[QUOTE=84 4+3;1600740121]I was more referring to modded vehicles. Once you factor in headers and different length tubes it'll change. The frequency is exactly the same more or less but you'll also be introducing more so to speak... as far as the tube length yes. It'll resonate at the same frequency still. I was more referring to severity than it being different.

It has been a long time since I did anything regarding waves but I don't remember if volume effected tuning... I would think it would. A larger chamber should in theory need to be shorter to resonate at a certain frequency. That being said i may be thing of subwoofer boxes which is... somewhat different iirc. You're looking for the 180 of what is happening here.

I did have the no drone mufflers on my 84. they really should be called no sound mufflers. They were really quiet but didn't drone not one bit. Perfect for a sleeper though. They seemed to flow reasonably well.[/QUOTE

Perhaps you are right about that.

 

these screen shots should clear things up..

https://play.google.com/store/apps/d...oltz2&hl=en_US

My reference to all v8s being the same frequency is from some reading I have done.. but in the end you measure it yourself to get the drone freq and then do your design. should not require any tuning.. just math.

 

I had the motordyne art pipes and tdx2 on my old 350z, when I read the title I knew exactly what you were talking about

 

Those are nice looking pipes and $689.00. This is what I mean.. corsa is gauging people.. its insanity. I cannot believe there is no competition. I get that the c4 is not exactly a hot car.. but still.. $1500 is insane. That means they want you to spend 20% of the avg value of a c4 just for an exhaust system. 20%.
Someone with the means and resources should fab these and sell them as add ons to whatever muffler you have for $689. I suspect you would be out of stock for the first year.

 

sure if you put on corsa’s smaller 2.5” pipes(vs lt1 exhaust 2.75”) you will have less drone.

 

Corsa has been ripping off c4 owners for years.

when i first joined the forum(2001), you could get that system new for $895.

now, the same system costs what like $1500?

there has been no new R&D on it.

while they make super nice, lightweight titanium systems for c5/6/7 selling for a song, they continue to market the guy who views his c4 as a ‘cruiser’.

 

huh? can you explain further?

 

I totally agree.. but its a supply/demand thing.. if they were not selling the volume they want to sell they would lower the price. What blows me away as I stated earlier is why no one else is doing this.

 

It gets discussed on here a lot. You get what you pay for in fit/finish/performance.

I don't know if I would have went that route out of pocket, but when I looked at the car I was sure happy it was already installed.

 

Sure wish it worked that way

If gas cost what it did in 2001
If I could have bought my home for 2001 prices
If I could buy a steak for what I did in 2001
If I could eat at McDonalds for $4.00 like in 2001
If tires cost what they did in 2001
If Raw Material prices were still at 2001 levels
Luckily my wages aren't the same as 2001 and I would assume yours aren't either.

It is called inflation, coupled with supply and demand and factor in cost of production. Obviously, Raw Material to make the components is higher than 2001. There is down time and cost in set up. It takes the same time to set up no matter if you are setting the jig and CNC benders to run 1, 10 or 100 systems. Part of the increase in cost is, there is a lower number of units sold today. More of the set up and overhead cost go into each system more than in 2001 because each batch run is smaller. Plus it is still in demand as the best bolt on system available (IMO). To be fair as well, the retail price for the same "class" of system on my Challenger was going to be $1900! Sorry prices of the system aren't really tied to the value of the car it gets bolted on but rather based off the cost to actually make something.

Look at a miniram for a TPI. Once you are getting it onto the car you are nearing $2K. Hell, based of your calculation that is dang near 30% of the cost of a reasonable condition C4 TPI car. Is the value of a C4 TPIS or Corsa's fault, no. Though, its a voluntary purchase. If you feel you don't get the value out of a particular product, you don't have to pay the asking price.

 

His point was that you do not get what you pay for. I agree. $1500 is 20% the value of the average c4 value, roughly. You will never see that come back in any small proportion upon resale. So this is not some sort of "investment". If you are a "cruiser" with a couple of Tupperware containers, maybe a socket set and a few screwdrivers to fix some simple household issues in an otherwise empty garage with some disposable income its perfect. Cost is no issue and it pops right in by an installer. Money could have been spent elsewhere like a 3.73 differential that would turn your c4 into a rocket but thats not something the typical "cruiser" spends much time thinking about. So there you are. Not slamming this sort, just it is what it is and that is the market for the corsa.

This is why I posted this video. This is much more align with what the c4 is, a grassroots sportscar. I havent taken the time to get a quote on this modification from a muffler/fab shop but Id venture to guess it could be done with labor for around $500.

Corsa knows its the only show... otherwise they would sell just the mufflers. I dont believe their mid pipe has any influence that the stock does not. Good for them.. I could only dream of having a product like that.. again, I just dont understand why no one offers something like this video turn key.. except I guess the volume wouldnt be there.

 

I hope you understand that basically, unless you have a name in the industry, you will not get money back on most "investments" in your car. Some may return a small percentage others may actually hurt the value of the car and your wallet.

I understood the point very clearly, even pointed out the same for the miniram (or any other intake for that matter). Hell throw wheels in there too or a big brake upgrade. Same-Same.

You are still missing my point. If you have the resources to pull this off at home, you have already invested way more than the cost of a Corsa in your garage. Nothing is free. Ok, unless your buddy has the space and tools for you to borrow. Then you got me. There is no cheaper solution than using equipment for free.

 

You make it sound as if a guy invests in all the equipment neeed just to make an exhaust system. It doesnt work that way. This is why the guy with the empty garage pays for the corsa and anything that might break on his 25 yr old cruiser. Its very expensive to not have those resources and I might add it is much better for the mind to do the hard work. I just ordered an oscilloscope and cant wait to dive into every system on my c4. I could pay someone to fix it next time or invest in my brain cells. Its called learning. granted some prefer to concentrate on their profession.. for some reason I cant seem to do that.. I feel kinda let down about that to be honest. Now we are getting a little philosophical.. I really just posted this for those that didnt want to spend on the corsa, which is precisely what I said shortly after my initial post.. but yet, here we are arguing.. was not my intention.

I got your point "dude", I just dont agree.. its ok that we dont agree, you wont change my mind and I wont change yours. Lets just be friends

 

I get it and I am happy I have reached a point in my life where I often get to make a decision - Pay someone or do it myself. Do I have the time, tools, and knowledge? If yes... then I do it myself. If I don't, do I want to buy the tools (and will I use said tool for other things in the future?), wait until I have time later, or do some studying (Also have to include learning curve for some things)? For example, I don't think you should drop $5000 on parts for your first go at engine assembly.
I think some of this decision depends on the car too. If you have an 88 C4 with 80K miles on it versus a 94 ZR1 with 30K miles.

I can tell you this, make fun of the cruiser all you want, but without them we wouldn't have the hobby we do. Again, type of car comes in to play here, a lot more F-Body owners play with their cars than Corvette owners (I have both). The F-Body guys are always digging in and doing things to their cars. My Corvette club, well I am the youngest member and so far I have only met 2 other guys out of the 110 or so members we have that sit around and talk about how we have torn into these cars. Personally, I am new to the Y-body platform but I still make my decision to do or to pay by the same method. As far as exhaust systems, the Corsa tips are dang nice jewelry and I like the quad tip look. I never faced the decision to buy or not out of pocket. As I said, I was glad it was on the car when I bought it. Looks great, no drone, but a little quiet for my taste. Can probably fix that with a set of Long Tubes if I want to go that route.

 

Not sure why you are saying we are making fun of cruisers. Im not.. im sort of one.. just interested in the technical aspects of the c4. I used to road course race, not interested in spending on that anymore.

as for the jewlery.. same jewlery can be bought for $350.. which is precisely what I did.. so I dont see that as being something exclusive to corsa. Youd have to look for corsa logos to determine if mine were corsa or not.. its all about the drone.. Which is why I posted this video.. its for people who dont want to spend $1500 on corsas. Not sure why you keep debating this.. we have heard your opinions which had no basis, there is no tub to cut away and cost is extremely low. So Im not sure what you are even posting about to be honest.. if you are defending your corsa's ok.. you rule.. you have corsa's.. great.. On top of that you probably got them for free.. yay, good for you.. this isnt about any of that.

Anyway,.. Im going to unsubscribe.. tired of this and dont like being accused of bashing a group when I didnt. I hope what I posted here helps someone who wants to do this.. I know I will be on the lookout for a shop that is interested and will do it right for a fair price. If I didnt lose use of my arm and sell my welder and shop equipment I guarantee you this would be done by now. I HATE DRONE.

 

Price went up again, but in all fairness that is because I said I like them, the person who made the video wanted it to look stock to the outside.

Will be interesting to see what a shop actually charges you.

It's not about Corsa, Borla, Magnaflow, or.. fill in the brand. Its about looking at the true cost of something.

I made my points and you bumped your price. All I am saying at this point besides it being a pretty cool project is there are a lot of factors placing a value on something. Time being one of the factors I think others gloss over to easily. Depending on personal situation, that becomes a very relative value. For me, with young kids it seems my free time comes at a high premium. If they were both out of the house and I didn't have sports practices, homework to help with, music lessons, and miscellaneous school activities I probably wouldn't feel the same.

 

If any of you are unhappy with the "high cost" of the Corsa (or Borla) exhaust systems...don't buy it. Obviously Corsa has a lot of happy customers and positive testimonials or they'd be forced to lower their prices and/or have more sales.

 

Has anyone experimented with drilling about a 1/4" hole on the bottom side of each exhaust pipe leading to the rear mufflers (in same basic area as the Helmholtz additional pipes in posted pics) to see if that reduces the drone??? If that actually worked, OMG the $$$ one could save.

 

We don't believe that would make much of a difference. In order to combat the drone effect, you would need to break up or change the direction of the sound waves the way a hemholtz chamber does.

 

I’ve been waiting for someone to do this on a C4.

it will open up a host of 3” exhaust options without the resonance.

The Y-pipe option doesn’t work from what I’ve read FYI.

GM made a spare tire delete crash bar to rear reinforce the rear end when the spare is missing. You can find them on eBay sometimes.

Its either Helmholtz or Corsa. Btw...Corsa was acquired years ago by Summit Racing, I think, that’s when you saw a large price increase in the system cost.