Replacing hard fuel and brake lines
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 44
Likes: 14
From: Lexington, NC
Replacing hard fuel and brake lines
Hi all,
Looking at buying a 93 ZR-1, nice driver but needs a little work. I noticed some corrosion to the hard brake lines and fuel lines that run along the tub. The car seems structurally sound and no evidence of major rust (some basic surface rust, not too concerning on a 31 year old car), but I've had brake lines rust through before which isn't a fun experience.
How much of a nightmare is it to replace all of these? It looks like Zip etc have pre-formed SS kits available.
Also are either of these sets of lines unique to ZR-1 or common to any 93?
Thanks!
Looking at buying a 93 ZR-1, nice driver but needs a little work. I noticed some corrosion to the hard brake lines and fuel lines that run along the tub. The car seems structurally sound and no evidence of major rust (some basic surface rust, not too concerning on a 31 year old car), but I've had brake lines rust through before which isn't a fun experience.
How much of a nightmare is it to replace all of these? It looks like Zip etc have pre-formed SS kits available.
Also are either of these sets of lines unique to ZR-1 or common to any 93?
Thanks!
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 25,398
Likes: 2,742
Brake hard lines would be the same and the fuel lines up to the filter. From filter to the fuel rails would be different. I understand it's NOT a pleasant experience on a C4.
I wouldn't think that ZIP would be a preferred vendor but if you've a relationship with them then it very well might be.
I wouldn't think that ZIP would be a preferred vendor but if you've a relationship with them then it very well might be.
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 44
Likes: 14
From: Lexington, NC
I haven't dealt much with Corvette suppliers since working on my dad's (now brother's) 66 over 20 years ago, back then I thought ZIP was pretty good, but I'm certainly open to suggestion as to who is better now.
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 25,398
Likes: 2,742
I didn't mention better. That's an assumption you seem to have assumed. I did mention doubting being a preferred choice.
Instructor
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 162
Likes: 104
From: St. Paul, MN
Fuel lines are very difficult to replace unless you remove the differential (at a minimum sag it) and have the rear bumper off the car. Maybe it could be done without doing those things but it would not be easy
Safety Car
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 4,564
Likes: 1,676
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 25,398
Likes: 2,742
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,225
Likes: 1,080
From: South Florida
Two ways I would attempt this
1. Try to get a mint set of factory lines from a donor
2. Spend the $$ to get the highest quality set of line forming tools and flare tooling and do it right, take the week or month or whatever to pull everything down and re-shape nice
Somethings to remember
-consider using riv-nuts to make new bracket points for easier install or service
-consider using new brackets from other OEM quality vehicles to make life easier and lines more reliable
-the flaring has to be very good and now is your chance to do something with the fitting styles if you want something simpler
1. Try to get a mint set of factory lines from a donor
2. Spend the $$ to get the highest quality set of line forming tools and flare tooling and do it right, take the week or month or whatever to pull everything down and re-shape nice
Somethings to remember
-consider using riv-nuts to make new bracket points for easier install or service
-consider using new brackets from other OEM quality vehicles to make life easier and lines more reliable
-the flaring has to be very good and now is your chance to do something with the fitting styles if you want something simpler
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Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 44
Likes: 14
From: Lexington, NC
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 44
Likes: 14
From: Lexington, NC
Two ways I would attempt this
1. Try to get a mint set of factory lines from a donor
2. Spend the $$ to get the highest quality set of line forming tools and flare tooling and do it right, take the week or month or whatever to pull everything down and re-shape nice
Somethings to remember
-consider using riv-nuts to make new bracket points for easier install or service
-consider using new brackets from other OEM quality vehicles to make life easier and lines more reliable
-the flaring has to be very good and now is your chance to do something with the fitting styles if you want something simpler
1. Try to get a mint set of factory lines from a donor
2. Spend the $$ to get the highest quality set of line forming tools and flare tooling and do it right, take the week or month or whatever to pull everything down and re-shape nice
Somethings to remember
-consider using riv-nuts to make new bracket points for easier install or service
-consider using new brackets from other OEM quality vehicles to make life easier and lines more reliable
-the flaring has to be very good and now is your chance to do something with the fitting styles if you want something simpler
I made CuNiFer hard lines for my Jag XK140 but that's because it's all non-standard stuff so there were no kits available. It was pretty easy, but you're implying the ZR-1 fittings are more complex than usual somehow? I'm just a little lost at the implications here.
Safety Car
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 4,564
Likes: 1,676
Is the implication here that ZR-1 lines are unavailable? Are there suppliers with unique ZR-1 stuff? I did notice the places I'm used to (Zip, Ecklers, Corvette Central) don't seem to seperate ZR-1 stuff out, though the Ecklers brake line kit did say it fit ZR-1.
I made CuNiFer hard lines for my Jag XK140 but that's because it's all non-standard stuff so there were no kits available. It was pretty easy, but you're implying the ZR-1 fittings are more complex than usual somehow? I'm just a little lost at the implications here.
I made CuNiFer hard lines for my Jag XK140 but that's because it's all non-standard stuff so there were no kits available. It was pretty easy, but you're implying the ZR-1 fittings are more complex than usual somehow? I'm just a little lost at the implications here.
NOS or off the shelf ready to go:
ZR-1 for brake. Unavailable
ZR-1 for fuel. For tank to filter, same as a base car. From filer to rail, unavailable.
Realistically you can make your own. As mentioned you need the tubing and the tools.
I have bought good used fuel lines from a salvage yard and installed. And yes you need to drop the tank and lower the diff on the passenger side.
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,972
Likes: 243
I don’t have anything to add to help the OP current issue, but can offer a preventative note: Fluid Film. I’ve become a big fan of the stuff. I coat every single bit of my trucks underside with it and it’s really helped the frame survive (late 2nd gen Tacoma which are know for rusted out frames). On the C4, I don’t go wild because it is messy stuff and I don’t drive it in salted roads. I lightly hit the brake and fuel lines annually to keep them protected. A bit of the frame too, but again pretty modest amount as it doesn’t see winter roads (or rain to be honest) so a little lasts a very long time.
Oil Producer
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 9,377
Likes: 2,737
ive had rust like that on an old 86 that was from the east coast and had high klm.
I found that a mild steel brush after spraying with pentrating fluid (fluid film for example, personally i use a 50/50 mix of atf and acetone) would get rid of the surface rust and show if there was any deep pitting. In my case i lucked out, it was all surface rust and there very minimal surface texture (no pitting). At least for comfor purposes you could attempt to get a handle on if this is deep putting or just surface corrosion.
I found that a mild steel brush after spraying with pentrating fluid (fluid film for example, personally i use a 50/50 mix of atf and acetone) would get rid of the surface rust and show if there was any deep pitting. In my case i lucked out, it was all surface rust and there very minimal surface texture (no pitting). At least for comfor purposes you could attempt to get a handle on if this is deep putting or just surface corrosion.
Safety Car
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 3,723
Likes: 557
From: Seattle Washington
Rust is an 8 to 1 Ratio. So, if the rust was 1 inch high it would pit the metal 1/8 inch. I would not be replacing the lines in the picture. I replaced one of mine and I would not wish that project one anyone. The fuel lines must have been the first part they assembled and then they built the rest of the car around them.
Oil Producer
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 9,377
Likes: 2,737
OP, one thing you can do, is spray the lines with a very strong “lime licker” type cleaning solution. Lime licker is a local to me brand and it converts rust to ironphosphate which is inert. A few spray sessions under the car and it woukd convert that, slowly and safely. Then put some oil of some kind on it.
cheers and good luck.
cheers and good luck.
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,225
Likes: 1,080
From: South Florida
Those lines are pretty need of replacing.
This is my idea of a middle ground solution for lines that are extremely difficult to source and have troublesome bending and shapes, you can simply add new mounting points and new lines run differently. While you decide how to replace the original lines this can make your vehicle drivable and reliable again. And could simply replace the original lines.
Here is my example car
The line you can buy at any auto store. It can be cut and flared as usual, just be sure to clean it for burrs and wash it out good before use.
The mounting rubbers from Junkyard vehicles - go take a variety and use what works best.
They are riv-nut to the chassis with steel inserts.
Ends use 6AN Braided Stainless with quality hose clamps, track legal and more reliable than AN fittings fwiw.
This way you can drive the vehicle with clean fuel lines, keep the engine clean is best. And having hardline, properly mounted and bolted to the chassis.
This is my idea of a middle ground solution for lines that are extremely difficult to source and have troublesome bending and shapes, you can simply add new mounting points and new lines run differently. While you decide how to replace the original lines this can make your vehicle drivable and reliable again. And could simply replace the original lines.
Here is my example car
The line you can buy at any auto store. It can be cut and flared as usual, just be sure to clean it for burrs and wash it out good before use.
The mounting rubbers from Junkyard vehicles - go take a variety and use what works best.
They are riv-nut to the chassis with steel inserts.
Ends use 6AN Braided Stainless with quality hose clamps, track legal and more reliable than AN fittings fwiw.
This way you can drive the vehicle with clean fuel lines, keep the engine clean is best. And having hardline, properly mounted and bolted to the chassis.
Oil Producer
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 9,377
Likes: 2,737
Rust is an 8 to 1 Ratio. So, if the rust was 1 inch high it would pit the metal 1/8 inch. I would not be replacing the lines in the picture. I replaced one of mine and I would not wish that project one anyone. The fuel lines must have been the first part they assembled and then they built the rest of the car around them.
id at least use something to agitate the scale and see how bad it really is. i cant tell 100% from the oics but i would lean towards not replacing them too