Is it really THIS easy?
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 178
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From: Huntsville AL
Is it really THIS easy?
https://www.corvetteforum.com/techti...=134&TopicID=2
That's from one of the tech tips posted on this site. The title is "5 cheap mods for 70 hp." Is it really this "easy" and "cheap"? The mufflers are quite a jump according to the post, as is the Hypertech chip and air foil for the TPI throttle body.
I added the supposed gains up and got from 66 - 97 hp increase. I would lean toward the low end on that and think the 70 hp increase would be fairly accurate if all this works. As you can see in my sig, my car is a '94 LT1. 300 hp at the crank. After these mods, would I really see around 370 hp? If so, it seems worth it to do these mods (if I keep the car much longer, that is).
Can you tell I'm a total n00b when it comes to engine work? :jester :smash: :crazy:
That's from one of the tech tips posted on this site. The title is "5 cheap mods for 70 hp." Is it really this "easy" and "cheap"? The mufflers are quite a jump according to the post, as is the Hypertech chip and air foil for the TPI throttle body.
I added the supposed gains up and got from 66 - 97 hp increase. I would lean toward the low end on that and think the 70 hp increase would be fairly accurate if all this works. As you can see in my sig, my car is a '94 LT1. 300 hp at the crank. After these mods, would I really see around 370 hp? If so, it seems worth it to do these mods (if I keep the car much longer, that is).
Can you tell I'm a total n00b when it comes to engine work? :jester :smash: :crazy:
Race Director
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 14,165
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Re: Is it really THIS easy? (semvhu)
It doesn't work. The hypertech is dyno proven to lose horsepower, and all the rest of it is dyno proven to be of little or no gain. The mufflers are about the only thing that can make a difference. The air filter isn't a bad idea either, but all of these mods in no way add up to 70 hp.
If you want 70 hp you're gonna have to install a cam and some headers. With good heads you can get 100 over stock. This tech tip should have never been written, and it should certainly be removed. Obviously the person who wrote it didn't do his reseearch, he just wrote it down straight out of magazine claims.
If you want 70 hp you're gonna have to install a cam and some headers. With good heads you can get 100 over stock. This tech tip should have never been written, and it should certainly be removed. Obviously the person who wrote it didn't do his reseearch, he just wrote it down straight out of magazine claims.
Drifting
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 1,994
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From: Charleston, WV
Re: Is it really THIS easy? (semvhu)
Uhmmm......... That stuff would get me into the high horsepower range too..... I don't tell everything I have but there's a lot more than what's in my sig. The ads that claim that stuff are only on an individual basis....... you can't add them up. Some of it is advertising stuff some may be real. I do know that as you add more stuff to it the gains are less......... then you need to evaluate it all over again........... and some depends on certain things being in certain condition for the tests and so on......... the only way to know for sure is track time or dyno time....... :seeya
Racer
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 313
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From: Dallas Tx
Re: Is it really THIS easy? (semvhu)
I believe this is extremely exaggerated! (IMHO)
I may be rocking the boat, but I think some of the people on here would agree with me (though I am not 100% sure).
Performance mufflers won't get you over 10Hp (if any)(I hear go cat-back exhaust for any HP gains).
Air foil seems worthless (I own one I can't tell a difference).
Performance chip (I think you had a 94 corvette) won't apply to you as you have to reprogram you ECM to change the settings (no chips 94 and up).
Thottle body bypass has a lot of arguments about if it does anything or if it is a good idea (read other posts about this), so I am not going to touch it.
IAT relocation also has some debate, but you should also read archived posts about this as well.
If I were you, I would save up for some documented, proven power adders.
Such as Heads, Intake, Camshaft, 1.6 RR, headers, supercharger, etc.
I mean there has to be a reason those mods are so cheap, right?
I may be rocking the boat, but I think some of the people on here would agree with me (though I am not 100% sure).
Performance mufflers won't get you over 10Hp (if any)(I hear go cat-back exhaust for any HP gains).
Air foil seems worthless (I own one I can't tell a difference).
Performance chip (I think you had a 94 corvette) won't apply to you as you have to reprogram you ECM to change the settings (no chips 94 and up).
Thottle body bypass has a lot of arguments about if it does anything or if it is a good idea (read other posts about this), so I am not going to touch it.
IAT relocation also has some debate, but you should also read archived posts about this as well.
If I were you, I would save up for some documented, proven power adders.
Such as Heads, Intake, Camshaft, 1.6 RR, headers, supercharger, etc.
I mean there has to be a reason those mods are so cheap, right?
Burning Brakes
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 755
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From: Patterson CA
Re: Is it really THIS easy? (semvhu)
Take a look at Ecklers and MAD catalogs, if you bought the stuff they claim to gain horsepower you could easily have a 1000hp Vet in no time :crazy: Like Vettmech said you can't add them up, but of course the vendors don't state that part.
I agree with the exhaust and air filter. I would stay away from the airfoil, I had one but pulled it when somebody here posted that the bolt came loose, and managed to get sucked into the intake then down to the engine :eek: I never noticed a power increase from it and the benefit wasn't worth the risk to me.
Just my .02 :cheers:
[Modified by VetBoy89, 8:33 AM 10/23/2002]
I agree with the exhaust and air filter. I would stay away from the airfoil, I had one but pulled it when somebody here posted that the bolt came loose, and managed to get sucked into the intake then down to the engine :eek: I never noticed a power increase from it and the benefit wasn't worth the risk to me.
Just my .02 :cheers:
[Modified by VetBoy89, 8:33 AM 10/23/2002]
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2000
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From: Airport Cruise-in 1 Veteran Airport Cruise-in 2 Veteran
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:bs OH YEA!! You ready? :lol: :lol: :lol:
The Dyno sheet and time slip are in my web page! I , at one point, had all 5 of those so called tips done to my L98. I ran mid 14.3's as my best times. After it was 14.05 best overall but in reality I'm avg. low 14.2's. I'd guestimate that to be roughtly 15HP!! :lol: :lol: In addition, my dyno shows that I have around 250ish crank hp which again is roughly 15hp better than stock.
Go through the C4 Performance registry--------------->
I bet that if you look at the set-ups same as mine you'll see the 1/4 mile slips and dynos are also close to the same. Some might have a fewer more ponies but nowhere near 70! :crazy:
[Modified by War Machine, 10:57 AM 10/23/2002]
The Dyno sheet and time slip are in my web page! I , at one point, had all 5 of those so called tips done to my L98. I ran mid 14.3's as my best times. After it was 14.05 best overall but in reality I'm avg. low 14.2's. I'd guestimate that to be roughtly 15HP!! :lol: :lol: In addition, my dyno shows that I have around 250ish crank hp which again is roughly 15hp better than stock.
Go through the C4 Performance registry--------------->
I bet that if you look at the set-ups same as mine you'll see the 1/4 mile slips and dynos are also close to the same. Some might have a fewer more ponies but nowhere near 70! :crazy:
[Modified by War Machine, 10:57 AM 10/23/2002]
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,169
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From: Manhattan
Re: Is it really THIS easy? (semvhu)
It's not that easy, it's not that cheap. That tech tip should be re-written, or better yet, deleted.
If you want more hp, get Hooker SuperComp long tube headers, cat-back exhaust (you'll need a shop to connect the headers to the cat-back).
Then, a new cam. The LT4 hotcam has a great powerband. This will get you to about 380hp (at the crank) with the full exhaust.
Then, get your heads ported. You'll now be up above 410hp (at the crank).
Don't forget the electric water pump, upgrade to the new style opti, use a dual roller timing chain and get the computer reprogrammed.
You may need some work done to your tranny and you'll probably want a higher stall torque converter.
Raistlin
:cheers:
If you want more hp, get Hooker SuperComp long tube headers, cat-back exhaust (you'll need a shop to connect the headers to the cat-back).
Then, a new cam. The LT4 hotcam has a great powerband. This will get you to about 380hp (at the crank) with the full exhaust.
Then, get your heads ported. You'll now be up above 410hp (at the crank).
Don't forget the electric water pump, upgrade to the new style opti, use a dual roller timing chain and get the computer reprogrammed.
You may need some work done to your tranny and you'll probably want a higher stall torque converter.
Raistlin
:cheers:
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Sep 2002
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From: Huntsville AL
Re: Is it really THIS easy? (Raistlin)
Thanks to all for the replies. Yeah, it seemed a little fishy to me, almost along the lines of ricers and their sticker/huge spoiler combos. The car could use some work. The optispark probably does need replacing as it surges and lacks power until it has warmed up a couple of minutes. The engine has 156k miles on it now, so some sort of rebuild with new heads, cam, etc. wouldn't be such a bad idea.
As for the tranny remark, I just recently got it working right after many trips to the transmission dealership. Too bad I didn't just have all this done and then had the transmission upgraded to some extent. :smash:
So, heads, cam, optispark, exhaust, and other upgrades would be the way to go to get some real performance upgrades out of the car. Now I just have to compare this vs. buying a C5 6-speed hardtop and weigh the pros and cons. :D :cool: Decisions, decisions.
Thanks again!!!!
As for the tranny remark, I just recently got it working right after many trips to the transmission dealership. Too bad I didn't just have all this done and then had the transmission upgraded to some extent. :smash:
So, heads, cam, optispark, exhaust, and other upgrades would be the way to go to get some real performance upgrades out of the car. Now I just have to compare this vs. buying a C5 6-speed hardtop and weigh the pros and cons. :D :cool: Decisions, decisions.
Thanks again!!!!
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Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 825
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From: Pittsburgh PA
Re: Is it really THIS easy? (Raistlin)
i dont really think you can add all those claims up and just put it ontop of your stock hp. if you start with 300hp and add 5 items worth 10hp a piece that doesnt automatically equal 350hp. but one product could add (if any) hp at 1000rpm and next one at 2700rpm. but imo youll never really get anywhere until you dig into the motor, if you take a 50 year old 250lb out of shape guy on a couch and strap the newest $200 hi tech sneakers on him you wont get a 10 million dollar football player you just have a fat guy watching talk shows on a couch :seeya
[Modified by MIke350, 6:32 PM 10/23/2002]
[Modified by MIke350, 6:32 PM 10/23/2002]
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 2001
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From: Dallas TX
Re: Is it really THIS easy? (MIke350)
if you take a 50 year old 250lb out of shape guy on a couch and strap the newest $200 hi tech sneakers on him you wont get a 10 million dollar football player you just have a fat guy watching talk shows on a couch :seeya
[Modified by GlockLT4, 1:05 PM 10/23/2002]
Instructor
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From: Fredericksburg Virginia
Re: Is it really THIS easy? (semvhu)
Ok, now I am confused. I have a 88 coupe L98 and I clearly thought relocating the IAT, using an open air lid/K&N Air filter, clearing the MAF screens, replacing the Air foil on the TPI throttle body, removing the frisbee; changing ECM PROM to Streetrunner Hypertech chip and changing stock mufflers (I was considering the Power Effects tuneable muffs) would produce a net HP between 290-300 and a torque of approx. 370 ft/pounds. These seem to be quite popular mods on the forum.
I don't know if the gains (or lack therof) you all mention are specific to the LT1 or L98. Will the above show any HP/torque gains at all on a L98?
Here is what I was also considering in a short article on Crovette Magazine:
http://www.corvettemagazine.com/2002...formance-1.ASP
Obviously, I only want to do what will have a positive HP/torque effect without going into an engine that only has 20,540 on her.
Please advise, I was ready NOW to got out and do all the above but......
I don't know if the gains (or lack therof) you all mention are specific to the LT1 or L98. Will the above show any HP/torque gains at all on a L98?
Here is what I was also considering in a short article on Crovette Magazine:
http://www.corvettemagazine.com/2002...formance-1.ASP
Obviously, I only want to do what will have a positive HP/torque effect without going into an engine that only has 20,540 on her.
Please advise, I was ready NOW to got out and do all the above but......
Racer
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 422
Likes: 0
From: GA
Re: Is it really THIS easy? (GlockLT4)
if you take a 50 year old 250lb out of shape guy on a couch and strap the newest $200 hi tech sneakers on him you wont get a 10 million dollar football player you just have a fat guy watching talk shows on a couch :seeya
that is great!!!
[Modified by GlockLT4, 1:05 PM 10/23/2002]
that is great!!!
[Modified by GlockLT4, 1:05 PM 10/23/2002]
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 2001
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From: Life is just one big track event. Everything before and after is prep and warm-up and cool-down laps
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St. Jude Donor '12
Re: Is it really THIS easy? (semvhu)
One word - NO.
My L98 dyno'd stock 214 rwhp
I did cut back plugs and removed the frisbee (its an l98 thing, you don't have one)
I also switched to Mobil 1, with no Dyno pulls to back me up I think I'm at 220 rwhp. Over the winter I'm doing a full exhaust (headers, single cat, good exhaust after it). I'm hoping for 30 rwhp out of it to get me to 250 rwhp - I doubt it though. I just want my neighbors to quit saying my car is too quiet. You know when the lady next door with the Rustang leaves. Need to make it so they know when I leave and come home :D
I'll be very happy if the dyno in Jan shows 250 rwhp, just happy with 230 - 240 which is probably where I wind up.
My L98 dyno'd stock 214 rwhp
I did cut back plugs and removed the frisbee (its an l98 thing, you don't have one)
I also switched to Mobil 1, with no Dyno pulls to back me up I think I'm at 220 rwhp. Over the winter I'm doing a full exhaust (headers, single cat, good exhaust after it). I'm hoping for 30 rwhp out of it to get me to 250 rwhp - I doubt it though. I just want my neighbors to quit saying my car is too quiet. You know when the lady next door with the Rustang leaves. Need to make it so they know when I leave and come home :D
I'll be very happy if the dyno in Jan shows 250 rwhp, just happy with 230 - 240 which is probably where I wind up.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 2001
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From: Life is just one big track event. Everything before and after is prep and warm-up and cool-down laps
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St. Jude Donor '12
Re: Is it really THIS easy? (Bill-35thAnvrsy-88)
Ok, now I am confused. I have a 88 coupe L98 and I clearly thought relocating the IAT, using an open air lid/K&N Air filter, clearing the MAF screens, replacing the Air foil on the TPI throttle body, removing the frisbee; changing ECM PROM to Streetrunner Hypertech chip and changing stock mufflers (I was considering the Power Effects tuneable muffs) would produce a net HP between 290-300 and a torque of approx. 370 ft/pounds. These seem to be quite popular mods on the forum.
I don't know if the gains (or lack therof) you all mention are specific to the LT1 or L98. Will the above show any HP/torque gains at all on a L98?
Here is what I was also considering in a short article on Crovette Magazine:
http://www.corvettemagazine.com/2002...formance-1.ASP
Obviously, I only want to do what will have a positive HP/torque effect without going into an engine that only has 20,540 on her.
Please advise, I was ready NOW to got out and do all the above but......
I don't know if the gains (or lack therof) you all mention are specific to the LT1 or L98. Will the above show any HP/torque gains at all on a L98?
Here is what I was also considering in a short article on Crovette Magazine:
http://www.corvettemagazine.com/2002...formance-1.ASP
Obviously, I only want to do what will have a positive HP/torque effect without going into an engine that only has 20,540 on her.
Please advise, I was ready NOW to got out and do all the above but......
I did on mine so I can see if anything actually helps.
See my post above for my planned mods. Page ConeKLR to see what kind of gains you will see with the powerefects. He had them on an l98 till he sold it.
I'm probably going to go with 3 chamber flow masters.
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 2001
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From: Athens AL
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Re: Is it really THIS easy? (jaa1988)
Nope, the article in blatanly incorrect.
However, i guess if you had a 454 with a TPI and did those mods, you would get 70hp out of them. Depends on perspective.
I wish theyd remove it anyway.
However, i guess if you had a 454 with a TPI and did those mods, you would get 70hp out of them. Depends on perspective.
I wish theyd remove it anyway.