APS TT or TTiX Setup?
Pro
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 555
Likes: 0
From: Moline IL
Originally Posted by APS
The LPE Garrett turbos are true dual ball bearing turbochargers (same as APS utilize in the APS C6 twin turbo system), that's 100% correct. The Turbonetics turbos are a half ball bearing turbo, not a true dual ball bearing turbo. 
Peter
Peter
Each manufacturer has their own spin (no pun intended) on what a "ball bearing" turbocharger is. To my knowledge, Turbonetics does not offer ANY dual ball bearing turbochargers. And, I don't think Garrett offers any single ball bearing turbos.
I've often wondered if Turbonetics doesn't make dual ball bearing turbos because they would be infringing on a Garrett patent (assuming Garrett got there first)???
Also, I'm not sure what kind of service parts are available for the Garrett dual ball bearing turbos, but the only way you can get a Turbonetics ball bearing turbo repaired is in house at their main facility in CA. There are no "authorized repair centers" and there are no parts available to anyone.
Former Vendor
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,849
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Originally Posted by NassauBlue98
Each manufacturer has their own spin (no pun intended) on what a "ball bearing" turbocharger is. To my knowledge, Turbonetics does not offer ANY dual ball bearing turbochargers. And, I don't think Garrett offers any single ball bearing turbos.
Peter
Drifting
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,590
Likes: 5
From: Forsyth Illinois
Originally Posted by APS
The LPE Garrett turbos are true dual ball bearing turbochargers (same as APS utilize in the APS C6 twin turbo system), that's 100% correct. The Turbonetics turbos are a half ball bearing turbo, not a true dual ball bearing turbo.
Peter
Peter
Supporting Vendor
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 6,486
Likes: 2
From: http://www.mphparts.com 800-364-1975
Originally Posted by VET IT B
Why are the C6 a true BB turbo and the C5 not? Can, or do you offer a true BB turbo for the C5?
Former Vendor
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,849
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by VET IT B
Can, or do you offer a true BB turbo for the C5?
Peter
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Drifting
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,590
Likes: 5
From: Forsyth Illinois
Originally Posted by APS
We don't right now as APS see's no real need as the stock APS turbos in the C5 twin turbo system are capable of producing around 800 - 850 whp.
Peter
Peter
Mark
Pro
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 607
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by APS
We don't right now as APS see's no real need as the stock APS turbos in the C5 twin turbo system are capable of producing around 800 - 850 whp.
Peter
Peter
We want to know how much to upgrade to BB turbos for the C5 kit.
Please tell the few of us that do "see the need" for BB turbos how much are you going to charge us.
Thanks.
Supporting Vendor
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 6,486
Likes: 2
From: http://www.mphparts.com 800-364-1975
Originally Posted by APS
We don't right now as APS see's no real need as the stock APS turbos in the C5 twin turbo system are capable of producing around 800 - 850 whp.
Peter
Peter
Am I correct in saying that peak horsepower shouldn't change between journal and ball bearing turbos... but area under the curve and longevity would?
http://www.airpowersystems.com.au/wrx/aps_turbo.htm
About 1/2 of the way down on that page there is some info on why ball bearings are desirable.
Former Vendor
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,849
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Originally Posted by VET IT B
I understand about the capableaty of the turbos, what about the longevity?
Many famous brands of ball bearing turbos are NOT rebuildable and the ball bearing turbo manufucturers don't or won't supply turbo overhaul kits..................that's worth keeping in mind.
Peter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 3,426
Likes: 0
From: Toronto Ontario
Its to bad no one has come out a kit which would utilize the true ball bearing turbo charger and tubular exhaust manifolds for the c5. I am SURE there is a big market for a high end kit which could compete with APS or TTiX pricing.
Drifting
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,590
Likes: 5
From: Forsyth Illinois
Originally Posted by diynoob
Am I correct in saying that peak horsepower shouldn't change between journal and ball bearing turbos... but area under the curve and longevity would?
http://www.airpowersystems.com.au/wrx/aps_turbo.htm
About 1/2 of the way down on that page there is some info on why ball bearings are desirable.
http://www.airpowersystems.com.au/wrx/aps_turbo.htm
About 1/2 of the way down on that page there is some info on why ball bearings are desirable.
Former Vendor
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,849
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by 1k
Peter,
We want to know how much to upgrade to BB turbos for the C5 kit.
Please tell the few of us that do "see the need" for BB turbos how much are you going to charge us.
Thanks.
We want to know how much to upgrade to BB turbos for the C5 kit.
Please tell the few of us that do "see the need" for BB turbos how much are you going to charge us.
Thanks.
Peter
Pro
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 607
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by APS
I'd back the long term reliability of the Mitsubishi produced liquid cooled gas spec inconel 713C turbo against virtually any other production turbocharger on the planet.That said the GT true dual ball bearing turbo may have a longer service life though can't be overhauled easily if at all. One big bonus is Mitsubishi precison gas spec turbos can be rebuilt/overhauled when required.
Many famous brands of ball bearing turbos are NOT rebuildable and the ball bearing turbo manufucturers don't or won't supply turbo overhaul kits..................that's worth keeping in mind.
Peter
Many famous brands of ball bearing turbos are NOT rebuildable and the ball bearing turbo manufucturers don't or won't supply turbo overhaul kits..................that's worth keeping in mind.
Peter
Ok then.
In addition to the original question:
(How much more $$$ to upgrade to BB turbos for the C5 kit),
Why did APS release the C6 with Ball Bearings and the C5 kit with Journals?
Former Vendor
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,849
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by 1k
Ok then.
In addition to the original question:
(How much more $$$ to upgrade to BB turbos for the C5 kit),
In addition to the original question:
(How much more $$$ to upgrade to BB turbos for the C5 kit),
Garrett GT DBB turbos are not field rebuildable and this has certainly influenced our decison on turbocharger model choice.
Peter
Pro
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 607
Likes: 0
I am genuinely apologize.
I'm just not getting it.
Can you please explain your answer in detail so I can understand?
Why did APS release the C6 with Ball Bearings and the C5 kit with Journals?
If one type of turbo is better,
why didn't release both kits with that style turbo?
Thank you.
I'm just not getting it.
Can you please explain your answer in detail so I can understand?
Why did APS release the C6 with Ball Bearings and the C5 kit with Journals?
If one type of turbo is better,
why didn't release both kits with that style turbo?
Thank you.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 3,426
Likes: 0
From: Toronto Ontario
Originally Posted by APS
Not going to happen unless there's significant market demand into the future. APS engineers are exceptionally pleased with the Mitsubishi gas spec liquid cooled turbo performance and APS engineers consider future serviceability to be important to many customers.
Garrett GT DBB turbos are not field rebuildable and this has certainly influenced our decison on turbocharger model choice.
Peter
Garrett GT DBB turbos are not field rebuildable and this has certainly influenced our decison on turbocharger model choice.
Peter