No Competitive Mode?? TCS Discussion
Tech Contributor
Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 40,999
Likes: 9,764
From: Charlotte, NC (formerly Endicott, NY)
Thanks though Bill cause I was wondering the same thing...I didn't think that the EBCM would be sending any type of "torque reduction" signal at a stand still.
Definitely PCM controlled.
Now...if it is PCM controlled, is there any way to update the file or something to the newer version???
DZ
Definitely PCM controlled.
Now...if it is PCM controlled, is there any way to update the file or something to the newer version???
DZ
Bill
Pro
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 517
Likes: 0
From: Arlington Texas
I have held the traction control button down for much longer than 10 seconds on my 2000 A4, and I do not get a "Competitive Mode" message on the DIC. It seems that some cars have it and some don't -- at least pre-2001 cars.
Safety Car
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 4,661
Likes: 67
From: Ocean Springs MS
As mentioned in numerous posts earlier in the thread, if you don't have the option JL4, Active Handling, you can't have "Competition Mode." As "Competition Mode" is Traction Control Off and Active Handling On, no Active Handling makes that tough.
Pro
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 619
Likes: 2
From: Destin FL
Wow, there is alot of good healthy discussion going on here - we all learn from it - together.
I don't know which module is sensing what, all I know is...
1. To do a burnout, you have to have TC OFF or it's quite embarrassing (the computer bogs the engine down and makes you look like a rookie who doesn't know how to do a proper burnout).
2. Upon launching, you have to have TC OFF or if your tires spin even a little bit, the computer will bog the engine down and add several tenths to your ET (also embarrassing).
3. On my 02 coupe, I intentionally use Competitive Driving mode because a) TC must be OFF for the burnout, b) TC must be OFF for launch, and c) I want Active Handling ON to straighten the car out for me if it starts getting squirrelly (I'm not too proud to admit that my Corvette's computers are WAY faster than my reflexes).
I don't know which module is sensing what, all I know is...
1. To do a burnout, you have to have TC OFF or it's quite embarrassing (the computer bogs the engine down and makes you look like a rookie who doesn't know how to do a proper burnout).
2. Upon launching, you have to have TC OFF or if your tires spin even a little bit, the computer will bog the engine down and add several tenths to your ET (also embarrassing).
3. On my 02 coupe, I intentionally use Competitive Driving mode because a) TC must be OFF for the burnout, b) TC must be OFF for launch, and c) I want Active Handling ON to straighten the car out for me if it starts getting squirrelly (I'm not too proud to admit that my Corvette's computers are WAY faster than my reflexes).
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,191
Likes: 43
From: Scottsdale Az
I didn't say it didn't happen. I just said if it truly does what you are saying it has nothing to do with the ABS/TC/AH system. There is no way for the EBCM to do that. Torque management is a function of the PCM not the EBCM. In a traction control event the PCM sends a requested torque signal to the PCM and the PCM sends a return signal telling the EBCM that torque has been reduced. The EBCM can only request a torque reduction if the drivers foot is off the brake pedal and there is a difference between front and rear wheel speeds. Neither of those conditions exist when you are power braking.
Read a technical article on the way ABS/TC/AH work on the C5 and other cars and you will see what I mean.
Bill
Read a technical article on the way ABS/TC/AH work on the C5 and other cars and you will see what I mean.
Bill
Race Director
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 14,051
Likes: 9
From: Houston TX
If you power brake, doesnt that imply that the front wheels are not turning (zero wheel speed) and the rear wheels are turning (wheel speed above zero), and that there is significant diffence between the speeds of the front a rear wheels... and unless the TC/AH/ABS/Torque Management/PCM/EBCM system was designed to take this situation into account it would "panic" and believe that there was a significant problem and it was time to get the rear wheels to slow down?
It would stand to reason that the condition described by the OP is quite possible and even probable if the entire system was not designed/programmed to detect the "power brake" situation. And even if the car checks for "brake pedal" position, a line lock would really throw a system that doesnt check the yaw sensors and accellerometers
Just a thought.
Perhaps these are the major programming and logic and condition checks that were put into AH II vs AH I.
It would stand to reason that the condition described by the OP is quite possible and even probable if the entire system was not designed/programmed to detect the "power brake" situation. And even if the car checks for "brake pedal" position, a line lock would really throw a system that doesnt check the yaw sensors and accellerometers
Just a thought.
Perhaps these are the major programming and logic and condition checks that were put into AH II vs AH I.
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 4,949
Likes: 10
From: Monticello MN
Race Director
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 14,051
Likes: 9
From: Houston TX
Corvette Stories
The Best of Corvette for Corvette Enthusiasts
10 Revolutionary 'Corvette Firsts' Most People Don't Know
Joe Kucinski
5 Reasons to Upgrade to an LS6-Powered Corvette; 5 Reasons to Stay LT2
Michael S. Palmer
2027 Corvette vs The World: Every C8 vs Its Closest Competitor
Joe Kucinski
10 Most Common Corvette Problems of the Last 20 Years!
Joe Kucinski
5 MOST and 5 LEAST Popular Corvette Model Years in History!
Joe Kucinski
2027 Corvette Buyer's Guide: Everything You Need to Know!
Joe Kucinski
10 Things C8 Corvette Owners Hate (But Won't Tell You)
Joe Kucinski
10 Best Corvettes Coming to Barrett-Jackson Palm Beach 2026!
Brett Foote
Every Corvette Grand Sport Explained! (C2, C4, C6, C7, & C8)
Joe Kucinski
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 4,949
Likes: 10
From: Monticello MN
Ed
Race Director
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 14,051
Likes: 9
From: Houston TX
In Competitive Driving, when powerbraking, I'm standing hard on the brakes. I don't believe the back wheels are moving at all. It seems to be related to a particular rpm zone, i.e. 1200-1500 rpms. Power begins cycling down, at that point, and then back up, but never exceeds the point at which it began the cycling. When Active Handling is turned off, no problem.
Ed
Ed
Last edited by RC45; Dec 27, 2008 at 11:44 PM.
Intermediate
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 26
Likes: 2
From: Cameron Park California
reply to Comp mode
Okay so I was under the impression that Chevy added the comptetive mode TCS to 2001-up, but this past week I ran into a gentleman at the strip who had a 2000 like mine that had Comp. mode. He even showed me, he held the button down for 5-10 secs and the screen read "Competitve Mode." I thought this guy might have been mistaking about his year, and opened the door to read a mfgr date of 4/2000. So now im wondering if there's something wrong with my car because it only does TCS on/off. Any thoughts? Thanks!
andrew
andrew
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,507
Likes: 9
Never heard of this before. The EBCM has no way of knowing what the driver is doing with the throttle. It gets all of its speed information from the wheel speed sensors. If somebody is powerbraking all 4 sensors are reading zero speed and the EBCM doesn't see a differential between front and rear wheel speeds so it will not request a reduction in torque. As far as the EBCM is concerned you can be sitting at a stop sign with your foot off the throttle or with the throttle buried and it will not know.
If this truly happens with an early JL4 car it hasn't got anything to do with the ABS/TC/AH subsystem.
Bill
If this truly happens with an early JL4 car it hasn't got anything to do with the ABS/TC/AH subsystem.
Bill