I just got fiished reading the REALLY LONG thread where the 2002 Z28 claims to want to crush an LT4 Vette. Many of you think that the LT4 will crush him based on HP numbers, track times. Well, track times cannot be compared unless it is same driver, same day, same place. Trap speed, temp, and weight can be. However, SAE corrected Dyno numbers can be reasonablly compared, within a couple of percent. I just looked up some #'s on the LT4 vettes and they seem to be putting down about 300-305 HP, same as the LS1 stock 6 speed F-body (2001, 2002). The F-body has a higher tq output, though (~305 vs 325). The Vette is lighter and will hook up better, so, I think that the reasonable assumption here will be that the Vette driver doesn't have to be a better driver to win, but if the Z driver is OUTSTANDING, he will win! The standard can be tricky to launch, so the dvantage gors to the Camaro here. Colse race, both cars are beautiful and great performance cars! Just my .02$
Tom
Oh yeah, those of you who doubt that the LS1 F-body (2001+) is not putting down 350HP, I invite you to visit your local dyno shop for an open dyno day. Most autos are about 290, 6 speeds are ~305 at the wheels. the SS with the 345 HP packages (lid, cat back) are laying down 320-325 at the wheels! :crazy:


[Modified by tslawsky, 11:31 AM 2/24/2002]


[Modified by tslawsky, 11:33 AM 2/24/2002]

 

if you're not working, we're all meeting at Beef O'bradys on Bearss and Bruse B Downs at 2pm for lunch :cheers:

 

not to flame right back at ya....but what is your point?

 

yea, i don't get it either.

 

Just saw a lot of bad info posted and wanted to clarify some things! some people will post opinion as fact, I hate to see that! No flame.

 

Well, you said that STOCK ls-1 Fbody will have about 300 RWD hp.

I've never seen one dynoed but the magazines like car and driver and motor trend reported stock 2001 number at 265, and the SS model at 280-290.

 

No, he's right....the F bodies put down virtually the same HP as the Vettes.....the F bodies are 300-400 pounds heavier though....

 

:yesnod:

 

Horsepower to weight ratio is a very big deal in terms of acceleration performance, but you're right in the fact that on any given day an excellent driver can make the difference. :D

 

The fastest Camaro SS 0-60 I've read about was 4.9 sec. The C5 vert that was tested by Car & Driver recently did it in 4.5 sec and an 02 Z06 in 4.0 seconds flat. Dyno numbers are one thing, but as was mentioned, power-to-weight and weight tranfer upon launch are critical bits of info when trying to decide which car "should" be faster. (assuming equally-skilled drivers)

 

Straight line 440 yards, 0-60 and all those dyno numbers aside.... I've had several straight line cars like many of you guys. Among them was a blown '70SS 454 and a '73 Z28 with dual quad tunnel ram on top of a 396. They ran like scalded apes straight line, but they wouldn't turn worth a hoot... and that's really what I find is just SO damn enjoyable driving the C5. It's like the car is on a rail. And when I gas it a bit on a nice smooth straight highway, it's still makes me smile. And I can't even tell you what my rwhp is to the number. :)

I'd like to "speculate" (which is what we're doing here to a great extent) :) that if the Camaro took on the Z51 C5 on a road course, it'd be over before it ever started.
:cry
:cheers:

 

No speculation necessary there, Gunny.

One of the mags (I thin it was R&T) did a "big brother/little brother" comparo last year, with company pairs. They used Acura NSX vs. Honda S2000, Ferrari 550 vs. 360, etc. The Chevy pair was a 2001 Z06 vs. a 2001 high-end F-body coupe. The Z06 beat the F-body by 14 seconds a lap on the road course. The drivers still remarked that the F-body was better than they'd expected. 14 seconds in a Z06, don't know what that would be worth in a LS1 coupe, but surely 6-10 seconds.

The '01 Z06 came in second overall on the road course. It was edged out by the 360 Modena and just beat the 550 Maranello (yep, I'm repeating that correctly. I also got into an argument with Mjolitor68 about that, but the results are correct).

No idea about an LT4 C4, but I'd HOPE the C4 would win based on lower CG, better tires, and better suspension...<shrug>.

 

Thanks Matt, great info to have. More knowledge is more ammunition when sitting around the poker tables with old gear head friends. :)

:cheers:

 

Just saw a lot of bad info posted and wanted to clarify some things! some people will post opinion as fact, I hate to see that! No flame.[/QUOTE]


Sound like you have a little Vette envy, The Ls1 Z28 was indeed a fast car , I still cant believe they are no-longer. But I have a suggestion for you, instead of speculating something over the internet, why dont you just go and find an LT4 vette and find out for yourself ? Both cars in the 1/4 are pretty evenly matched, the better driver will win, if drivers are equal the Vette will edege it, the LT4's , especially the first 1000 GS's are very underated(the first 1000's GS's had hand ported heads) I have seen them put over 300rwhp yet they are rated at 330 (not 325) and are lighter and slicker than the F-body.
Should be a good race. Also I dont know where some people are getting that the Ram air F-Bodies are faster than the regular ones, from what I have seen they dont dyno any better, the ram air on those things are a joke, the air has to go in the duct travel to almost the end of the hood, then curve around, go all the way back, then curve again down into the box. The Ram air versions are also heavier, I consistanly see them run slower at the strip.


[Modified by dave zehak, 7:08 PM 2/25/2002]

 

There's no doubt the SS and the Z06 aren't even in the same arena when it comes to handling, but did anyone else wonder why MT tested a regular (non-SLP optioned) SS against the Z06? The SLP SS comes with the 1LE, cat-back, BFG G-Force's, etc.. that might have made that comparo a little closer.

The bottom line is that MT in no way wants to make the SS look any better than they have to when comparing it to Chevy's badboy. Well that's what I thought anyway, and maybe I'm wrong, JMO.

 

What month was this MT test? I didn't realize you got KD's with SLP options.

 

Some of you guys need to lay off the magazines. Sound like a bunch of ricer guys in here...who on earth beleives a stock LS1 camaro would dyno 265 just because a magazine says so? Thats rediculous.

Talk like that is probably what triggered this thread in the first place.

Hard facts. I dyno'd around 340-345rwhp in my C5, my friend has about 335rwhp in his LS1 Z28 (328rwhp, then he added a cutout). We raced from 30->130mph each time (rolling start to rule out launching skills), and there was a 4 car length difference. Same gearing, both stick shifts, etc. Normally, a car length is about 10rwhp, and 100lbs equals about the same. So it works out close...figure 1 car for the 10rwhp, 3 cars for the 300lb weight difference, and there's the race.

 

Sounds like you have a bit of superiority complex :lol: ! where do you get I have envy from saying that people should call opinions.....opinions, not facts???????? :confused:

 

Better yet, why not test the Koni optioned SS against the ZO6. that thing pulls .93 on the skid pad and is beefed up for autoXing, plus they shoulda added the cat-back for another 10-15HP. If they were going to use the SS thay did, they shoulda used the base vette. they used the ZO6, so they should have sed the Koni, race preped SS to be fair. the Vette woulda still won, but the margin of victory would have been much closer!!!!! Magazines....sheesh :U

 

ts...the skidpad is an artificial test that the magazine folks came up with to give them something else to report! :D Skidpad numbers are another little bit of smoke and mirrors...

Found the "Sibling Rivalry" article on line. I don't know anything about F-bodies, so I can't tell you what option level their car was at. I was right - it's "Road and Track", January 2001.
http://www.roadandtrack.com/RoadAndT...bling_pg1.html

~Matt