This is exactly what I said above, they did nothing. Your car already had a stock tune. They just overwrote it with the same thing. This car still needs to be tuned.

Even though the Check Engine Light is currently off your trims are still way off. Your WOT A/F ratio is also still going to be off and you are not making more power than stock. Take the car to a dyno or put it on a track and see for yourself.

 

Glad to hear that things are going well for you Mmorse- I'm waiting for my exhaust to come in before putting the intake back on (for whatever reason). Question though...if your dealer actually RECOMMENDED keeping it on and just waiting for it to "cylce through"- if something were to actually happen and damage occured (knock on wood here) would you be screwed waranty-wise? Should you get something in writing from them for protection? I don't mean to seem paranoid....it's just that it seems like they could screw us over easily in this situation (dealer) if they wanted to. Also, i've heard that if you actually get the real LS1 Edit, it voids the waranty altogether. True or not?
I'm all for putting my intake back on, driving it, and seeing if it eventually stops coding....but i don't want to be potentially shooting myself in the foot later on if anything were to happen, and apon inspection in the shop it was determined that engine damage occured because of a problem the car was telling me i had the whole time- that i CHOSE to ignore. Thanks for the posts....and keep us all updated.

 

RBA
The dealer did not flash my pcm. The mechanic merely said that's all he can do with a Tech 2. RBA, neither I nor yourself can absolutely know if my A/F ratio is off or not at this point. Fact is, this car runs better than my '01 ever did. Bad ratios or not.

NewGuy,
The mechanic didn't recommend I leave the intake on. He merely stated the relearn can take up to 50 start cycles. Though he didn't seemed to be to concerned that I had the intake on, if I ever had problems, I'm sure GM could not honor the waranty no matter what the mechanic says. I'm sure an LS1 edit could invalidate it also. You have to decide whether there is a big enough risk. There are many guys with tunes and their cars aren't blowing up. I'm not worried about it.

As far as leaving the intake on, if things start to go south i will yank it. There is absolutley no evidence to suggest engine problems at this point. The car screams with no pinging, hesitation, any codes other than the aforementioned lean codes and they seem to have vanished at least for now. The car just feels like it wants to get up and go. Mileage is still good. When the codes were coming hot and heavy, I noticed a slower build up of soot on the rear fascia. Now it gets dirty as fast as it used to prior to the stinger. Maybe the pcm has finally adjusted and has richened the mixture. Although my mileage still seems to be the same as always.

If I encounter any issues i will let ou know.

mark

 

Which is what I said was the case.


I am not sure what part of my explanation you are not getting. As I have said a few times already you have been getting a check engine light because you are running around with super high fuel trim values. The super high fuel trim values are an attempt by the PCM to compensate for inaccurate initial fuel metering. The PCM thought you needed "X" amount of fuel and the PCM was wrong. O2 sensor feedback reports that your initial fuel metering was too lean and the PCM is trying to compensation by fattening up the A/F ratio with extra fuel. The PCM has been at its maximum conpensation point and your car is still too lean. The DTC fires and the check engine light goes on. The PCM's initial fuel ratio calculation is probably off because of inaccurate MAF readings due to turbulence at the MAF. Cars with inaccurate initial fuel metering and super high fuel trim values do not meter well at WOT, this is a fact. Don't trust me, put the car on a dyno. If you really want some sort of power gain from an airbox that is setting DTCs you need to tune the car otherwise you spent $400 on something that is nothing but a fancy looking air cleaner.


No, this is not the case. When you were getting DTCs the PCM was already attempting to richen the maximum amount.

 

No, this is not the case. When you were getting DTCs the PCM was attempting to richen the maximum amount.

 

I know you said that. I was merely pointing out the dealer didn't overwrite anything. They didn't touch the car. They just SAID that is all they could do. I was agreeing with you.

The car hasn't thrown any codes in almost two weeks but I'm going to have the A/F ratio checked with an LM1 to see where I'm at. I will probably need the tune. Just not anxious to fork out the cash LAPD wants but I may have no choice. At least I'll have max hp and torque for my setup.

BTW, the stinger was $200, not $400. Granted, still alot for a fancy air cleaner.

mark

 

The lack of codes over the past two weeks can be a result of different weather conditions. If your current ambient conditions are resulting in "thinner" air then your car might get by without a lean code. In the fall when the air gets cooler and thicker the codes will return. My trims vary all the time with the weather, but I keep them under 10%.

25% trim correction will usually result in a Check Engine Light.

 

Glad you already responded Mmorse...i was just gonna ask you how it's been. I just got my Borla's in today- they'll be installed tomorrow afternoon. I'll prob. start my own thread on this- but i'll now have a stock '04 Z exhuast with a little over 1k miles on it. I'm in Alexandria, Va- about 10min. South of DC.
Anyway, i'm hoping to put the Stinger back on with the exhaust and run it like you did, and see if it stops coding. We'll see i guess....

 

New guy,
My wife works for Innovate Motorsport and they are going to hook up an LM1 to my car on Thursday to see what my A/F ratio is. I'll see if I'm still lean.

I read an interesting thread in the scan and tune section. It had to do with aftermarket MAFs causing pinging. Someone asked about aftermarket intakes and pinging. The explanation was that many aftermarket filters attach right to the MAF. There is not enough distance for turbulent air to smooth out prior to hitting the MAF wires. Hence, the pcm can't get an accurate reading of how much air is flowing through. If more air gets through than the pcm reads, a lean condition can occur. Apparently, Andy of A&A prefers the trap to the stinger because there is an additional bridge between the filter and the MAF allowing the air to smooth out prior to hitting the wires.

The poster said you can test this by removing the air filter, let the car idle and blow into the MAF. The disruption of flow will cause the car to sputter and hesitate.

That sounds more plausible to me than the stinger flows so much more air than stock that the pcm can't compensate. Of course I could be wrong, but I have a hard time believing a warhead filter is going to pass that much more air than a K&N in the stock box with the lid removed.

I had a Vortex on my '01. That passed cold air through a conical filter and it never threw codes. Of course, the MAF on the '01s had a screen to smooth air flow. I'm wondering if some kind of screen might solve the issue.

Anyway, I'll find out what my A/F ratio is and let you know. LAPD has a GP going on for a dyno tune so I'll be getting the issue resolved one way or the other.

mark

 

Is this a problem with the 03's and 04's only? I just ordered the Stinger from Halltech for my 01. Do you think that a Predator programmer would take care this issue? Just trying to get my ducks in a row for when I receive it. Thanks.

 

The 02-04 screenless MAF is more likely to pop a lean code with an aftermarket airbox. The screens on your 01 MAF will help to smooth the incoming airflow which results in more accurate MAF readings. You will probably be ok. The Predator probably would not fix a lean code situation without downloading a custom tune to it.

The weather conditions will cause the fuel trim values to shift around a bit. This is what the system is designed to do. This might be why mmorse has not seen the codes in a few weeks. The codes will probably return when the air gets cooler and denser.

Like said on Pages 2 & 3 of this thread the lean codes are absolutely NOT caused by the new airbox flowing "more air". The fuel trim lean/rich codes are caused by inaccurate fuel metering. Inaccurate fuel metering is caused by inaccurate sensor readings and/or inaccurate fuel delivery. As a matter of fact one way to resolve this lean code issue with LS1Edit is to add MORE air to the detected MAF value. The addition of MORE air to the detected MAF value will cause the PCM to inject more fuel on the initial metering attempt. The result is richer initial metering and O2 sensor feedback that is closer to stoich. That should lower the PCM's fuel trim correction (we are now closer to stoich) and eliminate the DTCs.

 

The 02-04 screenless MAF is more likely to pop a lean code with an aftermarket airbox. The screens on your 01 MAF will help to smooth the incoming airflow which results in more accurate MAF readings. You will probably be ok. The Predator probably would not fix a lean code situation without downloading a custom tune to it.

The weather conditions will cause the fuel trim values to shift around a bit. This is what the system is designed to do. This might be why mmorse has not seen the codes in a few weeks. The codes will probably return when the air gets cooler and denser.

Like I said on Pages 2 & 3 of this thread the fuel trim lean/rich codes are caused by inaccurate fuel metering. The lean codes are absolutely NOT caused by the new airbox flowing "more air". The Inaccurate fuel metering is caused by inaccurate sensor readings and/or inaccurate fuel delivery. As a matter of fact one way to resolve this aftermarket airbox lean code issue is to use LS1Edit is to add MORE air to the detected MAF value. The addition of MORE air to the detected MAF value will cause the PCM to inject more fuel on the initial metering attempt. The result is richer initial metering and O2 sensor feedback that is closer to stoich. That should lower the PCM's fuel trim correction (we are now closer to stoich) and eliminate the DTCs.

 

The 02-04 screenless MAF is more likely to pop a lean code with an aftermarket airbox. The screens on your 01 MAF will help to smooth the incoming airflow which results in more accurate MAF readings. You will probably be ok. The Predator probably would not fix a lean code situation without downloading a custom tune to it.

The weather conditions will cause the fuel trim values to shift around a bit. This is what the system is designed to do. This might be why mmorse has not seen the codes in a few weeks. The codes will probably return when the air gets cooler and denser.

Like I said on Pages 2 & 3 of this thread the fuel trim lean/rich codes are caused by inaccurate fuel metering. The lean codes are absolutely NOT caused by the new airbox flowing "more air". The inaccurate fuel metering is caused by inaccurate sensor readings and/or inaccurate fuel delivery. As a matter of fact one way to resolve this aftermarket airbox lean code issue is to use LS1Edit is to add MORE air to the detected MAF value. The addition of MORE air to the detected MAF value will cause the PCM to inject more fuel on the initial metering attempt. The result is richer initial metering and O2 sensor feedback that is closer to stoich. That should lower the PCM's fuel trim correction (we are now closer to stoich) and eliminate the DTCs.

You can also resolve the aftermarket lean code issue with LS1Edit by modifying your injector flow rate. That would change the injector pulse width without changing the MAF transfer function (and possibly your ignition timing since timing is based partly on the MAF). The best way to tackle this issue is with both the Injector Flow and the MAF functions.

 

The 02-04 screenless MAF is more likely to pop a lean code with an aftermarket airbox. The screens on your 01 MAF will help to smooth the incoming airflow which results in more accurate MAF readings. You will probably be ok. The Predator probably would not fix a lean code situation without downloading a custom tune to it.

The weather conditions will cause the fuel trim values to shift around a bit. This is what the system is designed to do. This might be why mmorse has not seen the codes in a few weeks. The codes will probably return when the air gets cooler and denser.

You are not going to be lean when cruising around closed loop. Your PCM is correcting the lean condition with heavy duty fuel trim correction. The LM1 will not be useful during closed loop operation. The LM1 will be useful for a WOT run up to redline through the gears. Your WOT ratios will probably be rich.

Like I said on Pages 2 & 3 of this thread the fuel trim lean/rich codes are caused by inaccurate fuel metering. The lean codes are absolutely NOT caused by the new airbox flowing "more air". The inaccurate fuel metering is caused by inaccurate sensor readings and/or inaccurate fuel delivery. As a matter of fact one way to resolve this aftermarket airbox lean code issue is to use LS1Edit is to add MORE air to the detected MAF value. The addition of MORE air to the detected MAF value will cause the PCM to inject more fuel on the initial metering attempt. The result is richer initial metering and O2 sensor feedback that is closer to stoich. That should lower the PCM's fuel trim correction (we are now closer to stoich) and eliminate the DTCs.

You can also resolve the aftermarket lean code issue with LS1Edit by modifying your injector flow rate. That would change the injector pulse width without changing the MAF transfer function (and possibly your ignition timing since timing is based partly on the MAF). The best way to tackle this issue is with both the Injector Flow and the MAF functions.

 

Quicksilver,
I'm told GM tuned the '03s and '04s leaner than previous years. Whether that is true or not I don't know. As I said before, I had a Vortex CAI on my '01 and never had any issues. If you haven't removed the screen from the MAF I don't suspect you will have an issue with the Stinger. Of course, the only way to know is to put one on and see what happens.

mark

 

The 02-04 screenless MAF is more likely to pop a lean code with an aftermarket airbox. The screens on your 01 MAF will help to smooth the incoming airflow which results in more accurate MAF readings. You will probably be ok. The Predator probably would not fix a lean code situation without downloading a custom tune to it.

The weather conditions will cause the fuel trim values to shift around a bit. This is what the system is designed to do. This might be why mmorse has not seen the codes in a few weeks. The codes will probably return when the air gets cooler and denser.


You are not going to be lean when cruising around closed loop. Your PCM is correcting the lean condition with heavy duty fuel trim correction. The LM1 will not be useful during closed loop operation. The LM1 will be useful for a WOT run up to redline through the gears. Your WOT ratios will probably be rich. You will need to weld an additional O2 sensor bung to use this device.


Like I said on Pages 2 & 3 of this thread the fuel trim lean/rich codes are caused by inaccurate fuel metering. The lean codes are absolutely NOT caused by the new airbox flowing "more air". The inaccurate fuel metering is caused by inaccurate sensor readings and/or inaccurate fuel delivery. As a matter of fact one way to resolve this aftermarket airbox lean code issue is to use LS1Edit is to add MORE air to the detected MAF value. The addition of MORE air to the detected MAF value will cause the PCM to inject more fuel on the initial metering attempt. The result is richer initial metering and O2 sensor feedback that is closer to stoich. That should lower the PCM's fuel trim correction (we are now closer to stoich) and eliminate the DTCs.

You can also resolve the aftermarket lean code issue with LS1Edit by modifying your injector flow rate. That would change the injector pulse width without changing the MAF transfer function (and possibly your ignition timing since timing is based partly on the MAF). The best way to tackle this issue is with both the Injector Flow and the MAF functions.

 

It's interesting you say that rbatick. I thought the exact same thing. But I got a lean code just yesterday. The weather has turned ungodly hot, not cooled down. It is, however, rather humid. Even though the ambient air is in the mid 90s, the humidity is probably making it more dense than it normally would be.

I'm getting my A/F ratio checked tomorrow and we'll see where I'm at. Do you know what it should be? I'm told in the 12.8 to 13.2 range.

mark

 

The 02-04 screenless MAF is more likely to pop a lean code with an aftermarket airbox. The screens on your 01 MAF will help to smooth the incoming airflow which results in more accurate MAF readings. You will probably be ok. The Predator probably would not fix a lean code situation without downloading a custom tune to it.

The weather conditions will cause the fuel trim values to shift around a bit. This is what the system is designed to do. This might be why mmorse has not seen the codes in a few weeks. The codes will probably return when the air gets cooler and denser.


You are not going to be lean when cruising around closed loop. Your PCM is correcting the lean condition with heavy duty fuel trim correction. The LM1 will not be useful during closed loop operation. The LM1 will be useful for a WOT run up to redline through the gears. Your WOT ratios will probably be rich. You will need to weld an additional O2 sensor bung to use this device.


Like I said on Pages 2 & 3 of this thread the fuel trim lean/rich codes are caused by inaccurate fuel metering. The lean codes are absolutely NOT caused by the new airbox flowing "more air". The inaccurate fuel metering is caused by inaccurate sensor readings and/or inaccurate fuel delivery. As a matter of fact one way to resolve this aftermarket airbox lean code issue is to use LS1Edit is to add MORE air to the detected MAF value. The addition of MORE air to the detected MAF value will cause the PCM to inject more fuel on the initial metering attempt. The result is richer initial metering and O2 sensor feedback that is closer to stoich. That should lower the PCM's fuel trim correction (we are now closer to stoich) and eliminate the DTCs.

You can also resolve the aftermarket lean code issue with LS1Edit by modifying your injector flow rate. That would change the injector pulse width without changing the MAF transfer function (and possibly your ignition timing since timing is based partly on the MAF). The best way to tackle this issue is with both the Injector Flow and the MAF functions.

 

The weather can play tricks on the PCM. Barometric pressure, temperature, and density altitude are the main things that will shift things around.

With a near stock Z06 you want to be about 12.8 around the torque peak. You can go leaner before and after the torque peak and pick up some more power, but stay near mid to high 12s at the TQ peak. If you lean out after the TQ peak (5500-6500 RPM) you will pick up top-end power. FWIW there are not many LS1Edit fuel adjustment points in the 5000-7000 RPM range. Leaning before the TQ peak can result in knock retard, so it might be wise to save the leaning until after the peak unless your tech is really good.

 

The weather can play tricks on the PCM. Barometric pressure, temperature, humidity, and density altitude are the main things that will shift things around.

With a near stock Z06 you want to be about 12.8 around the torque peak. You can go leaner before and after the torque peak and pick up some more power, but stay near mid to high 12s at the TQ peak. If you lean out after the TQ peak (5500-6500 RPM) you will pick up top-end power. FWIW there are not many LS1Edit fuel adjustment points in the 5000-7000 RPM range. Leaning before the TQ peak can result in knock retard, so it might be wise to save the leaning until after the peak unless your tech is really good.