What Brake Pads Are You Using?
Thread Starter
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 16,135
Likes: 5
From: Newberry FL
Cruise-In VIII Veteran
St. Jude Donor '07
Originally Posted by Evil-Twin
Stock ACDelco pads...
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,555
Likes: 5
From: Fredericksburg VA
There are a few things you need to think about when choosing pads. The more aggressive the pad, the more dust it will throw. You simply will NOT get away from this. Also, the more aggressive the pad, the more rotor surface metal is removed. You also won't get away from this. It is the nature of using a more abbrasive pad compound.
That said, there is a balance... MOST ceramic pads are great at keeping dust low, but perform much more poorly than even the GM factory pads. Guys, brakes that work properly are going to dust, so get used to it... You're driving a performance car and damnit it should stop like one, not some bling crap pile!
What I've found to work pretty decent is a combination of things:
For the street, I'm currently using the Performance Friction Pad from Auto Zone. I forget the number, but next time I swap them out for my track pads (Get to those in a minute) I'll run the numbers.
I also use Russel Speed bleeders along with their newer version braded line. I say newer version, because the early version had grounding issues. The new version doesn't.
Along with that, I use a good high end brake fluid and bleed it twice per year (Motul or GS610). I also use the DRM brake duct extenders and brake duct tubing to cool the rotors. They are safety wired to the tie rods so they won't come off.
At the track I use a set of Rockauto rotors (Brand doesnt' matter, cheaper the better at $17-22 each!) that have been seasoned. If you take these rotors out of the box and throw them on and just do a track day without seasoning them, you'll heat check them and crack them sooner. We've seen this a lot over on the Road Race section of this BB. So, when swapping rotors out, keep that in mind before you go driving HARD on new rotors.
For pads I use the Hawk HT8 racing pad. They are great for track duty, but absolutely unsuitable for daily driving. They brake so aggressively in traffic, I'd cause a front/ rear collision for sure for some unsuspecting driver following me in DC Rush hour traffic, Guaranteed.
Now, About those "ceramic/ low dust" jobbers... I swapped from my Performance Friction pads to some StopTech ceramics that my Buddy Jim GAVE me. These pads require at minimum 20 Feet more stopping distance from 60mph, and YES I've tested them. These pads were something to the tune of $200 for all four wheels and I wouldn't give you a plug nickle for them. Point is, you really need to weigh the dust factor against the ability to stop the car better. To me, there is no comparison. I drive my car hard on the street and at the track. I heel toe shift most shifts and I like to KNOW that my car will stop when I want it to, where I want it to. And at 39 years of age, I'm not opposed to cleaning the wheels once per week. The car generally gets cleaned in that timeframe anyway!
I'm sure that over time, someone will come up with a better material that will dust less, and grab more... Until then, I think the factory Z06 pad, or the Performance Friction pad I'm using is the best alternative for the money in the balance between stopping and dusting.
Your mileage may vary!
Mike
That said, there is a balance... MOST ceramic pads are great at keeping dust low, but perform much more poorly than even the GM factory pads. Guys, brakes that work properly are going to dust, so get used to it... You're driving a performance car and damnit it should stop like one, not some bling crap pile!
What I've found to work pretty decent is a combination of things:
For the street, I'm currently using the Performance Friction Pad from Auto Zone. I forget the number, but next time I swap them out for my track pads (Get to those in a minute) I'll run the numbers.
I also use Russel Speed bleeders along with their newer version braded line. I say newer version, because the early version had grounding issues. The new version doesn't.
Along with that, I use a good high end brake fluid and bleed it twice per year (Motul or GS610). I also use the DRM brake duct extenders and brake duct tubing to cool the rotors. They are safety wired to the tie rods so they won't come off.
At the track I use a set of Rockauto rotors (Brand doesnt' matter, cheaper the better at $17-22 each!) that have been seasoned. If you take these rotors out of the box and throw them on and just do a track day without seasoning them, you'll heat check them and crack them sooner. We've seen this a lot over on the Road Race section of this BB. So, when swapping rotors out, keep that in mind before you go driving HARD on new rotors.
For pads I use the Hawk HT8 racing pad. They are great for track duty, but absolutely unsuitable for daily driving. They brake so aggressively in traffic, I'd cause a front/ rear collision for sure for some unsuspecting driver following me in DC Rush hour traffic, Guaranteed.
Now, About those "ceramic/ low dust" jobbers... I swapped from my Performance Friction pads to some StopTech ceramics that my Buddy Jim GAVE me. These pads require at minimum 20 Feet more stopping distance from 60mph, and YES I've tested them. These pads were something to the tune of $200 for all four wheels and I wouldn't give you a plug nickle for them. Point is, you really need to weigh the dust factor against the ability to stop the car better. To me, there is no comparison. I drive my car hard on the street and at the track. I heel toe shift most shifts and I like to KNOW that my car will stop when I want it to, where I want it to. And at 39 years of age, I'm not opposed to cleaning the wheels once per week. The car generally gets cleaned in that timeframe anyway!
I'm sure that over time, someone will come up with a better material that will dust less, and grab more... Until then, I think the factory Z06 pad, or the Performance Friction pad I'm using is the best alternative for the money in the balance between stopping and dusting.
Your mileage may vary!
Mike
Last edited by Mikelly; Feb 20, 2006 at 09:25 AM.
Racer
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 375
Likes: 0
From: Charlotte NC
I recommend for a good compromise pad the Carbotech Bobcat's. I had them on my Z06 and they dust less than stock Z06 pads and stop as good and in my opinion better. I had them on my other cars as well.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 9,918
Likes: 1,879
From: Hot Springs AR
Performance Friction pads, either OE replacement (works fine, great inital cold bite) or PFC Z-rated pads (much better brake torque, not quite as good an initial cold bite).
However, think of this. If you're discussing a street pad, then just about any pad will be capable of getting the ABS to engage. The tires are your real braking limit for normal street use.
Now, autocross or track use? Then you're looking at repeated hard braking with little time between braking zones. In this case you need to head over to the autox/RR forum for as much debate as you can stand.
Oh, and IMO, "spirited driving" is no comparision, unless you're just suicidal.
HTH, and have a good one,
Mike
However, think of this. If you're discussing a street pad, then just about any pad will be capable of getting the ABS to engage. The tires are your real braking limit for normal street use.
Now, autocross or track use? Then you're looking at repeated hard braking with little time between braking zones. In this case you need to head over to the autox/RR forum for as much debate as you can stand.
Oh, and IMO, "spirited driving" is no comparision, unless you're just suicidal.
HTH, and have a good one,
Mike
Pro
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 743
Likes: 1
From: Bartlett IL
Originally Posted by Mikelly
There are a few things you need to think about when choosing pads. The more aggressive the pad, the more dust it will throw. You simply will NOT get away from this. Also, the more aggressive the pad, the more rotor surface metal is removed. You also won't get away from this. It is the nature of using a more abbrasive pad compound.
That said, there is a balance... MOST ceramic pads are great at keeping dust low, but perform much more poorly than even the GM factory pads. Guys, brakes that work properly are going to dust, so get used to it... You're driving a performance car and damnit it should stop like one, not some bling crap pile!
What I've found to work pretty decent is a combination of things:
For the street, I'm currently using the Performance Friction Pad from Auto Zone. I forget the number, but next time I swap them out for my track pads (Get to those in a minute) I'll run the numbers.
I also use Russel Speed bleeders along with their newer version braded line. I say newer version, because the early version had grounding issues. The new version doesn't.
Along with that, I use a good high end brake fluid and bleed it twice per year (Motul or GS610). I also use the DRM brake duct extenders and brake duct tubing to cool the rotors. They are safety wired to the tie rods so they won't come off.
At the track I use a set of Rockauto rotors (Brand doesnt' matter, cheaper the better at $17-22 each!) that have been seasoned. If you take these rotors out of the box and throw them on and just do a track day without seasoning them, you'll heat check them and crack them sooner. We've seen this a lot over on the Road Race section of this BB. So, when swapping rotors out, keep that in mind before you go driving HARD on new rotors.
For pads I use the Hawk HT8 racing pad. They are great for track duty, but absolutely unsuitable for daily driving. They brake so aggressively in traffic, I'd cause a front/ rear collision for sure for some unsuspecting driver following me in DC Rush hour traffic, Guaranteed.
Now, About those "ceramic/ low dust" jobbers... I swapped from my Performance Friction pads to some StopTech ceramics that my Buddy Jim GAVE me. These pads require at minimum 20 Feet more stopping distance from 60mph, and YES I've tested them. These pads were something to the tune of $200 for all four wheels and I wouldn't give you a plug nickle for them. Point is, you really need to weigh the dust factor against the ability to stop the car better. To me, there is no comparison. I drive my car hard on the street and at the track. I heel toe shift most shifts and I like to KNOW that my car will stop when I want it to, where I want it to. And at 39 years of age, I'm not opposed to cleaning the wheels once per week. The car generally gets cleaned in that timeframe anyway!
I'm sure that over time, someone will come up with a better material that will dust less, and grab more... Until then, I think the factory Z06 pad, or the Performance Friction pad I'm using is the best alternative for the money in the balance between stopping and dusting.
Your mileage may vary!
Mike
That said, there is a balance... MOST ceramic pads are great at keeping dust low, but perform much more poorly than even the GM factory pads. Guys, brakes that work properly are going to dust, so get used to it... You're driving a performance car and damnit it should stop like one, not some bling crap pile!
What I've found to work pretty decent is a combination of things:
For the street, I'm currently using the Performance Friction Pad from Auto Zone. I forget the number, but next time I swap them out for my track pads (Get to those in a minute) I'll run the numbers.
I also use Russel Speed bleeders along with their newer version braded line. I say newer version, because the early version had grounding issues. The new version doesn't.
Along with that, I use a good high end brake fluid and bleed it twice per year (Motul or GS610). I also use the DRM brake duct extenders and brake duct tubing to cool the rotors. They are safety wired to the tie rods so they won't come off.
At the track I use a set of Rockauto rotors (Brand doesnt' matter, cheaper the better at $17-22 each!) that have been seasoned. If you take these rotors out of the box and throw them on and just do a track day without seasoning them, you'll heat check them and crack them sooner. We've seen this a lot over on the Road Race section of this BB. So, when swapping rotors out, keep that in mind before you go driving HARD on new rotors.
For pads I use the Hawk HT8 racing pad. They are great for track duty, but absolutely unsuitable for daily driving. They brake so aggressively in traffic, I'd cause a front/ rear collision for sure for some unsuspecting driver following me in DC Rush hour traffic, Guaranteed.
Now, About those "ceramic/ low dust" jobbers... I swapped from my Performance Friction pads to some StopTech ceramics that my Buddy Jim GAVE me. These pads require at minimum 20 Feet more stopping distance from 60mph, and YES I've tested them. These pads were something to the tune of $200 for all four wheels and I wouldn't give you a plug nickle for them. Point is, you really need to weigh the dust factor against the ability to stop the car better. To me, there is no comparison. I drive my car hard on the street and at the track. I heel toe shift most shifts and I like to KNOW that my car will stop when I want it to, where I want it to. And at 39 years of age, I'm not opposed to cleaning the wheels once per week. The car generally gets cleaned in that timeframe anyway!
I'm sure that over time, someone will come up with a better material that will dust less, and grab more... Until then, I think the factory Z06 pad, or the Performance Friction pad I'm using is the best alternative for the money in the balance between stopping and dusting.
Your mileage may vary!
Mike
Thread Starter
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 16,135
Likes: 5
From: Newberry FL
Cruise-In VIII Veteran
St. Jude Donor '07
Well guys, I am running the DURAMAX ACDELCO pads now and I agree they are nice pads, but I am going to try the HAWK HPS and see if these pads are any good. I clean and/or wash my car almost every other day and that is not an overstatement, so a little more dust doesn't concern me. I do look forward to seeing what the difference is.
Thanks for the information provided thus far.
Micah
Thanks for the information provided thus far.
Micah
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Instructor
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 114
Likes: 0
From: orlando fl
the part is true about your tires - the more resistance they put on the road, the harder it is to lock up.
mph1972 - you will be very happy with the Hawk HPS - just make sure you brandish them correctly, it's important.
mph1972 - you will be very happy with the Hawk HPS - just make sure you brandish them correctly, it's important.
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,884
Likes: 2
From: Walnut CA
People have told me that its because I didn't do all four wheels (I did just the front two) with the PFC pads and it made my braking screwy--some time some of the wheels would feel like they were locking up... Anyways, I put Z06 pads on and my car brakes quite well... I don't care about brake dust. I just wash it off...
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,555
Likes: 5
From: Fredericksburg VA
Originally Posted by turboc5
The HT8 pads, how well do they bite cold. Do they have a high initial bite? I want somthing more agressive for the street than a HP+ but it obvisly cannot be heated up first. You can never have too much brakes on the highway. Hows the dusting/squeeling compared to a HP+? As far as being rear ended, Thats alwise a worry when suv's are behind you anyway
The HP+ is great BUT it dusts up pretty good and can be noisy.
Mike
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 43,084
Likes: 33
From: Raleigh / Rolesville NC
with Mike.For street use the OEM C5 ZO6 pad is fantastic, then the OEM C5 pad.
The three worst pads I have use are AC Delco Ceramic and PCF-Z these two took too long to stop the car and I could not activate ABS, and I am not light footed.
The the worst dusting pads were Hawk HPS and Hawk HP+. I toasted these brake pads in one weekend on the track each. Dust was soo bad it made my yellow vette look like baby puke
I use the Wilwood H which has good cold bite and is a race pad. In the past I have use PFC-01s again a race pad but not very good cold bit.
I understand the new Hawk HT70 is excellent race pad too.
Again for street use the OEM pads can not be beat. Plus fresh DOT 4 brake fluid.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,555
Likes: 5
From: Fredericksburg VA
Yup The comments above about "abs" activating... Gotta disagree there... See here's the problem with that theory:
If you've got a ceramic pad, that has little initial bite, It'll tend to not GRAB the rotor as well initially as say the Factory Z06 pad. Will it engage the ABS? Sure, but later than the engagement of the factory pad or something more aggressive, like the HP+ or the PFCs that I use. I've tested this in a very LARGE commutor lot where I break in and season all my pads/ rotors, and I typically can get to about 90MPH in that lot. We have run my contractors tape (Big 250Ft. cloth tape on a reel) out and measured braking on several sets of these pads and the ceramics were just horrible when compared to the others... Just horrible.
Those ceramics I have in the box are hands down 10 fold worse than any pad I've used on my corvette and I've got SEVEN different types of pads in house, since I'm also using the Vette caliper on another project car. What can I say, I mix and match a lot!
Now, think about that for a moment... That exra 10 feet might be the difference in rearending someone when you aren't paying enough attention, or running over a kid chasing a ball! To me, Wiping a little brake dust off once per week is cheap effort for GREAT benefit.
Your mileage may vary!
Mike
The comments above about "abs" activating... Gotta disagree there... See here's the problem with that theory:If you've got a ceramic pad, that has little initial bite, It'll tend to not GRAB the rotor as well initially as say the Factory Z06 pad. Will it engage the ABS? Sure, but later than the engagement of the factory pad or something more aggressive, like the HP+ or the PFCs that I use. I've tested this in a very LARGE commutor lot where I break in and season all my pads/ rotors, and I typically can get to about 90MPH in that lot. We have run my contractors tape (Big 250Ft. cloth tape on a reel) out and measured braking on several sets of these pads and the ceramics were just horrible when compared to the others... Just horrible.
Those ceramics I have in the box are hands down 10 fold worse than any pad I've used on my corvette and I've got SEVEN different types of pads in house, since I'm also using the Vette caliper on another project car. What can I say, I mix and match a lot!
Now, think about that for a moment... That exra 10 feet might be the difference in rearending someone when you aren't paying enough attention, or running over a kid chasing a ball! To me, Wiping a little brake dust off once per week is cheap effort for GREAT benefit.
Your mileage may vary!
Mike
Last edited by Mikelly; Feb 22, 2006 at 05:19 PM.
