LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002.
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LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002.
F.Y.I. During a tour of the St. Catherines, Ontario GM Engine Plant (where our C5 engines are built) we learned that our LS1 block will be replaced by the LS6 block. The LS6 was only found in the Z06 in 2001 but it has better metallurgy so why not put it in all Corvettes. The LS6 is sand cast (in Mexico) then fully CNC machined in St. Catherines. This block also has crank case cooling holes (the LS1 does not). Cylinder walls are steel, cast in place.
Even though the block will be the same in all C5's, the cam shaft, pistons and heads will be different in the Z06 giving it much more HP. The blocks are not X-rayed but leak tested many different ways, many times etc... Tolerances are down to 9 microns on the block, 4 on the cam. The GM staff claim a small shop could not have tools accurate enough to build the engine any better. (ie. don't waste money having it blue printed - its already as close as it will get). My two cents.
Even though the block will be the same in all C5's, the cam shaft, pistons and heads will be different in the Z06 giving it much more HP. The blocks are not X-rayed but leak tested many different ways, many times etc... Tolerances are down to 9 microns on the block, 4 on the cam. The GM staff claim a small shop could not have tools accurate enough to build the engine any better. (ie. don't waste money having it blue printed - its already as close as it will get). My two cents.
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Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (Tom/99)
My concern on either block is the durability or hardness of the steel liners; after 100,000 miles are these blocks rebuildable or throwaways?
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Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (Jason Squires)
How does this block compare to the 427 C5-R block? does that block also have the crankcase cooling holes? And are the sleeves also made out of steel?
Cool info. Thanks!
Cool info. Thanks!
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Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (Jason Squires)
Its been mentioned here many times that the 01's or at least the later 01's use the LS6 block.
Wonder what is the deal with that.
Wonder what is the deal with that.
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From: Mississauga Ontario
Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (kewlbrz)
Yes "kewlbrz" one of the GM guides looked at my 2001 Coupe engine and confirmed it is an LS6 block. He was not certain but thinks they were in the transition process so some 2001's have them and some don't. Mine was built in May so I consider myself lucky (due to better metallurgy).
I'm not a technician so not able to answer other replies above. Thanks for your feedback. Jason
I'm not a technician so not able to answer other replies above. Thanks for your feedback. Jason
Drifting
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Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (kewlbrz)
later ones do have it. my dads was built in april and it does have the block as well as the intake. the only missing now is the heads and cam engine wise.
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Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (thefly)
Very interesting. How can you tell which block you have? Are there any markings or distinguishing features on the LS6 block?
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From: Mississauga Ontario
Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (mathia)
Yes "mathia" there are markings of course so that each block can be identified in the plant as it makes its way from station to station however those are now hidden. The easy way to tell is the LS6 sand cast block is a much darker grey than the LS1 which is almost bright silver (much cleaner looking aluminum). Look for the block from above but it is easier to see from below. The LS6 block is as dark as the exhaust manifold (assuming yours is fairly new and clean).
Also, at the front of the block on the pasenger's side is a very cleanly machined flat section approx. 1/2" x 2" which was machined solely for the purpose of holding the block securely/accurately in several machining stations. This mark is proof the engine was machined and assembled in the St. Catherines engine plant (which by the way is extremely clean, everything painted white including walls & ceiling, all metal shavings travel under the floor for collection and removal. It doesn't look like any metal shop I have ever visited.) Enjoy !
Also, at the front of the block on the pasenger's side is a very cleanly machined flat section approx. 1/2" x 2" which was machined solely for the purpose of holding the block securely/accurately in several machining stations. This mark is proof the engine was machined and assembled in the St. Catherines engine plant (which by the way is extremely clean, everything painted white including walls & ceiling, all metal shavings travel under the floor for collection and removal. It doesn't look like any metal shop I have ever visited.) Enjoy !
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Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (Jason Squires)
Yes "kewlbrz" one of the GM guides looked at my 2001 Coupe engine and confirmed it is an LS6 block. He was not certain but thinks they were in the transition process so some 2001's have them and some don't. Mine was built in May so I consider myself lucky (due to better metallurgy).
I'm not a technician so not able to answer other replies above. Thanks for your feedback. Jason
I'm not a technician so not able to answer other replies above. Thanks for your feedback. Jason
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Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (Jason Squires)
I have seen the top end, engine valley, of several early build 2001 model F-bodies. They have the new machining of the LS6 block, meaning there was a definate change in the oil drain back and the removal of a "boss" that did not allow the LS6 style PCV system, valley cover, to be installed on pre 2001 LS1 blocks. The 2001 blocks that I have seen where definately not cast in the same material as the LS6 block, this may have changed now, and I was told the one that got fully torn down did not have the bay to bay machined holes the LS6 has. Again, this could easily change.
There are considerable differences between the LS1/LS6 blocks and the C5R block. You can use the C5R block with your typical LS1/LS6 parts, though, like heads, cams, oil pans and such.
It really only makes since that GM would switch over to one casting. It has got to be more cost effective and it should make the parts listing easier.
Todd
[Modified by BLK 98WS6, 8:24 AM 8/28/2001]
There are considerable differences between the LS1/LS6 blocks and the C5R block. You can use the C5R block with your typical LS1/LS6 parts, though, like heads, cams, oil pans and such.
It really only makes since that GM would switch over to one casting. It has got to be more cost effective and it should make the parts listing easier.
Todd
[Modified by BLK 98WS6, 8:24 AM 8/28/2001]
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Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (Jason Squires)
I have a 2001 Camaro Z28 built in Feb. 2001 & a 2001 Corvette Coupe built June 12, 2001. I looked at both engines today & mine seems the opposite, it seems that the Z28 has a rougher darker grey color while the Corvette is a smoother brighter shinier color. Any other way of telling if the Corvette has the L6 block.
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Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (steve1173)
"steve1173" with the engine installed I am not aware of any other way to distinguish LS1 or LS6. The crank case holes are (of course) not visible, the two blocks are identical other than colour.
I wonder if a paper trail may lead to the block type ?? You may need to know a few key people in GM to do the leg work back to the block type ?? my 2 cents.
I wonder if a paper trail may lead to the block type ?? You may need to know a few key people in GM to do the leg work back to the block type ?? my 2 cents.
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Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (Jason Squires)
Guys, little did we know, but ALL 2001's had the "LS6" block.
It was done quietly, and the differnce between 97-00 LS1's and 01-02 LS1's are quite signifigant. You could even call it a refinement.
It was done quietly, and the differnce between 97-00 LS1's and 01-02 LS1's are quite signifigant. You could even call it a refinement.
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Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (Mervz)
Guys, little did we know, but ALL 2001's had the "LS6" block.
It was done quietly, and the differnce between 97-00 LS1's and 01-02 LS1's are quite signifigant. You could even call it a refinement.
It was done quietly, and the differnce between 97-00 LS1's and 01-02 LS1's are quite signifigant. You could even call it a refinement.
97-98 were identical. There were over 100 refinement changes made in 99 in the engine area that went unmarketed. Thats why you see more HP output on average from 97-98. With 01+ LS1 there isnt any difference except for adding the LS6 intake (which is basiaclly useless for stock LS1 breathing needs), and they added the 6.0 liter truck cam in 01 to move numbers around and add a little torque. The addition of the 2 cats brings it all back in line to 99-00. Thats why rwhp numbers are so similar from 99-01.
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Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (kewlbrz)
Guys, little did we know, but ALL 2001's had the "LS6" block.
It was done quietly, and the differnce between 97-00 LS1's and 01-02 LS1's are quite signifigant. You could even call it a refinement.
I would disagree alot.
97-98 were identical. There were over 100 refinement changes made in 99 in the engine area that went unmarketed. Thats why you see more HP output on average from 97-98. With 01+ LS1 there isnt any difference except for adding the LS6 intake (which is basiaclly useless for stock LS1 breathing needs), and they added the 6.0 liter truck cam in 01 to move numbers around and add a little torque. The addition of the 2 cats brings it all back in line to 99-00. Thats why rwhp numbers are so similar from 99-01.
It was done quietly, and the differnce between 97-00 LS1's and 01-02 LS1's are quite signifigant. You could even call it a refinement.
I would disagree alot.
97-98 were identical. There were over 100 refinement changes made in 99 in the engine area that went unmarketed. Thats why you see more HP output on average from 97-98. With 01+ LS1 there isnt any difference except for adding the LS6 intake (which is basiaclly useless for stock LS1 breathing needs), and they added the 6.0 liter truck cam in 01 to move numbers around and add a little torque. The addition of the 2 cats brings it all back in line to 99-00. Thats why rwhp numbers are so similar from 99-01.
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Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (kewlbrz)
With the changes between the LS1 block and the LS6 block being mostly casting material and machining, it would be very difficult to pin dyno numbers on the vehicles to prove/disprove if it has the LS6 machining upgrades. I have seen the engine valley of several early 2001 F-bodies and they definately had the changes to the oil drainbacks and the valley machining.
The changes to the PCM tuning, cam, intake and exhaust all had effect on the HP difference of the 2001s vs earlier models.
I think the key point here is that the LS1 cars did not get the "actual" LS6 block, but that they got a LS1 block with the "refinements" of the LS6 block. It is very typical to any auto manufacturer to bring improvements to older products as engineering discovers them. In this case, the powertrain team found some things that could be improved in the block and applied them. I do not believe the 2001 LS1 blocks have the bay to bay breathing holes of the LS6, but have the oil drainback and engine valley change.
Todd
The changes to the PCM tuning, cam, intake and exhaust all had effect on the HP difference of the 2001s vs earlier models.
I think the key point here is that the LS1 cars did not get the "actual" LS6 block, but that they got a LS1 block with the "refinements" of the LS6 block. It is very typical to any auto manufacturer to bring improvements to older products as engineering discovers them. In this case, the powertrain team found some things that could be improved in the block and applied them. I do not believe the 2001 LS1 blocks have the bay to bay breathing holes of the LS6, but have the oil drainback and engine valley change.
Todd
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Re: LS6 block will replace LS1 block for 2002. (Jason Squires)
c4c5specialist or c5tech --Would you please comment on this topic?
Is or has the general standardized on the LS6 block?
If so, when?
And, how can you the two blocks apart?
Thank you in advance for your response.
Is or has the general standardized on the LS6 block?
If so, when?
And, how can you the two blocks apart?
Thank you in advance for your response.
