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Help with steps to take when diagnosing electical problems.

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Old Sep 28, 2008 | 09:10 AM
  #1  
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From: Holliston MA
Default Help with steps to take when diagnosing electical problems.

To recap my problem, I have an 02 Z06 and the engine cranks but does NOT start.

I am getting DTC's:
P0351
P0352
P0353
P0354
P0355
P0356
P0357
P0358

Below is the troubleshooting steps for those codes (Document ID# 776184).

Question:
Since the car does NOT start, based on steps 2,3,4 it is states to the start engine.

1. Do I start off first with step #5 since I cant start the engine?

2. Do they want step #4 completed with the car running as part of step #3?


Thanks
Jason


Step
Action
Value
Yes
No

Schematic Reference: Engine Controls Schematics

1
Did you perform the Diagnostic System Check-Engine Controls?
--
Go to Step 2
Go to Diagnostic System Check - Engine Controls

2
Observe the Freeze Frame/Failure Records for this DTC.
Turn OFF the ignition for 30 seconds.
Start the engine.
In order to operate the vehicle under the conditions which set the DTC, use the following information:
The data in the Freeze Frame/Failure Records
The parameters listed in the Conditions for Running in the DTC
Does the DTC fail this ignition?
--
Go to Step 3
Go to Intermittent Conditions

3
Turn OFF the engine.
Disconnect the respective electrical connector of the ignition coil.
Start the engine.
Connect the DMM, select the DC Hertz setting in order to measure the frequency at the respective IC signal circuit. Refer to Measuring Frequency in Wiring Systems.
Does the frequency measure within the range that is specified?
3-20 Hz
Go to Step 7
Go to Step 4

4
Measure the voltage at the respective IC signal circuit using the DMM.

Is the signal circuit voltage more than the specified value?
1 V
Go to Step 13
Go to Step 5

5
Turn OFF the ignition.
Disconnect the PCM connector. Refer to Powertrain Control Module (PCM) Replacement .
Connect the DMM in order to test the continuity from the respective ignition control circuit, at the ignition coil electrical connector, to the PCM connector. Refer to Testing for Continuity in Wiring Systems.
Does the DMM indicate continuity?
--
Go to Step 6
Go to Step 14

6
Test the respective ignition control circuit for a short to ground. Refer to Testing for Continuity in Wiring Systems.

Did you find and correct the condition?
--
Go to Step 17
Go to Step 15

7
Turn ON the ignition, with the engine OFF.
Connect a test lamp to the battery ground in order to probe the Ignition 1 voltage circuit of the IC. Refer to Troubleshooting with a Test Lamp and to Probing Electrical Connectors in Wiring Systems.
Does the test lamp illuminate?
--
Go to Step 8
Go to Step 9

8
Connect a test lamp to B+ in order to probe the ground circuit of the Ignition Coil. Refer to Troubleshooting with a Test Lamp and to Probing Electrical Connectors in Wiring Systems.

Does the test lamp illuminate?
--
Go to Step 11
Go to Step 10

9
Repair the open in the ignition 1 voltage circuit. Refer to Wiring Repairs in Wiring Systems.

Did you complete the repair?
--
Go to Step 17
--

10
Repair the open in the ground circuit for the IC. Refer to Wiring Repairs in Wiring Systems.

Did you complete the repair?
--
Go to Step 17
--

11
Inspect for poor connections at the IC harness connector. Refer to Testing for Intermittent and Poor Connections and to Connector Repairs in Wiring Systems.

Did you find and correct the condition?
--
Go to Step 17
Go to Step 12

12
Replace the ignition coil. Refer to Ignition Coil(s) Replacement .

Did you complete the replacement?
--
Go to Step 17
--

13
Repair the IC circuit for a short to voltage. Refer to Wiring Repairs in Wiring Systems.

Did you complete the repair?
--
Go to Step 17
--

14
Repair the IC circuit for an open circuit. Refer to Wiring Repairs in Wiring Systems.

Did you complete the repair?
--
Go to Step 17
--

15
Inspect for poor connections at the PCM harness connector. Refer to Testing for Intermittent and Poor Connections and to Connector Repairs in Wiring Systems.

Did you find and correct the condition?
--
Go to Step 17
Go to Step 16

16
Replace the PCM. Refer to Powertrain Control Module (PCM) Replacement .

Did you complete the replacement?
--
Go to Step 17
--

17
Use a scan tool in order to clear the DTCs.
Turn OFF the ignition for 30 seconds.
Start the engine.
Operate the vehicle within the Conditions for Running the DTC, as specified in the supporting text.
Does the DTC run and pass?
--
Go to Step 18
Go to Step 2

18
Use a scan tool in order to observe the stored information in Capture Info.

Does the scan tool display any DTCs that you have not diagnosed?
--
Go to Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) List
System OK
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Old Sep 28, 2008 | 12:07 PM
  #2  
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Have you proven continuity to ground and voltage to the coil circuit? Have you measured for frequency on the respective wires to verify ignition pulse? You need to determine what is missing causing your ignition failure. No continuity to ground.....fix the ground. No ignition voltage on the coils.......isolate the open circuit and repair (possibly a blown fuse). No pulse.....verify no pulse at PCM, verify pulse from crank and cam sensors. If you have all of that, replace PCM.
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Old Sep 28, 2008 | 01:05 PM
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Start basic you need four things to run an engine. Fuel, spark, air, and compression. Check and make sure you have fuel pressure, either with a gauge or by pushing the shrader valve on the fuel rail(careful as fuel should spray out if this is done), check it with the key in the run position and while cranking. Next check for spark, pull a plug and install a spark tester, crank engine and make sure you have spark. Air, check that there is nothing blocking airflow. Check that the mass airflow sensor has power and is grounded and no corrosion on the wires. It is a little hard to check the mass airflow with out some kind of computer. While you have one or more of the spark plugs out for a spark test, do a quik compression test.

If you do not get a good test on one of these systems you go from there, if you have all four the engine should run, so something is missing on your car.
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Old Sep 28, 2008 | 04:27 PM
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From: Holliston MA
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Originally Posted by BLOWNBLUEZ06
Have you proven continuity to ground and voltage to the coil circuit? Have you measured for frequency on the respective wires to verify ignition pulse? You need to determine what is missing causing your ignition failure. No continuity to ground.....fix the ground. No ignition voltage on the coils.......isolate the open circuit and repair (possibly a blown fuse). No pulse.....verify no pulse at PCM, verify pulse from crank and cam sensors. If you have all of that, replace PCM.

I have not yet tested for continuity. I will do that ASAP.

I have not measured for frequency. Based on the directions it says to start the engine, since the car does not start. Can I still measure for frequency with the ignition in the on position?
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Old Sep 28, 2008 | 10:15 PM
  #5  
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Does the engine turn over? If not, is the security light flashing? If it does turn over but not start, you'll need to verify the things already stated.
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Old Sep 29, 2008 | 09:16 AM
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From: Holliston MA
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Originally Posted by dgrant3830
Does the engine turn over? If not, is the security light flashing? If it does turn over but not start, you'll need to verify the things already stated.
Yes the engine does turn over....it does not start due to no spark at any of the coils.
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Old Sep 29, 2008 | 09:18 AM
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From: Dyer, IN
Default

Originally Posted by BLOWNBLUEZ06
Have you proven continuity to ground and voltage to the coil circuit? Have you measured for frequency on the respective wires to verify ignition pulse? You need to determine what is missing causing your ignition failure. No continuity to ground.....fix the ground. No ignition voltage on the coils.......isolate the open circuit and repair (possibly a blown fuse). No pulse.....verify no pulse at PCM, verify pulse from crank and cam sensors. If you have all of that, replace PCM.
Reply
Old Sep 29, 2008 | 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by JSTAN
I have not yet tested for continuity. I will do that ASAP.

I have not measured for frequency. Based on the directions it says to start the engine, since the car does not start. Can I still measure for frequency with the ignition in the on position?
Yes you can still measure for frequency or pulse. It is possible to have a trigger pulse and no voltage and therefore no spark. These coils have electronic components in them preventing you from simply measuring the primary and secondary windings in them, but you can make sure they have everything they need to function properly. Since none of them are working, you need to test the common electrical items. Hot, ground and pulse.
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Old Sep 29, 2008 | 10:46 AM
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From: Bridgewater Ma
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Could still be a security problem.If you did a column lock mod,take it out and try.Also could easilly be a crank sensor or cam sensor.

Either way,if you don't find it you can drop the car off at my new shop.I have spare computers.
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Old Sep 29, 2008 | 07:03 PM
  #10  
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From: Holliston MA
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Originally Posted by Slowhawk
Could still be a security problem.If you did a column lock mod,take it out and try.Also could easilly be a crank sensor or cam sensor.

Either way,if you don't find it you can drop the car off at my new shop.I have spare computers.

Don...If I can't figure out the problem, you will be getting a call.
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Old Sep 29, 2008 | 08:04 PM
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Originally Posted by JSTAN
Yes the engine does turn over....it does not start due to no spark at any of the coils.
Look at the ground connection on the rear of the driver's side head and make sure its tight.
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Old Oct 6, 2008 | 10:37 PM
  #12  
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From: Holliston MA
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Originally Posted by dgrant3830
Look at the ground connection on the rear of the driver's side head and make sure its tight.
That was the problem.

Thanks for the help.
Reply

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