[Z06] Clutch Fluid ?
Thread Starter
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 54
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Clutch Fluid ?
I just recently got my vette and I have the usual pedal issue with it sticking to the floor at high rpms. I talked to the original owner and he said he had put in a blue fluid that is suppose to be top of the line to help the issue. I checked and it is blue....has anyone heard of this fluid? is it as good as he says it is?
I want to to the "Ranger method", or whatever, but with it being blue i think this may be a bit harder to get the lines clear again with different fluid.
What do you guys suggest? What fluid should i use?
I want to to the "Ranger method", or whatever, but with it being blue i think this may be a bit harder to get the lines clear again with different fluid.
What do you guys suggest? What fluid should i use?
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,205
Likes: 5
From: Jupiter FL
Sounds like he was using ATE Super Blue racing brake fluid. It's a high temperature brake fluid, great stuff. That's what I use in my brakes and clutch. The clutch fluid is just brake fluid. Same stuff in both applications. It's a good idea to use the same fluid in both your brakes and clutch, so you don't mix them by accident, and only have to keep one can around to top up or bleed both.
Your manual calls for a DOT 3 brake fluid, and that may be printed on your reservoir cap. DOT 3 and DOT 4 fluids are compatible, and you can mix them without problems. But do not, under any circumstances, mix a DOT 5 silicone fluid with regular brake fluid or you will have a major problem.
Do the "Ranger" clutch fluid change and you'll have no problems with the clutch. And if you don't know how long it's been since your brakes were bled, do them as well. The order is RR, LF, LR, RF.
Your manual calls for a DOT 3 brake fluid, and that may be printed on your reservoir cap. DOT 3 and DOT 4 fluids are compatible, and you can mix them without problems. But do not, under any circumstances, mix a DOT 5 silicone fluid with regular brake fluid or you will have a major problem.
Do the "Ranger" clutch fluid change and you'll have no problems with the clutch. And if you don't know how long it's been since your brakes were bled, do them as well. The order is RR, LF, LR, RF.
Thread Starter
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 54
Likes: 0
Sounds like he was using ATE Super Blue racing brake fluid. It's a high temperature brake fluid, great stuff. That's what I use in my brakes and clutch. The clutch fluid is just brake fluid. Same stuff in both applications. It's a good idea to use the same fluid in both your brakes and clutch, so you don't mix them by accident, and only have to keep one can around to top up or bleed both.
Your manual calls for a DOT 3 brake fluid, and that may be printed on your reservoir cap. DOT 3 and DOT 4 fluids are compatible, and you can mix them without problems. But do not, under any circumstances, mix a DOT 5 silicone fluid with regular brake fluid or you will have a major problem.
Do the "Ranger" clutch fluid change and you'll have no problems with the clutch. And if you don't know how long it's been since your brakes were bled, do them as well. The order is RR, LF, LR, RF.
Your manual calls for a DOT 3 brake fluid, and that may be printed on your reservoir cap. DOT 3 and DOT 4 fluids are compatible, and you can mix them without problems. But do not, under any circumstances, mix a DOT 5 silicone fluid with regular brake fluid or you will have a major problem.
Do the "Ranger" clutch fluid change and you'll have no problems with the clutch. And if you don't know how long it's been since your brakes were bled, do them as well. The order is RR, LF, LR, RF.
So is the Ranger method do-able with the current fluid? I mean, I wont run into any issues if I dont get every drop out and add the above fluid, will I?
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,848
Likes: 1
From: Central Florida
You'll be fine.
"ATE Super Blue Racing brake fluid has a dry boiling point of over 530 degrees F, far exceeding DOT 4 standards. Mixes with any other DOT 3 or DOT 4 fluid. Super Blue absorbs moisture very slowly, so you don't have to change it as often as many high-performance fluids. Great for your street car that sees weekend track duty."
http://machv.com/atesublrabrf.html
"ATE Super Blue Racing brake fluid has a dry boiling point of over 530 degrees F, far exceeding DOT 4 standards. Mixes with any other DOT 3 or DOT 4 fluid. Super Blue absorbs moisture very slowly, so you don't have to change it as often as many high-performance fluids. Great for your street car that sees weekend track duty."
http://machv.com/atesublrabrf.html
Safety Car
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,904
Likes: 29
From: Vancouver Washington
ATE Super Blue and ATE Type 200 are the same stuff except one is blue and the other is pretty much clear. I use the Type 200 for my clutch and rotate between the 200 and the Super Blue for brake flushes before every HPDE. Never had a problem with either.
Safety Car
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 4,030
Likes: 6
From: Maryland
1. Use a syringe (see Walmart's auto section--the Mix Mizer syringe for mixing motorcycle oil) to extract all the fluid in the clutch reservoir. Clean the cap and the reservoir with a paper towel. When you do this, be sure to put some clean paper towels on your fender to protect the paint and keep in mind that brake fluid eats paint--don't get it on anything. If you get it on your hands, don't touch anything until you wipe them.
2. Re-fill with new fluid to the line in the reservoir.
3. Replace cap. Get in the car, pump clutch 20-25 times. Check fluid for color change. If it was black to begin with or your clutch stuck, there will be a color change. Go change it again as above (1-2).
Continue to change until it's not changing color. This may take as many as 2 pints (the reservoir only holds some of the fluid). Check it at every fuel fill up or once a week or so if you drive the car hard. If you don't do any high rpm clutch work, and it was clear, it should stay clear for a while. Check before drag racing, auto-x, road course work.
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Race Director
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 10,649
Likes: 31
From: Central Florida
I tried ATE Super Blue Racing in my 2001 Z06, but quit because it's so dark that I couldn't tell when it was darkening. It's the color change that is the tell that the fluid's boiling point is degrading.
So I switched to Prestone and GM-brand Super DOT4, both of which are nearly clear. Both have a dry boiling point of 500F. Changed often to keep it dry, neither fluid will ever boil. That means no pedal issues.
In June GM told dealer the service org that it is now specifying GM-brand Super DOT4 for all Corvette clutches and requiring it be changed every 24-months, more frequently than any fluid except engine oil. That says heat and moisture are acknowledged as the root cause of many clutch issues. Perhaps now some of the doubters will finally start changing their clutch fluid.
Here is the procedure: Taking Care of Your Clutch
Ranger
So I switched to Prestone and GM-brand Super DOT4, both of which are nearly clear. Both have a dry boiling point of 500F. Changed often to keep it dry, neither fluid will ever boil. That means no pedal issues.
In June GM told dealer the service org that it is now specifying GM-brand Super DOT4 for all Corvette clutches and requiring it be changed every 24-months, more frequently than any fluid except engine oil. That says heat and moisture are acknowledged as the root cause of many clutch issues. Perhaps now some of the doubters will finally start changing their clutch fluid.
Here is the procedure: Taking Care of Your Clutch
Ranger
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,737
Likes: 2
From: California USA
Looks like I was using Maxima DOT4, same thing I put in my dirt bike brake reservoirs. Anyone know the boiling points are this?
Not on the container that I can see, but mentions something of meeting govmt standards.
Found some Prestone DOT3 I had in my 03. I guess that was the wrong fluid. My 03 definitely gave me problems.
Not on the container that I can see, but mentions something of meeting govmt standards.
Found some Prestone DOT3 I had in my 03. I guess that was the wrong fluid. My 03 definitely gave me problems.
Race Director
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 10,649
Likes: 31
From: Central Florida
Prestone DOT4 Synthetic is widely available and works well.
If making the change from DOT3 to DOT4, I recommend the aggressive swap described here: Taking Care of Your Clutch
Ranger
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,205
Likes: 5
From: Jupiter FL
You'll be fine. Whether you use Super Blue or Type 200 or Prestone or GM, they will all work with what's in there now, provided it's not silicone. But if you have Super Blue in there now, use one of the clear fluids (I'm partial to the ATE stuff, so Type 200), and do the Ranger method. The old blue stuff should keep coming out. When you don't get any blue in your clear, you're done.
p.s. That works with the brakes also. You can switch between Type 200 and Super Blue. That way you know when you've bled each brake, when the fluid complete changes color, one to the other. Just remember to suck as much of the old stuff out of the reservoir as you can before you fill with the new stuff.
Race Director
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 10,649
Likes: 31
From: Central Florida
Posted a few minutes ago by Ken Fichtner:
Take care of your clutch fluid as a matter of routine preventative maintenance. Taking Care of Your Clutch
Ranger
Document ID# 1982105
Subject: Intermittent Spongy Clutch Pedal Sticking To The Floor During Hard Acceleration And High RPM Shifts - keywords contaminate fluid hydraulic #PIP4145 - (06/04/2007)
Models: 2005-2007 Chevrolet Corvette, Corvette Z06 Equipped with a Tremec 6-speed Transmission RPO MM6, MZ6
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The following diagnosis might be helpful if the vehicle exhibits the symptom(s) described in this PI.
Condition/Concern:
Some customers may comment about an intermittent spongy clutch pedal feel or clutch pedal sticking to the floor. This may be aggravated by aggressive driving and high clutch operating temperatures. Higher than expected levels of water in the clutch fluid greater than 2% may cause the clutch fluid to boil. The presence of water in the fluid lowers the boiling point significantly; when these conditions are present the driver may lose customary clutch pedal feel and performance.
Recommendation/Instructions:
If the above condition is intermittent flush the hydraulic system using DOT 4 fluid part number 88958860 (88901244 in Canada), prior to replacement of any mechanical or hydraulic components.
To eliminate the opportunity for moisture to enter the clutch hydraulic system.
The clutch fluid level inspection should be a VISUAL inspection only. Look through the transparent reservoir and observe the fluid level. Avoid removing the cap. Do not remove the cap just to top-off clutch fluid. Leave the system closed and sealed. During PDI inspection or routine servicing the cap should not be opened for just an inspection.
DOT 4 clutch fluid has a 2 week shelf life. Do not use fluid if container opening date is unknown or older than 2 weeks. Do not mix or re-use old fluid. Current service information already covers the issue of reuse.
To provide the best clutch operation, it is recommended that the owner change the clutch fluid every 2 calendar years. Please flush and replace the clutch fluid with P/N 88958860 (88901244 in Canada) or equivalent DOT 4.
The current service information and owners manual will be updated to reflect this information.
Note: If the concern is not intermittent, inspect clutch hydraulic system for leaks and repair as necessary after repairs are completed flush system with DOT 4 fluid part number 88958860 (88901244 in Canada).
Please follow this diagnostic or repair process thoroughly and complete each step. If the condition exhibited is resolved without completing every step, the remaining steps do not need to be performed.
Subject: Intermittent Spongy Clutch Pedal Sticking To The Floor During Hard Acceleration And High RPM Shifts - keywords contaminate fluid hydraulic #PIP4145 - (06/04/2007)
Models: 2005-2007 Chevrolet Corvette, Corvette Z06 Equipped with a Tremec 6-speed Transmission RPO MM6, MZ6
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The following diagnosis might be helpful if the vehicle exhibits the symptom(s) described in this PI.
Condition/Concern:
Some customers may comment about an intermittent spongy clutch pedal feel or clutch pedal sticking to the floor. This may be aggravated by aggressive driving and high clutch operating temperatures. Higher than expected levels of water in the clutch fluid greater than 2% may cause the clutch fluid to boil. The presence of water in the fluid lowers the boiling point significantly; when these conditions are present the driver may lose customary clutch pedal feel and performance.
Recommendation/Instructions:
If the above condition is intermittent flush the hydraulic system using DOT 4 fluid part number 88958860 (88901244 in Canada), prior to replacement of any mechanical or hydraulic components.
To eliminate the opportunity for moisture to enter the clutch hydraulic system.
The clutch fluid level inspection should be a VISUAL inspection only. Look through the transparent reservoir and observe the fluid level. Avoid removing the cap. Do not remove the cap just to top-off clutch fluid. Leave the system closed and sealed. During PDI inspection or routine servicing the cap should not be opened for just an inspection.
DOT 4 clutch fluid has a 2 week shelf life. Do not use fluid if container opening date is unknown or older than 2 weeks. Do not mix or re-use old fluid. Current service information already covers the issue of reuse.
To provide the best clutch operation, it is recommended that the owner change the clutch fluid every 2 calendar years. Please flush and replace the clutch fluid with P/N 88958860 (88901244 in Canada) or equivalent DOT 4.
The current service information and owners manual will be updated to reflect this information.
Note: If the concern is not intermittent, inspect clutch hydraulic system for leaks and repair as necessary after repairs are completed flush system with DOT 4 fluid part number 88958860 (88901244 in Canada).
Please follow this diagnostic or repair process thoroughly and complete each step. If the condition exhibited is resolved without completing every step, the remaining steps do not need to be performed.
Ranger
Last edited by Ranger; Jul 14, 2007 at 11:40 AM.
Racer
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 283
Likes: 0
From: Sugar Land TX
St. Jude Donor '08
SO...if I have Prestone DOT 4 synthetic brake fluid that I've opened the bottle to keep the resevior fluid clean and the bottle is still half full but has been sitting in my garage for well over 2 weeks I should dispose of it and not continue to use it?
Race Director
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 10,649
Likes: 31
From: Central Florida
When opening a fresh can, I cut a narrow slit in the foil at the mouth. This allows a precise pour and minimizes air flow. I also keep the cap on tightly and minimize the duration of cap-off.
Following this approach, I've not experienced pedal issues in six years.
Ranger
Last edited by Ranger; Jul 14, 2007 at 10:55 AM.
Racer
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 283
Likes: 0
From: Sugar Land TX
St. Jude Donor '08
I change mine frequently. But it takes me 4-6 weeks to go thru a 12 ounce can. No issues.
When opening a fresh can, I cut a narrow slip in the foil at the mouth. This allows a precise pour and minimizes air flow. I also keep the cap on tightly and minimize the duration of cap-off.
Following this approach, I've not experienced pedal issues in six years.
Ranger
When opening a fresh can, I cut a narrow slip in the foil at the mouth. This allows a precise pour and minimizes air flow. I also keep the cap on tightly and minimize the duration of cap-off.
Following this approach, I've not experienced pedal issues in six years.
Ranger
Race Director
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 17,640
Likes: 1
From: Lenoir City TN
St. Jude Donor '08-'09-'10-'11
DOT 4 clutch fluid has a 2 week shelf life. Do not use fluid if container opening date is unknown or older than 2 weeks. Do not mix or re-use old fluid. Current service information already covers the issue of reuse.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 8,847
Likes: 795
From: Longview Texas
Even the clutch reservoir is not totally sealed. That would mean that the fluid in the reservoir would only last 2 weeks also. I would think that any sealed container should be alright for more than 2 weeks. Now, if you leave the cap off for 2 weeks, that is a different story.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,737
Likes: 2
From: California USA
just the facts:
1) New clutch seemed to solve the stuck to the floor problem, but the fluid looks like what you see below.
2) I changed out as much of the fluid today as I could to
Motul RBF 600. The clutch seems slightly firmer on depression. No change otherwise. No change in brakes.
1) New clutch seemed to solve the stuck to the floor problem, but the fluid looks like what you see below.
2) I changed out as much of the fluid today as I could to
Motul RBF 600. The clutch seems slightly firmer on depression. No change otherwise. No change in brakes.