[Advice] Forged short block - sources?
03-19-2018, 10:39 AM
#1
Team Owner
Thread Starter
[Advice] Forged short block - sources?
Hey all -
I have a sneaking suspicion my short block wont last long with my current set up. I'm teetering on ~700hp (600 wheel) on a 100% original long block. Has a cam and valve train but the heads have never been off the car.
Anyone have a good experience with any vendors on a forged short or long block? Prefer a forged crank w forged rods and pistons with FI gapping.
Not interested in building it myself. Just peeking around at options right now as I actually have a little money right now.
**EDIT**
Just looking for a stock cube LS1, nothing crazy. Once I go forged I'll go from ~10 psi to ~13-15. FI is a A&A V3si.
I have a sneaking suspicion my short block wont last long with my current set up. I'm teetering on ~700hp (600 wheel) on a 100% original long block. Has a cam and valve train but the heads have never been off the car.
Anyone have a good experience with any vendors on a forged short or long block? Prefer a forged crank w forged rods and pistons with FI gapping.
Not interested in building it myself. Just peeking around at options right now as I actually have a little money right now.
**EDIT**
Just looking for a stock cube LS1, nothing crazy. Once I go forged I'll go from ~10 psi to ~13-15. FI is a A&A V3si.
Last edited by Chevy Guy; 03-19-2018 at 10:43 AM.
03-19-2018, 02:51 PM
#2
Melting Slicks
Mike with Race Engine Shop built mine and he is great to work with.
Last edited by Turpid porpoise; 03-19-2018 at 02:51 PM.
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Chevy Guy (03-20-2018)
03-19-2018, 03:32 PM
#3
Melting Slicks
If it's tuned well, your short block may last a very long time at 600rwhp. Especially if you don't beat the snot out of it on every drive.
Also, 13-15psi is a lot of out the v3 SI. I have that blower as well with a forged short block at 638rwp, 12psi (3.4pulley), and a blower cam. I'm practically overspinning the blower as is when revving out to 7k. You risk losing the internal oil slinger when overspinning the V3 SI. It's a bit safer when it's externally fed the oil.
Also, 13-15psi is a lot of out the v3 SI. I have that blower as well with a forged short block at 638rwp, 12psi (3.4pulley), and a blower cam. I'm practically overspinning the blower as is when revving out to 7k. You risk losing the internal oil slinger when overspinning the V3 SI. It's a bit safer when it's externally fed the oil.
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Chevy Guy (03-20-2018)
03-19-2018, 04:22 PM
#4
Another Vote for Mike @ The Race engine Shop.. Has been a member on this forum for over a decade and has done tons of high end 1000+hp engine builds for many of us. Good guy to deal with, will shoot you straight based on your goals. He is running a big sale right now too. Damn near giving the parts away!
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Chevy Guy (03-20-2018)
03-20-2018, 07:21 AM
#5
Team Owner
Thread Starter
Mike with Race Engine Shop built mine and he is great to work with.
If it's tuned well, your short block may last a very long time at 600rwhp. Especially if you don't beat the snot out of it on every drive.
Also, 13-15psi is a lot of out the v3 SI. I have that blower as well with a forged short block at 638rwp, 12psi (3.4pulley), and a blower cam. I'm practically overspinning the blower as is when revving out to 7k. You risk losing the internal oil slinger when overspinning the V3 SI. It's a bit safer when it's externally fed the oil.
Also, 13-15psi is a lot of out the v3 SI. I have that blower as well with a forged short block at 638rwp, 12psi (3.4pulley), and a blower cam. I'm practically overspinning the blower as is when revving out to 7k. You risk losing the internal oil slinger when overspinning the V3 SI. It's a bit safer when it's externally fed the oil.
Another Vote for Mike @ The Race engine Shop.. Has been a member on this forum for over a decade and has done tons of high end 1000+hp engine builds for many of us. Good guy to deal with, will shoot you straight based on your goals. He is running a big sale right now too. Damn near giving the parts away!
Thanks! I'll check him out.
Last edited by Chevy Guy; 03-22-2018 at 03:32 PM.
03-20-2018, 05:18 PM
#7
Do you like generic cookie cutter engines? Because that is where you get generic
cookie cutter engines.....
Last edited by TTBlueZ06; 03-20-2018 at 05:20 PM.
03-20-2018, 10:02 PM
#9
Burning Brakes
I’ve had good luck with my AES built longblock. BUT I haven’t even tried to lean on it, yet.... I’m at a conservative 700 RWHP...
Last edited by junk c5; 03-20-2018 at 10:03 PM.
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Chevy Guy (03-22-2018)
03-21-2018, 10:27 AM
#11
Melting Slicks
The OP is not looking for a 1000HP build. He is currently at 600whp and wants to increase 3-5 more psi...so...650-725 whp? There is nothing wrong with those other shops so not sure why you feel the need to bash them.
03-21-2018, 10:34 AM
#12
Oh really? Nothing wrong huh?
Have you ever taken a TMS or TSP engine apart and measured the mains, rod ends, and bores? I doubt it. If you did you would see that not all engines are created equal and when you are a engine mill that pumps out quantity, you don't have the same quality control as a small shop that does custom one off builds all the time.
Do people still really use the word "bash"? If you want to funnel your money into some cookie cutter trash, that's your business. But I wouldn't be giving advice if you have never torn one down and seen the difference between good machine work and good enough machine work.
03-21-2018, 12:15 PM
#13
For stock cube LS1, nothing crazy Thompson Motor Sport is offering for $2,8K forged is the way to go.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/LS1-LS6-Alu...AAAMXQ8odRHA0B
I don't understand why the argument, ..... The guy is asking for vendors recommendation, everybody express they opinion. I have no doubts Mike from Race Engine Shop build great engines but so does Texas Speed, Thompson Motor Sports and others. Can we all just get along ? ... Thanks!!
As a matter of fact, I'm on the same position as you but if something goes wrong with my source I can't afford to pay labor twice so my tuner is getting me the engine from Texas Speed, since he is the one doing the labor I'm just letting him pick the source but he is giving me warranty.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/LS1-LS6-Alu...AAAMXQ8odRHA0B
I don't understand why the argument, ..... The guy is asking for vendors recommendation, everybody express they opinion. I have no doubts Mike from Race Engine Shop build great engines but so does Texas Speed, Thompson Motor Sports and others. Can we all just get along ? ... Thanks!!
As a matter of fact, I'm on the same position as you but if something goes wrong with my source I can't afford to pay labor twice so my tuner is getting me the engine from Texas Speed, since he is the one doing the labor I'm just letting him pick the source but he is giving me warranty.
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Chevy Guy (03-22-2018)
03-21-2018, 08:49 PM
#14
Safety Car
Good experience with LME. I will buy from them again. Bad experience with Thompson TMS, they will never see another dime from me. We opened up a motor that hurt a piston (our fault) and found some cheap $20 bearings when it clearly advertised King race bearings. Also didn't get the Diamond pistons that were advertised but Probe instead. When I reported my findings, they tried to downplay it, and the only way they would rectify, was if we sent the whole thing back at over $500 round trip shipping. Instead I spent $200 on good bearings, replaced a piston and did it myself. The so called warranty was worthless in this case. Who knows what other corners they cut.
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03-22-2018, 03:31 PM
#15
Team Owner
Thread Starter
For stock cube LS1, nothing crazy Thompson Motor Sport is offering for $2,8K forged is the way to go.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/LS1-LS6-Alu...AAAMXQ8odRHA0B
I don't understand why the argument, ..... The guy is asking for vendors recommendation, everybody express they opinion. I have no doubts Mike from Race Engine Shop build great engines but so does Texas Speed, Thompson Motor Sports and others. Can we all just get along ? ... Thanks!!
As a matter of fact, I'm on the same position as you but if something goes wrong with my source I can't afford to pay labor twice so my tuner is getting me the engine from Texas Speed, since he is the one doing the labor I'm just letting him pick the source but he is giving me warranty.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/LS1-LS6-Alu...AAAMXQ8odRHA0B
I don't understand why the argument, ..... The guy is asking for vendors recommendation, everybody express they opinion. I have no doubts Mike from Race Engine Shop build great engines but so does Texas Speed, Thompson Motor Sports and others. Can we all just get along ? ... Thanks!!
As a matter of fact, I'm on the same position as you but if something goes wrong with my source I can't afford to pay labor twice so my tuner is getting me the engine from Texas Speed, since he is the one doing the labor I'm just letting him pick the source but he is giving me warranty.
It's aluminum, but not really an LS1/6, it does share the same bore so there may be no difference at all.
Id like something with forged rods too, maybe even crank - but that might be overkill.
03-22-2018, 03:39 PM
#16
Melting Slicks
Interesting - they seem to use the L33 5.3 blocks in their engines, any idea why?
It's aluminum, but not really an LS1/6, it does share the same bore so there may be no difference at all.
Id like something with forged rods too, maybe even crank - but that might be overkill.
It's aluminum, but not really an LS1/6, it does share the same bore so there may be no difference at all.
Id like something with forged rods too, maybe even crank - but that might be overkill.
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Chevy Guy (03-22-2018)
03-22-2018, 09:14 PM
#17
Do people still really use the word "bash"? If you want to funnel your money into some cookie cutter trash, that's your business. But I wouldn't be giving advice if you have never torn one down and seen the difference between good machine work and good enough machine work.
You sound like you got burned by one of them. I have heard the TMS is good and has great customer service until this thread.
I consider TSP the Walmart of the LSX world.
03-22-2018, 10:51 PM
#18
Drifting
03-23-2018, 09:48 AM
#19
Interesting - they seem to use the L33 5.3 blocks in their engines, any idea why?
It's aluminum, but not really an LS1/6, it does share the same bore so there may be no difference at all.
Id like something with forged rods too, maybe even crank - but that might be overkill.
It's aluminum, but not really an LS1/6, it does share the same bore so there may be no difference at all.
Id like something with forged rods too, maybe even crank - but that might be overkill.
I'd keep it Al and do a ls2 block based setup with the stock bore/stroke. If you have the extra money maybe do a LSA with piston squirters. With a forged rotating assembly it should last a very long time at your power level.
I've heard people complain about literally every engine builder on here. Some of them tell you to pound sand if there's an issue but the good ones will work with you.
Last edited by ysb02; 03-23-2018 at 09:48 AM.
03-26-2018, 11:48 PM
#20
Former Vendor
Thanks for the vote of confidence to those who have worked with us. I agree with Just about everyone in this thread. Ask a bunch of people the same question (especially an opinionated question) and get a bunch of diffeeent answers.
I also agree that the difference between a good and bad Shop is how they handle failures. I’ll be the first to admit I’ve messed up before. In fact there is a member on these very forums who I messed up his Engine and I’m dealing with it now. We were able to figure out that I was 100% at fault so I payed for his engine R&R, return and re return to him shipping as well as all the parts. Basically when it’s said and done, I will have paid him to allow me to build this engine in exchange he paid with time and probably a slight headache. In fact he will probably read this and text me. (Still waiting on your pistons bud). On the opposite end of that spectrum, I think it’s note worthy to say. We all love High Performance Stuff! So though I make my living off another mans hobby. The way I feel about how to handle a situation where the customer breaks an engine because of his own doing; don’t mean the engine builder needs to take him to the cleaners either. There’s nothing wrong with throwing a little discount to help a guy get back going. To me it shows a little compassion ya know!
anyway ive seen and heard evey engine builder mentioned in here build motors that have failed because of something they did and I’ve seen them take care of it.
Some builders like to play the odds. They build a lot of engines real fast and maybe 5% come back.
Anyway... for various reasons, I have a lot of respect and admiration for every builder mentioned in here. To the OP, if you need a quote please feel free to send a message or call. We are competitive with pricing. (We aren’t the cheapest) but like I said we are competitive and believe our work and work ethic speak for itself.
I also agree that the difference between a good and bad Shop is how they handle failures. I’ll be the first to admit I’ve messed up before. In fact there is a member on these very forums who I messed up his Engine and I’m dealing with it now. We were able to figure out that I was 100% at fault so I payed for his engine R&R, return and re return to him shipping as well as all the parts. Basically when it’s said and done, I will have paid him to allow me to build this engine in exchange he paid with time and probably a slight headache. In fact he will probably read this and text me. (Still waiting on your pistons bud). On the opposite end of that spectrum, I think it’s note worthy to say. We all love High Performance Stuff! So though I make my living off another mans hobby. The way I feel about how to handle a situation where the customer breaks an engine because of his own doing; don’t mean the engine builder needs to take him to the cleaners either. There’s nothing wrong with throwing a little discount to help a guy get back going. To me it shows a little compassion ya know!
anyway ive seen and heard evey engine builder mentioned in here build motors that have failed because of something they did and I’ve seen them take care of it.
Some builders like to play the odds. They build a lot of engines real fast and maybe 5% come back.
Anyway... for various reasons, I have a lot of respect and admiration for every builder mentioned in here. To the OP, if you need a quote please feel free to send a message or call. We are competitive with pricing. (We aren’t the cheapest) but like I said we are competitive and believe our work and work ethic speak for itself.