" long is sufficient. I like to use a screw driver in the spark plug hole as a "piston stop", when it stops feed in the rope till full and then turn the crand till tight.
When I did Comp Cams ProMagnum full roller RRs I got new valve seals from my local Chevy dealer to assure no issues with fit/function and the like.
To turn the crank I used three bolts from a damper puller kit for leverage points.
Note that it's much easier to rotate the crank with all spark plugs out and all rocker arms loose. As you adjust the rockers you will notice that more effort is needed to manually rotate the crank.
BTW, what year Vette do you have?
When I did Comp Cams ProMagnum full roller RRs I got new valve seals from my local Chevy dealer to assure no issues with fit/function and the like.
To turn the crank I used three bolts from a damper puller kit for leverage points.
Note that it's much easier to rotate the crank with all spark plugs out and all rocker arms loose. As you adjust the rockers you will notice that more effort is needed to manually rotate the crank.
BTW, what year Vette do you have?
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,815
Likes: 10
From: New York New York
Indeed the nylon rope need only be a bit smaller dia than the spark plug thread and maybe 18" long is sufficient. I like to use a screw driver in the spark plug hole as a "piston stop", when it stops feed in the rope till full and then turn the crand till tight.
When I did Comp Cams ProMagnum full roller RRs I got new valve seals from my local Chevy dealer to assure no issues with fit/function and the like.
To turn the crank I used three bolts from a damper puller kit for leverage points.
Note that it's much easier to rotate the crank with all spark plugs out and all rocker arms loose. As you adjust the rockers you will notice that more effort is needed to manually rotate the crank.
BTW, what year Vette do you have?
When I did Comp Cams ProMagnum full roller RRs I got new valve seals from my local Chevy dealer to assure no issues with fit/function and the like.
To turn the crank I used three bolts from a damper puller kit for leverage points.
Note that it's much easier to rotate the crank with all spark plugs out and all rocker arms loose. As you adjust the rockers you will notice that more effort is needed to manually rotate the crank.
BTW, what year Vette do you have?
After reading other threads now I am confused if its a bad valve seal, PCV valve or a bad head gasket.
When I cold start my car I get a whitish puff of smoke but it can also have some blue in it and it just lingers for like 10-20 seconds and the smoke is gone. I don't know if its even worth fixing but I personally don't like it.
I read I can do a leak test to find out.
Maybe I will just record it and post it so people can see it for themselves.
Last edited by uptown193; Jul 16, 2010 at 02:55 PM.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,815
Likes: 10
From: New York New York
I haven't checked the oil level in like 2 months and the coolant level is good which was just serviced with a new 160 stat and and new gasket because it was leaking but this smoke on cold starts has been going on for like 2 years at least. I am just tired of it now and its embarrassing for me.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 8,735
Likes: 412
From: WV
I didn't mean to throw a wrench in your repair, but when I saw (white smoke) it was enough to make me question your diagnosis. I would hate to see you do valve seals only to find out it was a head gasket.I just thought I would mention it....WW
Last edited by WW7; Jul 16, 2010 at 04:48 PM.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,815
Likes: 10
From: New York New York
I mean the car is 24 years old so I don't think it would hurt to do the valve seal at this point, not that I want to do it.
