Which timing chain with no damper?
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,898
Likes: 9
From: Morrisville PA
Which timing chain with no damper?
Doing a cam swap on my car soon...I have been researching all day on which parts to buy. I was going to get a UD pulley, but looks like they can contribute to timing chain failures if the car is driven hard, so I am sticking with the stock pulley.
Now I just learned that my '99 ls1 doesn't have a timing chain damper like my ls2 gto had. I was going to get the ls2 chain as a replacement, but it looks like it will have too much slack now. Will the Katech C5R chain work fine without a damper? I have no interest in drilling holes or modifying the ls2 damper to make it "work".
Now I just learned that my '99 ls1 doesn't have a timing chain damper like my ls2 gto had. I was going to get the ls2 chain as a replacement, but it looks like it will have too much slack now. Will the Katech C5R chain work fine without a damper? I have no interest in drilling holes or modifying the ls2 damper to make it "work".
Pro
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 593
Likes: 9
From: San Antonio Texas
I am not a tech guru but it seems that if you drive your car "hard" something will eventualy break. If it is the timing chain or some other part it really doesn't matter does it? I replaced my HB with a stock one from GM but I dont drive hard and I have a stock LS1 345 HP A4. I did consider an under drive and some of the more expensive aftermarket HBs. However, I made my decision based on the way I drive and perhaps you should too? Remember that all high performing systems eventually self destruct. That is the nature of physics and you can not get around it. Good Luck.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,898
Likes: 9
From: Morrisville PA
Well, the idea is to get the most miles out of the engine WHILE driving it hard 
. There are also different definitions of driving hard. There are the guys who do the occasional blast to 100...the guys who drag race every weekend...or the guys who auto-x. I am between guy A and B. I will do a 1 or 2 gear blast down the road daily and go drag racing 3-4 times a year.
I am just going to go with the C5R...I found a comparison pic to the ls2 and the slack is the same, so I will go with the stronger part. Also upgrading to the katech ls6 pump while I am in there.
. There are also different definitions of driving hard. There are the guys who do the occasional blast to 100...the guys who drag race every weekend...or the guys who auto-x. I am between guy A and B. I will do a 1 or 2 gear blast down the road daily and go drag racing 3-4 times a year.I am just going to go with the C5R...I found a comparison pic to the ls2 and the slack is the same, so I will go with the stronger part. Also upgrading to the katech ls6 pump while I am in there.
Pro
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 593
Likes: 9
From: San Antonio Texas
Ultimately you have to make the decision and go with what you are happiest with regarding parts! It helps me to discuss options with someone even if I have already made up my mind as to what I am going to do! That is the great thing about this forum. People exchanging ideas. Didn't we all learn that "two heads are better than one" at an early age? Good Luck!
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,898
Likes: 9
From: Morrisville PA
Amen to that.
Now I am reading that a ported oil pump is completely unnecessary on a motor with stock clearances. Thinking about just getting a replacement ls6 pump. My oil pressure is fine right now.
Now I am reading that a ported oil pump is completely unnecessary on a motor with stock clearances. Thinking about just getting a replacement ls6 pump. My oil pressure is fine right now.
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Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,898
Likes: 9
From: Morrisville PA
Racer
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 437
Likes: 3
From: Indiana
Maybe this is a stupid question, but do any C5's some with a damper?
Thanks for the info, not trying to hijack your thread here i'm just doing a cam swap in the next couple days and have the ls2 chain already
Thanks for the info, not trying to hijack your thread here i'm just doing a cam swap in the next couple days and have the ls2 chain already
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 22,025
Likes: 192
From: At the beach in little Rhody
Stock damper is a smart move, or the ATI. As for the damper, it is really an issue of RPM and chain whip. If you are drag racing it is not as big an issue, if you are in the mid/upper RPM band and shifting up and down, this is where the damper is benficial. There are some posts by Kurt Urban on this subject that provide a lot of insight. Katech is another good source of information. Their ultimate setup, at least a few years ago, was the Cloyes Hex-adjust and C5R chain, which is the IWIS chain ("68" if I recall, have that information at home that I received from IWIS in Germany). This is the same chain used on the BMW M5. Note that not all IWIS chains are created equal, and the one that comprises the C5R chain is top shelf. There are other copy cat chains that aren't as strong and are not built from the same materials. If you go with the IWIS chain, make sure it is the Katech C5R chain either from Katech or a vendor who sells their products.
I did a lot of research in timing chains when I installed my setup, in the end I went with the Cloyes Hex-adjust and the IRL chain along with the damper. Note also that Katech did have some leftover dampers for the LS1/LS6 a while back, not sure if they are gone now but might be worth an e-mail to Jason at Katech.
I did a lot of research in timing chains when I installed my setup, in the end I went with the Cloyes Hex-adjust and the IRL chain along with the damper. Note also that Katech did have some leftover dampers for the LS1/LS6 a while back, not sure if they are gone now but might be worth an e-mail to Jason at Katech.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,898
Likes: 9
From: Morrisville PA
Stock damper is a smart move, or the ATI. As for the damper, it is really an issue of RPM and chain whip. If you are drag racing it is not as big an issue, if you are in the mid/upper RPM band and shifting up and down, this is where the damper is benficial. There are some posts by Kurt Urban on this subject that provide a lot of insight. Katech is another good source of information. Their ultimate setup, at least a few years ago, was the Cloyes Hex-adjust and C5R chain, which is the IWIS chain ("68" if I recall, have that information at home that I received from IWIS in Germany). This is the same chain used on the BMW M5. Note that not all IWIS chains are created equal, and the one that comprises the C5R chain is top shelf. There are other copy cat chains that aren't as strong and are not built from the same materials. If you go with the IWIS chain, make sure it is the Katech C5R chain either from Katech or a vendor who sells their products.
I did a lot of research in timing chains when I installed my setup, in the end I went with the Cloyes Hex-adjust and the IRL chain along with the damper. Note also that Katech did have some leftover dampers for the LS1/LS6 a while back, not sure if they are gone now but might be worth an e-mail to Jason at Katech.
I did a lot of research in timing chains when I installed my setup, in the end I went with the Cloyes Hex-adjust and the IRL chain along with the damper. Note also that Katech did have some leftover dampers for the LS1/LS6 a while back, not sure if they are gone now but might be worth an e-mail to Jason at Katech.
. The hardest I run the car on the street is basically a 1 gear WOT blast daily, and the occasional 1-2-3 run. Maybe hit the drags twice a year. Never road race the car.How do you feel about the slp UDP? I am thinking this issue with harmonic dampening really only applies to cars that are driven hard on road courses. Seems plenty of people run the slp/powerbond with no issues for thousands of miles without issue.
