Good morning all I am chasing a vibration and had my wheels and tires Roadforce balanced and I made a mark where the tire and wheel meet and after the balancing I noticed that none of the beads were broken and no tire was reoriented on wheel. Can this be truley Roadforce balanced? I noticed that the number of weights he installed were similar to the ones that he removed by about 1 or 2 per wheel, and only slightly moved from the original locations. I asked him to write the road force number on each tire on the inside: the rears are 8 and 24 while the fronts were 30 and 31. Can someone shed some light on this encounter? Im trying my best not to listen to the conspiracy theories in my head and fighting the urge to raise hell down at the tire shop… Thanks for any advise

 

Most techs are either too lazy or too ignorant to properly orient the tire on the wheel prior to balancing.

 

Here is the answer. I advised the shop that the tires were still unbalanced, and that none of the beads were broken on any of my 4 wheels/tires that I brought in (I had marked each wheel/tire for just such an inspection), and that I thought that was the idea behind the Roadforce balance. Well, the tech said that Roadforce balance means a spin balance with the use of a big drum to test the “road forces”. He then stated that he wrote the number of roadforce for each tire with a piece of chalk on the inside sidewall indicating it's Roadforce value. I replied, OK but with that value my understanding is that you re-orientate the wheel and tire to match opposing forces to reduce that number. And I told him that none of the beads on my four wheels and tires had been broken and what gives? His response was that procedure is called “Roadforce Matching” and he could not do that because the tires were over 5 years old and he was not supposed to break the bead of an over 5 year old tire. Well this information was not conveyed to me yesterday, so I went ape ****. I kept asking him what exactly he expected me to do with a number written on my tire in chalk. WTF am I going to do with that information? Anyway I got all my money back and gave the folks in the waiting room a bit of a show on cross examining an idiot, but now Im right back to square one. Anyone know where I can get a real technician to do a real Roadforce matching/balancing job in northeast Florida? And if anyone wants to know the name of the Professional Tire Shop that thought I was stupid enough to fall for this BS, just ask me and Ill be happy to tell the world.

 

Yeah, it’s kind of like having a dyno but not tuning.

 

Have you run this car on jack stands (mount the car on jack stands. Put it in drive. Then run it up to 70mph.) like I suggested weeks ago?

 

Yes, a few times. With and without the wheels, new and old wheels, in all 6 gears, up to 83 MPH, with and without the rotors, and oddly enough even ran it without the half shafts, that was only to watch and listen to the prop shaft and diff without the other noise. I noticed nothing out of the ordinary (but im not a professional mechanic). So I took some measurements. At all 4 corners I ran a dial caliper on the hub itself, then with the rotor on, then with the wheel on. No hub or rotor exceeded 5 thousanths radial runnout and no wheel on measurment exceeded 27 thousanths in radial or lateral runnout (I posted the numbers in another thread). The "Roadforce" numbers on all corner starting from the RF going clockwise is 31, 30, 8, and 24. 8 is good, the others can be improved upon. The issue is, no corporate shop will do a Roadforce matching because the tires are over 5 years old and all claim they cannot "dismount" a tire older than 5 years due to liability. I know with that Hunter 9000 machine and someone who gives a damn those numbers absolutely can be improved.

 

If there is any problem with tire balance or road force balance, it will show up on jack stands. Meaning, if you don't have any vibration or significant out-round (visual or measured) on jack stands. Your tire balance and "road force balance" are fine.

 

When I got a road force balance at a local small shop I watched. The tech had to break the bead and move all four tires. A couple he moved twice. You could also send a question to Hunter who makes the machines and ask if the tires always need to be moved. I think they always do. Dan

 

Dan, were they new wheels or new tires? What year car? Thanks, that is exactly what i would have expected. That is a proper Roadforce job. Thanks for the validation!

 

1996 base Corvette. Stock wheels and brand new Continental Extreme Contact Sport tires in bone stock sizes. No vibrations I can feel. Dan

 

This is what my buddy who is a Chevrolet mechanic told me when he road forced balance/matched my tires and rims. A road forced number between 1-10 is perfect and required for low profile tires and sport cars, 11-20 is acceptable for sedans, 21-30 is acceptable for trucks, never for low profile sports cars, anything over 30 is defective and get a new tire. I went through about 8 tires trying to find 4 good tires that he could get balanced . I got 2 tires around 8, 1 around 11, and one around 20. The ride is acceptable but in no way factory smooth. Probably didn't help that they are Nitto tires and discount tire got tired of me swapping out tires.

 

Yonker just described the same situation I dealt with on a new set of all-seasons for my daily driver a few years ago. One tire simply would NOT balance out. Multiple roadforce attempts, re clocked the tire on the rim, no luck. Always jumped anywhere over 55mph. They were surprisingly tolerant of my repeat visits! In the same week I was pursuing a warranty claim with the Mfg, it picked up a screw outside the patchable-zone, and got replaced under roadhazzard warranty instead. 👍 I was unaware of the "Roadforce #'s" but I'll be sure to ask on my next set of performance tires! Different shops might have they're own limits for breaking the bead on a tire, but I've had some pretty old may-pops patched over the years and never encountered that rule before🤔. Def frustrating!