I have never seen SB push rods rub anginst the head. The only way that maybe and I still doubt this is if you had them installed on the edge of the lifter and not in the center but that is almost impossible if not impossible. At this point I would dubble check all you can and the most likely to cause this. Cam timeing (gear dots lines up) valve adj. and like I said I would probley pull the cam sense this is not the first time. I can just about promise you that the push rods were not bent beacuse they were rubbing the head. you need to look a lot futher.

 

Join the club the Cam is Dot to dot I set it up crank is at 12;00 O Clock the Cam was at 6:00 o clock

Turn the motor to TDC set the timming.

Put the motor in the car now you see where I at.

Ya this been driving me nuts.

 

just because you set the timong mark to TDC does not mean you are at TDC on compression stroke you could have the dist 180 out but I have never seen that bend push rods just a no start with a bunch of backfiring. I also just picked up something you said you turned motor motor to get to TDC. If the crank gea

 

I am reading every thging everone write but you'r is not complete.

I very intresead what you have to say.

I tryed to install the distribetor 180 out and no back fireing nothing at all just spit raw fuel out of the TB.

I put the Motor on TDC made sure both valve ran there cyccles doing so made sure they were closed and used the screw driver tric to make sure the piston is all the way up made sure the rotor was pointing to #1 plug and still wont run.

 

 

ok I am not sure how you adjusted the valves. A few guys are not going to agree with me on this methoid but I have been doing it this way for over 30 years and it never fails. install rockers on push rods. look at all the rockers you can tell what ones are on the high part of the cam and what ones are not. On the ones that are not you want to take your fingers and rotate the push rod and tighten the nut until you feel resitance on the push rod. At this point you want to turn the nut a turn and a half. Do this to all the low rockers. Once you have the low rockers done have someone tap the engine while you watch the high rockers till they go down then do the same thing to them do this until you have all them adjusted. This should be good to go forever but if you want after this once you get the car started you can go cyl by cyl back off a rocker till you here it tap tighten till it stops tapping the go a turn and a half. Here is another way that works that a lot of old school flat rate guys did and do It works I just never liked it. Get one rocker that you know is down all the way and do like I said adjust nut till you feel resistance on push rood the go 1 and a half turns. Now count the threads from the top of the stud to the top of the nut and take all nuts down to that point. Like I said I do not like doing it that way but it does work know a few flat rate guys that have been doing it that way for years. Like I said before there is only a few things that can bend push rods. dist timeing is not one of them. So adj is the most likely cause in my opinion that is where I would start if in fact cam timeing is correct. Keep posting well keep working threw this

 

I just tryed my neighbors 1.6 Rocker Arms Com Cams they pulled the push rods toward the center of the Push Rod holes though the head.
My 1.5 is putting the push rods up against the side of the push rods though hole thea go though the heads.

I don't know the reason is the 1.5 Rocker arms I have now are CHM I think they are some off brand China brand or what.

But after putting the 1.6 in I going to get a set of 1.6 Com Cams to start with I also notice this put the roller tip of the 1.6 rockes in the center of the valve stem.

Should I get the high cost steels or the more affordable Aluminims ones.

I looked long and hard from the top and the bottom of the liffter vally the push rods with the 1.5 sit very very close to the push rods hole of the heads.

This could be my reason why the push rods are bending.

I also put 120 PSI of air pressure in to the cylinder to see if hold the pressure it hold pressure great I don't think I have any bent valves.

So the heads are staying on. I know the cam timing is on the money I made sure of that.

 

the push rods you get are up to you. I still doubt that they will hit the head but you can tell this by insalling them and roating the engine by hand. Get new ones try adj like I said. pull the plugs rotate engine by hand and watch valve lift. check to see if they are hitting the heads and feel if everything is smooth. Also 120 is way more pressure then you needed. all that was requires was about 5 psi or so

 

After I save anouther $300.00 Plus for a New set of Rocker arms I use a push rod checker to make sure everything is dead on before I order a set of push rods and I going to ask someone else to double check everything before I order my push rods.

I checked the 1.6 rocker arms with 7.900 push rods i did notice the roller tip was in the middle of the valve stems off the bat.

I could see light on every side of the push rod not pushed over to one side of the push rod head bore.

We are thinking the motor has not been ran yet it has not beem given a chance for the rings to seat yet so I guess 130 Lb's can be that bad I know it should be higher but lets it break in before I give the motor a base line of compression.

I PUT 120 PSI OF AIR INTO THE CYILENDER AND NO BLOW BY INTAKE OR EXAUSHT VALVES.

So I belive the valves are still good.

I mite put a diffrent brand of hyd liffters in the motor there Howards in it now I mite put a set of Comp Cams with Comp Cams steel rocker arms and push rods.

And no I don't want to spend More money on it but I want this motor to run.

 

I recently posted that I was no longer going to try to help OP because he refuses to follow my advice and recommendations. I DO feel sorry for him though.

So here we are, on, what is it, THREE DIFFERENT FORUMS posting about the exact same issues but still in the same place; engine won't start and it's STILL BENDING PUSHRODS.

Right! This same thread is running on at LEAST THREE DIFFERENT FORUMS yet nothing has changed, no improvement at all. And with all the responses he's gotten you would think by now, some improvment would have happened. Ask yourself, "Why is that?"

OP posted last week that his pushrod bending problem had been solved, but I knew then that it hadn't. How'd I know? Because he didn't post a single post that he had checked all the crucial clearances I recommended he check - NOT ONE. I knew then, just as I know now, that merely ordering and installing shorter pushrods wasn't going to solve the pushrod bending problem. They haven't and they won't.

It's virtually guaranteed for the engine to end up with a handful of bent pushrods from the pushrods binding against the heads when higher ratio rocker arms are used on some earlier or some aftermarket SB Chevy heads. The Early 86 iron Vette heads are a perfect example; same thing for the same vintage 'F' Body heads and others. It's been a common problem for decades.

Hence the need for the Louis Tool to elongate the slots/holes in the heads for the needed clearance. This problem and caution/warning has been around for decades and I'm surprised you weren't aware of it. That is unless you're one of the younger guys who hasn't been screwing on these suckas for over 40 years. That would explain it.

I don't have a listing of all the heads effected but it's one of the main things that CompCams and other major cam companies warn about and one of the several clearances that MUST be measured and modified as needed. Those clearance checks can't just be skipped over because they seem unnecessary or too much work - Look at what happens when one doesn't.

Imagine what would happen if the engine did actually start up. Pieces of broken pushrod flying around inside the engine. Imagine the carnage! Good thing that it won't start.

The pushrod holes in his heads are the most likely culprits. That's why he's been bending and breaking pushrods since day one. Shiny wear marks on the pushrods are "witness marks" of the interference. It's not going to stop until he pulls the heads and takes them to a machine shop to have the holes elongated. It would be best to move to guide plates and non-self aligning rocker arms if he doesn't already have them.

Until that's done, all else is just a waste of time and money.

I don't mind trying to help but I DON'T HAVE INFINITE PATIENCE with those who refuse to follow good advice. And he's received it from some of the BEST, if not THE BEST on these Forums.

I've said it before and I'll say it again:

PUSHRODS DON'T JUST BEND. PUSHRODS DON'T JUST BREAK. WHEN THEY BEND AND/OR BREAK SOMETHING CAUSED IT. THE USUAL AND MOST COMMON CAUSE IS BINDING AND INTERFERENCE SOMEWHERE IN THE VALVE TRAIN.

DON'T START THE ENGINE UNTIL THE PUSHROD PROBLEM IS REALLY SOLVED. IF YOU DO, EXTENSIVE ENGINE DAMAGE MAY WELL FOLLOW

Jake

 

Jake that is what I have been trying to tell him push rods do not bend on their on. Last night was the first I learned about artermaket rockers. That is why I told him once he gets it together rotate by hand to watch and make sure nothing it hitting. He seems like a nice guy a little lost or maybe a little over his head in some aspects but hopefully he will take the help and advice that people give him.

 

Marv02, if you have ANY sense at all you will sit down and read what these guys are telling you. If you do and then if you follow their instructions THEN you might get to hear that engine run. IF not,,,,, well I'll be watching for your "for sale" ad. I only have one question, if you are not going to listen, why are you asking???

 

Just so you'll know, I put in a LOT of time and effort with him on another Forum. Based on the responses I received from him I realize he doesn't really know what he's doing.

Let's look at this in some logical order: IIRC, he posted his valve springs are supposed to be good to .470" valve lift and his cam lift has .447" valve lift. I don't know if that valve figure is with 1.5 or 1.6 rockers. If it''s the with 1.5s he's only got .023" of room to play with but with 1.6 rockers, he's over the top and his springs are most likely coil binding. I'M CONVINCED HE'S NEVER ACTUALLY MEASURED TO SEE WHAT HE'S GOT.

With numbers on paper that are THAT CLOSE TO THE LIMIT, measuring is mandatory. Not just for coil bind but retainer to valve stem seal and retainer to valve guide clearances as well. Did he actually measure any of that? I'm convinced he hasn't because he then began writing about fuel pressure, the color of the spark and other unrelated thngs. He never wrote anything saying something like "I turned the engine over until the #1 intake valve was at full lift and used my feeler gauges to insert between two coils and the clearance was .xxx", or anything remotely similar.

So I went back to a square one technique in an effort to verify the work he'd already done. In using that square one approach, I suggested he go to CompCams website site, look up the Tech article on what areas of the valve train that must be checked for the proper clearance. The goal in doing that was to try to solve the pushrod bending problem. He then posted that the shorter pushrods he ordered had arrived and his bending problem was solved. Seems he used a level or straight edge and determined he needed 8 pushrods that are .025" shorter. WELL WE NOW SEE THAT THE BENDING ISSUE HASN'T BEEN SOLVED.

When it comes to finding the correct pushrod length, I sent him a link to an article featured in Circle Track magazine on how to determine the correct pushrod length. I chose Circle Track since if anyone would know, they would. It's essentially the same procedure featured in other articles too. He claimed he used info from that article to check for the correct pushrod length but since my "suspicious meter" had been pegged so often already, I doubted the truthfulness of his response.

I sent him a link to the step-by-step procedure on how to adjust the lifter preload. My concern was that he may have done it incorrectly and now his valve(s) were hitting and binding against his piston(s) causing the bent pushrods. I even posted the procedure as a STICKY on the website so he, and others, would have ready reference to it.

IIRC he claims to have "measured" and found that his intake valves are of a different length than the exhaust by .025" I forgot which ones were the shorter, but it's in one of his responses. Then he ordered .100" shorter pushrods!! I asked him repeatedly why he did that; if there was only a difference of .025" why did he go .100"?? -Never received a response to that. By this time I'm beginning to doubt just about everything he posts. I doubt that he needs a .025" shorter pushrod, but, for the sake of argument let's say he does, wouldn't it be closer to what he "measured" to go .050" shorter rather than jump all the way to .100" shorter?

YES, HE DEFINITELY IS IN OVER HIS HEAD, but that's not the only issue. He doesn't follow the advice given to him. There are LOTS of guys who bite off more than they can chew but they, at least, follow the advice of others and end up solving their issue(s).

Why the engine won't start is yet another can of worms, best left on the back-burner until the pushrod bending issue is resolved.

Just thought I'd give you a little background on this.

Jake

 

He has posted (on another forum) that pulling the head revealed valves hitting pistons, but he says the valves are not bent. Sounds like he probably junked this motor. I suspect he bottomed the lifters with the wrong pushrods, then bent the valves, and probably hurt the lifters. Combine that with pushrods grinding off the heads, and it is a mess. Shame really. Alot of helpful advice was offered, yet not heeded.

 

I pretty much figured out that he was not a listener, you gave him excellent advice and if he had simply followed it or found someone who would he could be driving the car by now,,,,,,maybe,,, it sounds to me like the whole engine was built with "more is best" in mind.

 

Thanks Jake I had no I deal he even rebuilt the engine. This post of his started out as a weak spark post. It was few messages latter that I found out he rebuilt the engine. I did not know a thing about change in rockers untill the other night. A lot of problems would have been solved if he would have just keep the one post going. Seems now he was only looking for an answer he wanted to here. Another thing is most aftermaket parts tell you things you may need to look at or change for them to work. Maybe just a little looking at directions would have helped. And try to listen to people who want to help. I am happy you said something about the rockers because I would have stuck to what I was saying thinking he had stock rockers.

 

Started as weak spark, right. See how this has jumped around, ignoring all the SERIOUS issues and jumping to weak spark and fuel. Ignoring the things that would trash the engine even if it had strong spark and all the fuel it needed. What's he thinking??!!

He'd never posted photos of his heads, at least none I saw while I was trying to help him. The ones posted here, with the pushrods positioned through the holes, gave me instant pause.

As soon as I saw HOLES my meter pegged. Not even slots, just HOLES. Then I could easily see the witness marks on the rods. Wonder why he never mentioned those witness marks to me, especially after I warned him about that being a interference/binding possibility in my responses. That, as well as the 'valves hitting the pistons and binding warning'.

BTW, I'll bet he doesn't really know if they're bent or not because he hasn't removed them to have them checked. It's just like when he posted that his bent pushrod issue was solved.

I'd have to go back to check to be sure, but IIRC he's the same guy I asked to post the procedure he used to set the lifter preload. Guess what I got as a response? Something like "I put my hand on the pushrod". That's it!

I don't want mistakenly accuse him but if it is him that response can be found in the first sentence of one of his responses to me. I'm not going back to track down those threads; even though I feel sorry for him, I'm burned out now with him. Especially after this latest information.

I mean, really, how cam anyone really help a guy who acts like that?

Jake