Improvement with Hooker LT's??
Race Director
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 14,165
Likes: 9
Originally Posted by bogus
I believe that daily driven cars must be emissions legal. It is our CIVIC duty to make sure we are not making the environment any worse than it already is.
It's when you boil it down, it's all about money.
A NASCAR will easily run as many miles in a single race as I do in 6 months, while dumping unheard of amounts of pollutants into the air, yet nobody seems to have a problem with this.
The whole system is flawed. You may not like my car because it doesn't have cats on it, but I promise you it pollutes a lot less than a lot of "legal" cars here in KY do.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 40,156
Likes: 45
From: San Pedro CA
Originally Posted by Nathan Plemons
A top fuel dragster is nice too. Quite possibly the loudest thing I've ever heard in my life. If you've never seen a true top fuel car run it's certainly worth going at least once.
The loudest thing I have ever heard? A Lockheed C-5 Galaxy... them big assed GE Turbofans will rip you like nothing I have ever heard.
To compare - start a quiet car, then turn the key back to start, you hear that nasty gear gnashing sound? ok, record that... make a long loop and put it through a CD player attached to a 5000 watt marshall half stack, turned up to 11. Stand 3' away. You are now getting close to how loud a C-5 is on take off from 100' away. Just deafening.
Drifting
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,485
Likes: 2
From: Champaign, IL
St. Jude Donor '05
Originally Posted by Nathan Plemons
In that case have you listend to the sound file on my web page of my car running open headers? I forgot exactly why I had the exhaust off of it but I just couldn't resist to fire it up and make a recording. Unfortunately my recording media didn't capture the bass note, but you get the idea.
http://www.wku.edu/~nathan.plemons/s...en_headers.mp3
http://www.wku.edu/~nathan.plemons/s...en_headers.mp3
As a matter of fact I've listened to all your sound clips ... in the office ... grinning from ear to ear ... finish my $%#@ car already I can't wait! 
Large Impressive Member
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 65,811
Likes: 71
From: Good health is merely the slowest possible rate at which one can die
St. Jude Donor '04-'05-'06-'07
Originally Posted by Nathan Plemons
A top fuel dragster is nice too. Quite possibly the loudest thing I've ever heard in my life.
Race Director
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 14,165
Likes: 9
I have many fond memories of the innaugural first run of a car that we've put headers on. Of course we usually finish up a project at about 3 AM. It's fun to tear out of the neighborhood at that time running open headers. Did I mention the neighbors hated us?
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 7,080
Likes: 0
From: Corvette valley Georgia
St. Jude Donor '06
Originally Posted by bogus
You have nailed the problem, the inconsistancy, that is CARB.
But EO numbers don't effect the rest of the country... what bothers me is the lack of a federal mandate for testing... and compliance. How FL can get away with it (yea, I know, they have "cleaner" air, but those gases have to go somewhere), and how the polution problem is viewed as a local problem, not a national issue. Seems somehow unfair...
If every jurisdiction had simple sniff tests and visual inspections, then I think the national air quality, nay, the global air quality, would improve dramatically.
I am not professing that CARB is needed or required in its present beaurocratic mess of an existance. It needs to be revamped to address changes in technology... specifically, aftermarket technologies.
For example, if I wanted to run long tubes with high flow cats, just because they relocated the factory cats, I am illegal. however, if I was allowed to run this, under the onus of having to pass a sniff every year, then so be it, I would. It would be a fair exchange....
I believe that daily driven cars must be emissions legal. It is our CIVIC duty to make sure we are not making the environment any worse than it already is.
But EO numbers don't effect the rest of the country... what bothers me is the lack of a federal mandate for testing... and compliance. How FL can get away with it (yea, I know, they have "cleaner" air, but those gases have to go somewhere), and how the polution problem is viewed as a local problem, not a national issue. Seems somehow unfair...
If every jurisdiction had simple sniff tests and visual inspections, then I think the national air quality, nay, the global air quality, would improve dramatically.
I am not professing that CARB is needed or required in its present beaurocratic mess of an existance. It needs to be revamped to address changes in technology... specifically, aftermarket technologies.
For example, if I wanted to run long tubes with high flow cats, just because they relocated the factory cats, I am illegal. however, if I was allowed to run this, under the onus of having to pass a sniff every year, then so be it, I would. It would be a fair exchange....
I believe that daily driven cars must be emissions legal. It is our CIVIC duty to make sure we are not making the environment any worse than it already is.
If Kalifornia would wave the CARB restrictions and let all mods be legal as long as they met the fed emission standards with a ANNUAL check, I think the hot rodders would be happy(I would).But the OEM lobby is way too strong as they would lose alot of money due to the loss of sales of replacement parts. So its politics as usual here.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 40,156
Likes: 45
From: San Pedro CA
Originally Posted by grapeknutz
If Kalifornia would wave the CARB restrictions and let all mods be legal as long as they met the fed emission standards with a ANNUAL check, I think the hot rodders would be happy(I would).But the OEM lobby is way too strong as they would lose alot of money due to the loss of sales of replacement parts. So its politics as usual here.Do you think the CPA is going to buy LT's?
I doubt it... the hot rodders are still an automotive minority...
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 7,080
Likes: 0
From: Corvette valley Georgia
St. Jude Donor '06
Originally Posted by bogus
That's where SEMA comes in... Sure, the OEM might lose SOME money, but its fractional. Do you really think your average Dr is gonna get a Random Tech cat for his BMW, or a new cat, or, hell, a new car?
Do you think the CPA is going to buy LT's?
I doubt it... the hot rodders are still an automotive minority...
Do you think the CPA is going to buy LT's?
I doubt it... the hot rodders are still an automotive minority...
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Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 40,156
Likes: 45
From: San Pedro CA
Originally Posted by grapeknutz
The OEM has in fact lobbied the legislature to make OBD 2 non stock cats illegal, so its not so fractional, Some time check the OEMs political campaign contributions to the legislatures that are now in power.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,178
Likes: 1
From: Bahston Mass.
I gotta go with Bogus on this one.. The minimal amount of power you'll pick up, if any, would not make it worth the damaging effects to the ozone. Sure, one car isn't going to kill the world and make birds start dropping out of the sky, but time & the masses of non catalytic-converter equipped cars will eventually take its toll... I'm the farthest thing from a tree hugger, but I am concerned about what my kids & grandkids will be breathing years from now.
Get a set of hi-flow converters, keep it legal, and pick up the extra power at the same time. Around here, the fines are too huge to even RISK running without a converter... I'll be putting hi-flows on my car once the long tubes get put on. Check back a couple of weeks, there was a picture posted of a users header / cat install that came out REALLY nice
By the way Nathan - those sound clips are music to my ears - I just can't imagine why your neighbors could get mad hearing your car at 3AM??
I'd get arrested the first 1/4 mile on my way to work!!
Get a set of hi-flow converters, keep it legal, and pick up the extra power at the same time. Around here, the fines are too huge to even RISK running without a converter... I'll be putting hi-flows on my car once the long tubes get put on. Check back a couple of weeks, there was a picture posted of a users header / cat install that came out REALLY nice
By the way Nathan - those sound clips are music to my ears - I just can't imagine why your neighbors could get mad hearing your car at 3AM??
I'd get arrested the first 1/4 mile on my way to work!!