O2 Sensor Wiring
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,577
Likes: 963
From: Communist Colorado
O2 Sensor Wiring
I will need to lengthen my O2 sensors wiring harness due to adding headers. I have some old O2 sensors. Can I just cut the wires from the old ones and solder them together to get the length I need. Obviously, the wire gauge is the same, so the voltage through them should be consistent. Is this ok to do?
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,192
Likes: 381
From: Lunenburg MA
I've always been told that you have to crimp the connections on an O2 sensor because the sensor get's it's reference sample through the strands. I've also heard that solder won't stick to many as they are a special high temp wire, not just copper.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 6,113
Likes: 1,994
From: St. Charles MO
Agreed. The sample jv9999 is talking about is actual air/oxygen, which travels through the wire insulation to the sensor. I don't think you can successfully splice into the sensor wires. Take patternDayTrader's advice. Although I'm not sure whether it's better to cut and splice the car side of the harness, or just buy both connectors and fashion a plug-in extension to go between the car side and sensor side.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,098
Likes: 378
From: Las Vegas - Just stop perpetuating myths please.
I will need to lengthen my O2 sensors wiring harness due to adding headers. I have some old O2 sensors. Can I just cut the wires from the old ones and solder them together to get the length I need. Obviously, the wire gauge is the same, so the voltage through them should be consistent. Is this ok to do?
The precaution is to not cover the entry point for the wire as this is something like a vent port for the sensor to get fresh air that it uses in it's process. Often that end gets covered with sealer and a brand new sensor will fail.
Drifting
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,695
Likes: 490
From: Denver, NC
I worked with Bosch on O2 projects when I was at Mercury Marine. The O2 sensor gets a reference through the wire. You can't solder the wires of the sensor for several reasons: 1) It blocks the O2 reference, 2) The wires aren't meant to be soldered - they are not copper, 3) Trying to solder the O2 wires to copper wires and there will be dissimilar metals with a current flowing through them - not good in a circuit that operates on millivolts. Plus they won't solder well.
Last edited by Ed Ramberger; Sep 6, 2018 at 11:33 PM.
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 28,472
Likes: 3,290
From: Hartford WI
I don't think the O2 sensor is going to be an issue. I would do the extension with the solder way on the sensor side. I don't want to have an issue with cutting on the engine side if I had a choice. In 5 years, I'd toss the O2 sensor anyways. Now I have a Heated O2 so I had no choice but if I retained the single wire, I'd do it on the sensor side and call it a day.
Race Director
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 17,982
Likes: 1,074
From: Lansing MI
I don't think the O2 sensor is going to be an issue. I would do the extension with the solder way on the sensor side. I don't want to have an issue with cutting on the engine side if I had a choice. In 5 years, I'd toss the O2 sensor anyways. Now I have a Heated O2 so I had no choice but if I retained the single wire, I'd do it on the sensor side and call it a day.
Corvette Stories
The Best of Corvette for Corvette Enthusiasts
Top 10 Most Expensive Corvettes Ever Sold on Bring A Trailer
Brett Foote
10 Things Every Corvette Owner Needs (2026 Edition)
Michael S. Palmer
8 Most "Only Corvette Owners Understand" Quirks and Problems
Pouria Savadkouei
10 Reasons the C6 Z06 is Still A Performance Benchmark After 20 Years
Joe Kucinski
How Much Horsepower Every Corvette Engine "LOST" in 1972
Joe Kucinski
Top 10 DOs and DON'Ts for Protecting Your Convertible Top!
Michael S. Palmer
Top 10 Most Explosive Corvettes Ever Made: Power-to-Weight Ratio Ranked!
Joe Kucinski
150 hp to 1,250 hp: Every Corvette Generation Compared by the Specs That Matter
Joe Kucinski
8 Coolest Corvette Pace Cars (and Replicas) of All Time
Verdad Gallardo
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,577
Likes: 963
From: Communist Colorado
I bought new sensors. Problem there is that the new ones seem to be the same length as the old ones.... about 13" of wire. I havent received them yet, but Ill send them back if they arent ant longer.
If I were going to lengthen the wires, I would use the wiring from the old sensors so it would all be O2 sensor specific wiring. ( I have 4 sensors already) There would be no copper. However, since there could be an issue with voltage, I will not do it.
So if the new ones I bought are still too short, then what are all the LT-5's with headers using to make up the distance needed?
If I were going to lengthen the wires, I would use the wiring from the old sensors so it would all be O2 sensor specific wiring. ( I have 4 sensors already) There would be no copper. However, since there could be an issue with voltage, I will not do it.
So if the new ones I bought are still too short, then what are all the LT-5's with headers using to make up the distance needed?
Racer
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 388
Likes: 116
From: Jackson Michigan
O2 Harnesses
I will need to lengthen my O2 sensors wiring harness due to adding headers. I have some old O2 sensors. Can I just cut the wires from the old ones and solder them together to get the length I need. Obviously, the wire gauge is the same, so the voltage through them should be consistent. Is this ok to do?
Regards,
John
Safety Car
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 4,786
Likes: 425
From: North Georgia, USA
Why not buy a sensor for an alternate application with the same properties, but longer wires?
Although getting an AC-Delco PT2336 (car side wiring pigtail with connector) and splicing/crimping on the connector from an old sensor would make a handy "extension cable."
Although getting an AC-Delco PT2336 (car side wiring pigtail with connector) and splicing/crimping on the connector from an old sensor would make a handy "extension cable."
Last edited by C6_Racer_X; Sep 7, 2018 at 03:23 PM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,098
Likes: 378
From: Las Vegas - Just stop perpetuating myths please.
I bought new sensors. Problem there is that the new ones seem to be the same length as the old ones.... about 13" of wire. I havent received them yet, but Ill send them back if they arent ant longer.
If I were going to lengthen the wires, I would use the wiring from the old sensors so it would all be O2 sensor specific wiring. ( I have 4 sensors already) There would be no copper. However, since there could be an issue with voltage, I will not do it.
So if the new ones I bought are still too short, then what are all the LT-5's with headers using to make up the distance needed?
If I were going to lengthen the wires, I would use the wiring from the old sensors so it would all be O2 sensor specific wiring. ( I have 4 sensors already) There would be no copper. However, since there could be an issue with voltage, I will not do it.
So if the new ones I bought are still too short, then what are all the LT-5's with headers using to make up the distance needed?
Solder does not block any signal and is one of the best conductors we have as it's used on every electronic circuit board on this planet! I have never read of something so rediculous! You should be wary of anyone that would make a claim like that for solder. And even though you will be soldering similar metals, solder can easily weld dissimilar metals. For strength I use J hooks with a little flux - using enough heat is the trick to a good solder joint. And cover a heat shrink for insulation - strong as heck - but remember to slide on the heat shrink before soldering.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 6,113
Likes: 1,994
From: St. Charles MO
Originally Posted by Autotap
The outside of the bulb is exposed to the hot gases in the exhaust while the inside of the bulb is vented internally through the sensor body to the outside atmosphere. Older style oxygen sensors actually have a small hole in the body shell so air can enter the sensor, but newer style O2 sensors "breathe" through their wire connectors and have no vent hole. It's hard to believe, but the tiny amount of space between the insulation and wire provides enough room for air to seep into the sensor (for this reason, grease should never be used on O2 sensor connectors because it can block the flow of air). Venting the sensor through the wires rather than with a hole in the body reduces the risk of dirt or water contamination that could foul the sensor from the inside and cause it to fail. The difference in oxygen levels between the exhaust and outside air within the sensor causes voltage to flow through the ceramic bulb. The greater the difference, the higher the voltage reading.
So considering the above facts, what do you think happens to the supply of outside air flowing between the conductor and insulation if we flow a bunch of solder into that same void?
Solder does not block any signal and is one of the best conductors we have as it's used on every electronic circuit board on this planet!
Also...
solder can easily weld dissimilar metals.
Last edited by MatthewMiller; Sep 9, 2018 at 11:56 AM.
Safety Car
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 4,759
Likes: 1,647
From: Fairfax Virginia
I totally agree with cardoO,
Having extended one or two and swapped ends, I know it can be done. Usually I just buy a new one, you are theoretically supposed to replace the O2 Sensor every 50k miles.
I was surprised at all the people who said "you can't do that". But, alas you cardo0 are correct, you can make extensions since the wire carries less than 2 volts in it signal. Great advice concerning the heat shrink, I use the "marine" kind myself as I drive a C3 Convertible.
The insulation on a O2 sensor does not have any significance or in any way help transfer the ~.75-1.5 signal voltage signal. It is a low voltage signal that goes through the wires whether they are aluminum or copper. I just installed a AEM fuel/Air Ratio gauge which required me to install a harness into my car, the gave me a harness that plugs directly into the O2 sensor. They even told me that you can shorten the harness if you needed to as they give you like 8 feet. If I can shorten one side why not the other? Solder does not weld, it joins things together. The man gave you great advice, don't stick to the air travelling inside the insulation stuff....
It is an electrical Sensor, nothing more, nothing less
Having extended one or two and swapped ends, I know it can be done. Usually I just buy a new one, you are theoretically supposed to replace the O2 Sensor every 50k miles.
I was surprised at all the people who said "you can't do that". But, alas you cardo0 are correct, you can make extensions since the wire carries less than 2 volts in it signal. Great advice concerning the heat shrink, I use the "marine" kind myself as I drive a C3 Convertible.
The insulation on a O2 sensor does not have any significance or in any way help transfer the ~.75-1.5 signal voltage signal. It is a low voltage signal that goes through the wires whether they are aluminum or copper. I just installed a AEM fuel/Air Ratio gauge which required me to install a harness into my car, the gave me a harness that plugs directly into the O2 sensor. They even told me that you can shorten the harness if you needed to as they give you like 8 feet. If I can shorten one side why not the other? Solder does not weld, it joins things together. The man gave you great advice, don't stick to the air travelling inside the insulation stuff....
It is an electrical Sensor, nothing more, nothing less
Last edited by ctmccloskey; Sep 8, 2018 at 03:04 PM. Reason: wrong number
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,577
Likes: 963
From: Communist Colorado
Wow... lots of info here. I appreciate it from everyone.
So over on ZR1Net, I had a great member (Jagdpanzer) pretty much give me a 20" extension. I should get it next week hopefully.
That brings up the question..... if an extension has electrical connectors on 2 sides, wouldnt that be a place where ther would be no airflow under the insulation?
Im in no way trying to be disrespectful to you Matthew.... as you have given me sound advice in the past on suspension questions... Just wondering how that would work...
Thanks!!
So over on ZR1Net, I had a great member (Jagdpanzer) pretty much give me a 20" extension. I should get it next week hopefully.
That brings up the question..... if an extension has electrical connectors on 2 sides, wouldnt that be a place where ther would be no airflow under the insulation?
Im in no way trying to be disrespectful to you Matthew.... as you have given me sound advice in the past on suspension questions... Just wondering how that would work...
Thanks!!
Drifting
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,329
Likes: 17
From: woodbury new jersey
When I put long tubes on my 94, the stock o2 wires weren’t long enough. I cut them and soldered a piece of wire in to make it longer. Iv never had any sort of engine codes or problems from it, been on there about 3 years now.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,098
Likes: 378
From: Las Vegas - Just stop perpetuating myths please.
Wow... lots of info here. I appreciate it from everyone.
So over on ZR1Net, I had a great member (Jagdpanzer) pretty much give me a 20" extension. I should get it next week hopefully.
That brings up the question..... if an extension has electrical connectors on 2 sides, wouldnt that be a place where ther would be no airflow under the insulation?
Im in no way trying to be disrespectful to you Matthew.... as you have given me sound advice in the past on suspension questions... Just wondering how that would work...
Thanks!!
So over on ZR1Net, I had a great member (Jagdpanzer) pretty much give me a 20" extension. I should get it next week hopefully.
That brings up the question..... if an extension has electrical connectors on 2 sides, wouldnt that be a place where ther would be no airflow under the insulation?
Im in no way trying to be disrespectful to you Matthew.... as you have given me sound advice in the past on suspension questions... Just wondering how that would work...
Thanks!!
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 6,113
Likes: 1,994
From: St. Charles MO
Wow... lots of info here. I appreciate it from everyone.
So over on ZR1Net, I had a great member (Jagdpanzer) pretty much give me a 20" extension. I should get it next week hopefully.
That brings up the question..... if an extension has electrical connectors on 2 sides, wouldnt that be a place where ther would be no airflow under the insulation?
Im in no way trying to be disrespectful to you Matthew.... as you have given me sound advice in the past on suspension questions... Just wondering how that would work...
So over on ZR1Net, I had a great member (Jagdpanzer) pretty much give me a 20" extension. I should get it next week hopefully.
That brings up the question..... if an extension has electrical connectors on 2 sides, wouldnt that be a place where ther would be no airflow under the insulation?
Im in no way trying to be disrespectful to you Matthew.... as you have given me sound advice in the past on suspension questions... Just wondering how that would work...
I'm not saying it's guaranteed to block it, but rather that there's a big risk of that happening and ruining a perfectly good sensor. Also, not all sensors use the wire's insulator to get reference air. Apparently newer ones are different. But I've known several people who've soldered extensions on their O2 sensors and they stopped working. Here's another link that references this more directly:
Originally Posted by Auto Service Professionals
In earlier AFR sensors, the sheath around the wiring harness forms a sealed conduit that supplies ambient air to the pump cell. These sensors are vulnerable to contamination, especially if the sheath is damaged (that’s one reason we’re told not to repair the wiring harness).
Newer AFR sensors are configured differently so the sheath is no longer needed. These sensors are different from each other and require different control circuits, so they’re not interchangeable.
Newer AFR sensors are configured differently so the sheath is no longer needed. These sensors are different from each other and require different control circuits, so they’re not interchangeable.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 6,113
Likes: 1,994
From: St. Charles MO
Now we're onto a new subject and you've decided to act like an *** yet again. This, despite the facts that:
- I'm again bringing actual technical citations whereas you've brought nothing but conjecture;
- Ed Ramberger actually worked in the field doing O2 sensor research, and he also posted (post #6) the same thing a couple of us are saying about not cutting and soldering extensions onto the sensor's pigtail (are you really saying he doesn't know what he's talking about, like you tried to do to the industry expert in that last thread?); and
- You don't even understand how an O2 sensor works (thinking that "reference air" means an electrical signal) or what soldering is.
Last edited by MatthewMiller; Sep 9, 2018 at 12:00 PM.
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,577
Likes: 963
From: Communist Colorado
Again, all responses are appreciated... Seems that the opinion on this is about 50/50 I posted on ZR1 Net Registry and its about the same. I was a mechanic professionally many years ago... I remembered learning something about never soldering O2 sensor wiring, which is why I raised the question to begin with. I also think that the air entering the sensor has to be free flowing directly where the wires enter the top of the sensor.. I just purchased new NTK sensors and the directions do mention not to impede air flow at that place on the sensor with grease or sealant of any kind.
But alas... I have purchased the pre made jumper and feel more comfortable using a plug and play piece rather than cobbling something together where milivolts are involved.
Please, no arguing over something like this gents.... were all adults and sometimes we just have differing opinions and have learned a different way..... no use in getting all angry with each other..
Thanks Guys!.
But alas... I have purchased the pre made jumper and feel more comfortable using a plug and play piece rather than cobbling something together where milivolts are involved.
Please, no arguing over something like this gents.... were all adults and sometimes we just have differing opinions and have learned a different way..... no use in getting all angry with each other..
Thanks Guys!.