[Z06] Wheel Spacer Question
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 232
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From: New Market Maryland
Wheel Spacer Question
I'm considering the purchase of a set of IForged TE5S wheels from a Corvette Forum member. In order to clear the C6 Z06 brake upgrade on my C5 Z06, I will have to use 1/4" spacers on the rear wheels only. I need to know if I will need longer studs if I use the spacer. Also, I participate in drag races, high speed track days and autocross events. Will the use of spacers have any negative effects when racing?I'd appreciate your input/experiences.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,087
Likes: 4
From: granville mass
I've had spacer on some of my cars, and my son's car over the years. A 1/4" spacer isn't much, but I personally would never ever track a car with spacers, street driving ok in most instances. I've had issues with lug nuts backing off after having been properly torqued.
My thoughts are that you are changing the loading on the studs. More stud is unsupported putting under bending stresses, and you have more threads not in contact with the nut. That extra length effects how the stud reacts when the nut is torqued.
You are also eliminating the direct wheel to hub contact. I think that it's the movement between the surfaces that can cause the nuts to loosen.
The above is not a big deal under normal loads, but when you've got your sticky track tires on you are no longer dealing with normal loads, and something bad may happen. SCCA used to specificly not allow wheel spacers in the 80's, not sure now.
Yes, I'm sure there are plenty of people that are doing this with no bad experiences, but the phyisics are what they are. If you have to have those wheels, consider some kind of premium stud rather than the parts bin GM stuff.
mk
My thoughts are that you are changing the loading on the studs. More stud is unsupported putting under bending stresses, and you have more threads not in contact with the nut. That extra length effects how the stud reacts when the nut is torqued.
You are also eliminating the direct wheel to hub contact. I think that it's the movement between the surfaces that can cause the nuts to loosen.
The above is not a big deal under normal loads, but when you've got your sticky track tires on you are no longer dealing with normal loads, and something bad may happen. SCCA used to specificly not allow wheel spacers in the 80's, not sure now.
Yes, I'm sure there are plenty of people that are doing this with no bad experiences, but the phyisics are what they are. If you have to have those wheels, consider some kind of premium stud rather than the parts bin GM stuff.
mk
Instructor
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 160
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I would never do that.
There are many reasons why it's not a good idea. One reason; you will be adding unsprung wieght (adding weight to the suspension) which will reduce the handling capabilities of your car.
If it was a Mustang (straight axel), it probably wouldn't make much of a difference in regards to handling. But it's still not a good way to go.
There are many reasons why it's not a good idea. One reason; you will be adding unsprung wieght (adding weight to the suspension) which will reduce the handling capabilities of your car.
If it was a Mustang (straight axel), it probably wouldn't make much of a difference in regards to handling. But it's still not a good way to go.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 756
Likes: 22
From: OK/FL
You'll be fine...
Hell, a 5mm-ish spacer is only way could get my stickies to work.
edit: you add a insignificant amount of weight such that it's not worth even factoring in.
Hell, a 5mm-ish spacer is only way could get my stickies to work.
edit: you add a insignificant amount of weight such that it's not worth even factoring in.
Last edited by OKsweetrides; Feb 17, 2009 at 08:27 PM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 2,786
Likes: 22
From: Cary NC
The hub is 1/2" deep. So an 1/8" or 1/4" spacer is not horrible. The wheel still is centered on the hub. I use an 1/8" spacer on the rear for track because I run 335s on the back. They just touch the inner fender. A 1/4" would be perfect. I also went to these open ended lug nuts that have a threaded shank. They fit in CCW wheels. So I am getting more turns on the lug nut than the factory lugs will do. Factory lugs have much less threads in the seat. The Gorilla lug nuts are also much harder.
http://www.brandsport.com/grla-68038.html
I'm also going to use a good quality spacer like the Pfadt ones.
In general though spacers put more stress on the wheel bearings. Running r-comps on track really stresses them. So it's a trade-off. I'm not willing to do a minitub just for an 1/8" of clearance.
As for the unsprung weight of the spacers. They are aluminum and weigh next to nothing.
Graham
http://www.brandsport.com/grla-68038.html
I'm also going to use a good quality spacer like the Pfadt ones.
In general though spacers put more stress on the wheel bearings. Running r-comps on track really stresses them. So it's a trade-off. I'm not willing to do a minitub just for an 1/8" of clearance.
As for the unsprung weight of the spacers. They are aluminum and weigh next to nothing.
Graham
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2005
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From: New Market Maryland
Thanks for the input. Since I am in the process of buying new wheels and tires to fit over my big brake setup, I can choose wheels that will clear my brakes without spacers. I may have to pay a little more, but I'll get the look that I want and avoid any problems.
Instructor
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 160
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If you are refering to overall weight, you are correct. If it's unsprung weight, you are wrong.
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Burning Brakes
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 756
Likes: 22
From: OK/FL
I am directly referring to unsprung weight. My spacer that I have on my vette is very low mass and due to its design, I imagine very low inertia.
Look at the relatives.
1. Caliper
2. Rotor
3. Rotor Hat
4. Wheel
5. Wheel weights
6. Tires
That's a lot of mass with those objects, so if you want to quibble about a very small amount, then by all means go ahead. I'm not going to debate this as it's individual impact is very very small compared to the other 6 things I mentioned off the top of my head. What about lug nuts too?
My butt dyno sure as hell ain't picking up that difference in shock and steering response. And if you can, then I suggest getting in touch with a race team.
Look at the relatives.
1. Caliper
2. Rotor
3. Rotor Hat
4. Wheel
5. Wheel weights
6. Tires
That's a lot of mass with those objects, so if you want to quibble about a very small amount, then by all means go ahead. I'm not going to debate this as it's individual impact is very very small compared to the other 6 things I mentioned off the top of my head. What about lug nuts too?
My butt dyno sure as hell ain't picking up that difference in shock and steering response. And if you can, then I suggest getting in touch with a race team.
Last edited by OKsweetrides; Feb 19, 2009 at 04:38 PM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 2,491
Likes: 1
From: prescott AZ
You will find some people say spacers are OK and some who will say no way. I say no way. Especially on a high performance car like the Corvette and considering the way it will be driven. Now maybe if it was a 85 Ford Tempo and won't be going over 45mph it would be OK.
Instructor
Joined: May 2006
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Race Director
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,639
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From: Winston-Salem North Carolina
St. Jude Donor '08-'09
I've been on track at Watkins Glen, Pocono, VIR, Limerock, and NJMSP with 1/8" spacers on both rear wheels. I run in the advanced group at thses tracks and never had a problem. Hell, at Pocono we had an advanced drivers open track, 1-1/2 hr sessions 4 times that day, total on-track time 6hrs. Torque to speck and check frequently.