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I have a modded C4 1990 383 Stroker with Pro-charger with dual inter-cooler, designed and tuned by Greg Caroll. 405 RWD HP 505 RWD torque.
I am having trouble with my 700R4 tranny (again) and I had a friend recommend a 4L80 to swap out as an upgrade. I have a tranny guy saying he can make my 700R4 bullet proof, but for $1000 more I can go wit the 4L80.
Get a good trans guy to build your 700R4. They can be made nearly bulletproof with a lot of history and good parts availability. No transmission is truly bulletproof.
The T700R4 high performance mods cost a packet and do not last to a heap of torque, they may mention hp figures however torque is what accelerates you twists the half shafts like licorice.
The 4L80 is it electronic? they now drop the E for electronic but are electronic when i looked at upgrading transmissions they were rated for 440ft lbs of torque, i looked at the 4L85 which is rated for a bit more torque i was put of by the cost of the conversion with a $600 to $900 control module to drive it.
They are also a bigger / longer transmission so need to confirm it will fit the C4 tunnel and can use the torque beam.
This may now be more affordable and straight forward than years ago, when my T700 next spits the dummy i will be looking more seriously at the newer transmissions.
I do like the six speed auto trans version in my daily drive a 6L80 i think, original trans 220,000kms 12 years old and going strong.
I think the synthetic fluid helps keep them going so long, still shifts and drives like new.
Do your research and hopefully it will be a cost effective option compared to flogging the T700 at the end of its envelope.
The 4L80 are based on the very strong T400 which the hot rodders use but with an overdrive.
I've gone through a number of 700R4s and 4l60es. 7 years ago Carl Rossler built a 4l60e that I have had over a thousand low 10 second runs on. I did break a hardened input shaft initially. That was replaced by a billet input shaft and the transmission has been performing flawlessly ever since.
Just take note and do research about what does retrofit. When you get into things like the 5-pinion planetaries, the oem ones (not AC-Delco, but true oem that has been rebuilt, etc) are stronger. They are available on the web.
There are lots of articles and videos about building high power supporting transmissions in this family. Do yourself a favor and spend some time with Mr. Google and reading about what different companies have been able to do.
I've gone through a number of 700R4s and 4l60es. 7 years ago Carl Rossler built a 4l60e that I have had over a thousand low 10 second runs on. I did break a hardened input shaft initially. That was replaced by a billet input shaft and the transmission has been performing flawlessly ever since.
Do you have an internal parts list that the OP can use to compare to what other people/companies are using to build their transmissions ?
There is a company here in the Akron Ohio area, Gearstar that has lots of very good reviews.
Just take note and do research about what does retrofit. When you get into things like the 5-pinion planetaries, the oem ones (not AC-Delco, but true oem that has been rebuilt, etc) are stronger. They are available on the web.
There are lots of articles and videos about building high power supporting transmissions in this family. Do yourself a favor and spend some time with Mr. Google and reading about what different companies have been able to do.
Do you have an internal parts list that the OP can use to compare to what other people/companies are using to build their transmissions ?
There is a company here in the Akron Ohio area, Gearstar that has lots of very good reviews.
At the time I had a list of upgrades that Rossler performed on the tranny. Not sure that exists now. A lot of what he does is custom built for the application. I know his clutch packs and bands are custom sized while I'm sure other parts are over the counter. Rossler has a great reputation in the drag racing world. I know a 4l80 e can be built much stronger than a 700r4/ 4l60e but for my application, the 4l60e works well without the weight penalty.
Here is a good read about what it takes to put a 4L80 in a C4 corvette. In this it is an E, so the electronics wouldn't be applicable but the C-beam adapter would.
TH700R4 -> 4L60 -> 4L60E
The TH700R4 was renamned 4L60 and the E was added when the gear shifts became computer controlled.
There were no non E version of the 4L80E.
TransGo has a shift kit that converts the 4L80E to full manual and removes computer control.
* Converter lockup. The TH700R4 is ON/OFF, I think that both the 4L60E and 4L80E uses PWM controlled lockup. It is no problem to use ON/OFF control on the 4L80E but lockup will engage hard.
* Force motor. Both the 4L60E and 4L80E use the same part number.
So when connecting a 4L60E controller to a 4L80E transmission it will shift 4-3-2-1 instead of 1-2-3-4.
It is only solenoid B that is inverted, so you could pobably use a relay to invert the signal from a 4L60E controller.
I put 1000HP/1000TQ through a stock 200k mile 4L80e that had nothing more than a $120 Transgo HD2 shift kit in it for 3 years before a loose shifter cable caused a wide open throttle neutral drop and welded the clutches together.
I managed to break them free and got another 3 months out of it before a botched 1-2 shift at the track broke the roller clutch (also my fault).
They're absolutely stronger than the 700 in every way.
If you are considering a 4L80E swap, it is probably because you are tired of breaking / rebuilding the TH700R4 / 4L60 / 4L60E.
You probably have some good power already.
First you need the transmission.
Then you need the adapter for the C-Beam and a new driveshaft.
$350 for a drivehsaft frome Strage.
$650 for the adapter listed above.
The you need to make a custom exhaust to clear the transmission oil pan.
Other than that it will bolt right in and it will fit in the stock tunnel.
The 4L80E is not unbreakable. I had to make a rebuld almost immediately because of stupidity. I used the converter that came with the transmission. It was probably a diesel converter and it did not like RPM.
I bought a multi disk Vigilante back in 2007 and I am still very happy with that. During WOT I lock the converter from second gear.
That is about $1000 for the converter.
Get a 34 element sprag if it is not already in the transmission. It is about $100.
Then you can upgrade a lot of hard parts for $$$ but that is not needed at this level.
So I would say if you start with a good transmission you need at least $2500 in parts for manual shift and add the cost for the controller for automatic mode.
There are other options, I use a MaxxECU system that control both engine and transmission. I like having all the logs in one place. I made the c-beam adapter and exhaust myself so that was a bit less $$ and more hours.
Instead of spending $1400 on the trans controller, convert your engine to 24x and run a Holley Terminator X for the same price. You'll get SIGNIFICANTLY more engine control, and it will do full 4L80e control on top of that.
I used to lock the converter after the 1-2 shift at the track until I snapped a hardened input shaft. The 2-3 shift with the converter locked is pretty brutal on parts. I now lock up after the 2-3 shift even though I am running a billet input shaft. The early lockup is worth about .15 seconds in the quarter for me but I've given that up for reliability.
I used to lock the converter after the 1-2 shift at the track until I snapped a hardened input shaft. The 2-3 shift with the converter locked is pretty brutal on parts. I now lock up after the 2-3 shift even though I am running a billet input shaft. The early lockup is worth about .15 seconds in the quarter for me but I've given that up for reliability.
It does not seem that hard. From my last log it takes about 0.4 seconds from when the clutches start to apply to no slip. Engine rpm drop from 6450 to 4550 during this time. Line pressure at 160 psi.
700 , 4L60 , 4L60E , even stronger 4L65E and the strongest of the 4L 60 family is the 4L70E , the “70” model has the strongest planetary gears of all and a 3/4 deeper Bell Housing for a multi disc lockup unit that can be activated in all gears , 1st , 1st lockup, 2nd gear , 2nd gear lockup ,3rd gear , 3rd gear lockup , 4th gear , 4th lockup’s making it feel like a 7speed ... 4l80’s are nice too and maybe a better gear ratio spread
Here is a good read about what it takes to put a 4L80 in a C4 corvette. In this it is an E, so the electronics wouldn't be applicable but the C-beam adapter would.
the funny thing is, I’m the friend that told him to go 4l80e.
i’m getting ready to put a 4l80e in my 1986. I actually e-mailed Pete about a week ago to purchase that tailshaft, but I haven’t gotten a response from him. Can anyone get ahold of him amd let him know he’s got 2 guys interested in 4l80 tailshafts? I have cash in hand.
I would not use a 4L80E. A 700R4 or 4L60E is going to be lighter, will fit better, will be cheaper and can be made plenty strong for a street application. If you are using stock gears the 700R4/4L60E is going to be a better street transmission with the lower 1st gear too.
If you are using the stock computer I would go with a 700R4. If you are using an aftermarket computer with transmission control available I would consider a 4L60E as an option.
I don't know man I have destroyed TH2004Rs and 700R4's with 300 horsepower small blocks in weeks. I have had a 4L80E in my bbc roller motor 84 ss for a year and it shifts like brand new.
What Tranny ???????
