Snapped header bolt, what now!
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,931
Likes: 2
From: Tx
Snapped header bolt, what now!
I have learned my lesson now, never trust a dial in torque wrench. :mad
I actually purchased the high dollar one from sears and I still ended up snapping a header bolt. The dam things are just not accurate, or I don't know how to use them properly. How hard can it be? I dialed in exactly what the shop manual said, but that dam click is just hard to detect in the low settings. I should have known something was wrong, guess I was just too tired.
One good thing, the broken bolt is in the one place where there are two bolts very close together (in the middle). I'm hoping it will not leak, and I can just leave it alone.
If not, what should I do? How much is it going to cost me. Hmmm, maybe some new heads are in my future.
I also learned another lesson during this mod. Stop when you get tired. Bad things start to happen when you get tired and try to rush!
[Modified by QuickSilver2002, 8:29 AM 8/13/2002]
I actually purchased the high dollar one from sears and I still ended up snapping a header bolt. The dam things are just not accurate, or I don't know how to use them properly. How hard can it be? I dialed in exactly what the shop manual said, but that dam click is just hard to detect in the low settings. I should have known something was wrong, guess I was just too tired.
One good thing, the broken bolt is in the one place where there are two bolts very close together (in the middle). I'm hoping it will not leak, and I can just leave it alone.
If not, what should I do? How much is it going to cost me. Hmmm, maybe some new heads are in my future.
I also learned another lesson during this mod. Stop when you get tired. Bad things start to happen when you get tired and try to rush!
[Modified by QuickSilver2002, 8:29 AM 8/13/2002]
Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 840
Likes: 1
From: Oakland CA
Re: Snapped header bolt, what now! (QuickSilver2002)
Where did the bolt break at? Is there any portion of the remaining bolt that is out of the head? If you think that you can get a vice grip on the broken part ( probably need to remove the header again), you may be able to spin it out. I would try my best to get it out...the craftsman easy outs also work well for me on bolts that have broken below the surface. I wouldn't want to put all the things together and then find out that I had an exhaust leak ( now or down the road some time). Sorry to hear of your troubles, but after the job is finished...you will have the satisfaction of doing the job yourself. :cheers:
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,931
Likes: 2
From: Tx
Re: Snapped header bolt, what now! (Saving41)
It broke blow the surface, there was really nothing I could grab.
I'm hoping that extra bolt was there because of the design of the stock manifolds, and it is not really needed when there is nothing flowing between each port.
I'm going to get flanges welded onto the collectors, so taking them back off later on should not be that bad.
How do the easy outs work?
I'm hoping that extra bolt was there because of the design of the stock manifolds, and it is not really needed when there is nothing flowing between each port.
I'm going to get flanges welded onto the collectors, so taking them back off later on should not be that bad.
How do the easy outs work?
Advanced
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 97
Likes: 0
Re: Snapped header bolt, what now! (QuickSilver2002)
there are several different types of easy-outs. snap-on makes a very good set or you can go to sears or a tool outlet and get some. the traditional easy-outs require you to drill a specific size hole then insert the easy-out and rotate to extract the bolt. when you insert it try tapping lightly with a hammer as you rotate the easy-out this will help seat the tool and get a better bite. there are also reverse drill bits that work ok, but what ever you do spray the broken bolt with a penetrating oil like KROIL or TRI-FLO this also helps. hope it works out for you! andy- ;)
Drifting
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 1,994
Likes: 0
From: Dunstable MA
Cruise-In II Veteran
Cruise-In V Veteran
Re: Snapped header bolt, what now! (QuickSilver2002)
I've used the reverse easy out bits with a lot of success.
I've even done the same thing (on my old rustang).
You may find it difficult to in there and may need a 45 degree converter for a cordless drill.
Good Luck!
Chris
I've even done the same thing (on my old rustang).
You may find it difficult to in there and may need a 45 degree converter for a cordless drill.
Good Luck!
Chris
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 8,145
Likes: 1
From: Bradenton FLORIDA
Re: Snapped header bolt, what now! (chrislee2)
You will probably need a right angle drill (rent one from an equipment rental place) to get at it correctly....again, take lots of care to NOT let the drill bit walk out of the bolt center. Alos, I know some may disagree, but I never use a torque wrench on header bolts. I tighten them with a 3/8"ratchet just enough by had so that it is plenty tight, but not over torqued. (kinda hard to explain ...) :cheers:
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Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 2,596
Likes: 120
From: East Tennessee
Re: Snapped header bolt, what now! (QuickSilver2002)
.
I also learned another lesson during this mod. Stop when you get tired. Bad things start to happen when you get tired and try to rush!
[Modified by QuickSilver2002, 8:29 AM 8/13/2002]
I also learned another lesson during this mod. Stop when you get tired. Bad things start to happen when you get tired and try to rush!
[Modified by QuickSilver2002, 8:29 AM 8/13/2002]
Problem with a 3/8" torque wrench is the handle is so long and if you dont feel the 'click' its very easy to snap a small bolt right off - it happened to a lot of people including myself.
If the bolt threaded in very easy and it broke clean (and you didnt use any locktite on it) there is a good chance you can get it out by turning it with a small pick or a small hammer and screwdriver if you have an edge to catch it on and try to turn.
If the bolt was hard going in, crossthreaded or it snapped because it bottomed out just cross your fingers and hope it doesnt leak. If its really tight in the threads the small easy outs will snap sometimes and that is not a good spot to be drilling. You may get lucky and it might stay sealed if the flange is thick enough - good luck.. May be a good time to consider a ported set of heads :)
[Modified by kp, 3:30 PM 8/13/2002]
Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,054
Likes: 8
From: Cape Coral Florida
Re: Snapped header bolt, what now! (QuickSilver2002)
When you installed the header bolt, did you put some washers on the
bolt so it would not bottom out? With 1/4" flanges the stock bolts may
bottom out before you have tightened and thats when you fun the risk
of breaking a bolt.
bolt so it would not bottom out? With 1/4" flanges the stock bolts may
bottom out before you have tightened and thats when you fun the risk
of breaking a bolt.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,931
Likes: 2
From: Tx
Re: Snapped header bolt, what now! (bparker)
clamp your wrench in the vise and try it at low settings
I had a pretty good sized washer on and I do not think that the bolt bottomed out. It was going in fairly well when it snapped. That wrench is just so long that I was getting way more leverage than I thought possible. I'll bet I was putting 50lbs on it. Think it is a good candidate to be extracted. I also had a good amount of anti seize on it.
I purchased some of the easy out extractors today from sears and plan to take everything back apart and give it a try later on in the week. It's going to bug me if I don't get it right, I'm pretty much a perfectionist when it comes to this car.
Thanks again for the advice guys. The forum continues to be my best mod to date.
One other bit of good news, my ATI Procharger showed up today :) , so the car will probably stay up in the air so that I can get it all done at once. Good thing this car is not my daily driver. I finally have my wife convinced that it is ok to have a 40k car that spends more time on jack stands than driving around.
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 22,025
Likes: 192
From: At the beach in little Rhody
Re: Snapped header bolt, what now! (fight4yourrights)
I have the same wrench and had the same problem @ 5.5 lb-ft. Very light click
Race Director
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 15,707
Likes: 1
From: Lynnfield MA
Cruise-In II Veteran
Cruise-In III Veteran
Cruise-In VI Veteran
Re: Snapped header bolt, what now! (QuickSilver2002)
IMHO try to see if it leaks first before going after the bolt... If it does leak, than easy-out it with the proper equipment... Good luck!
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 3,504
Likes: 25
From: Insert Wittty Comment here
Re: Snapped header bolt, what now! (Smoke-N-Shot)
A buddy of mine has a machine shop where they remove broken bolts out of cylinder heads and exhaust manifolds all the time. Here is a bit of advice.
Be careful.
Take your time.
Make sure if you drill the bolt that you use a center punch to mark the CENTER of the bolt. That punch mark will keep the drill from walking.
Be patient.
And finally this. Don't use too small an ease-out, or get your drill bit in a bind. If you break either one of them off in that bolt, you are in trouble.
There is no way to remove broken extractors or drill bits with another drill bit. They are too hard. What you have to do at that point is take the heads to a shop that has an EDM . Basically this a Carbon Arc gouge that does precision work. They can burn out the bolt, and leave the hole in a fairly undamaged state (the only damage is what you might have done). EDM usually costs about $50-$100 per hole depending on the shop.
Good luck...
Also as the other folks stated. If you have an edge, I might try a punch and use it to turn the bolt. Especially if it is covered in "never seize"...
Be careful.
Take your time.
Make sure if you drill the bolt that you use a center punch to mark the CENTER of the bolt. That punch mark will keep the drill from walking.
Be patient.
And finally this. Don't use too small an ease-out, or get your drill bit in a bind. If you break either one of them off in that bolt, you are in trouble.
There is no way to remove broken extractors or drill bits with another drill bit. They are too hard. What you have to do at that point is take the heads to a shop that has an EDM . Basically this a Carbon Arc gouge that does precision work. They can burn out the bolt, and leave the hole in a fairly undamaged state (the only damage is what you might have done). EDM usually costs about $50-$100 per hole depending on the shop.
Good luck...
Also as the other folks stated. If you have an edge, I might try a punch and use it to turn the bolt. Especially if it is covered in "never seize"...
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,931
Likes: 2
From: Tx
Re: Snapped header bolt, what now! (J-Rod)
Wahoo!!!
I got it out.
I did not end up using the easy out extractor or any of the other methods mentioned.
This was somewhat strange but it worked great.
There was just a little nub sticking out from the head. Not enough to grab it with anything. I tried tapping on it with different devices... then I suddenly thought how easy it would be if it had a groove in it like a typical screw head…duh!. I quickly grabbed my Dremil with a very thin and small cut off wheel attached, and began to form a nice groove in what was above and slightly below the surface). It worked great. http://home.austin.rr.com/quicksilve...roken-bolt.jpg I then just had to rig up a stubby flathead screwdriver and vice grip to form a good leverage. The rest is history.
I've now learned my lesson and hope I don't have to deal with this situation again.
Thanks again for all the advice guys. I'm glad this story had a happy (low cost) ending.
[Modified by QuickSilver2002, 4:58 AM 8/16/2002]
I got it out.
I did not end up using the easy out extractor or any of the other methods mentioned.
This was somewhat strange but it worked great.
There was just a little nub sticking out from the head. Not enough to grab it with anything. I tried tapping on it with different devices... then I suddenly thought how easy it would be if it had a groove in it like a typical screw head…duh!. I quickly grabbed my Dremil with a very thin and small cut off wheel attached, and began to form a nice groove in what was above and slightly below the surface). It worked great. http://home.austin.rr.com/quicksilve...roken-bolt.jpg I then just had to rig up a stubby flathead screwdriver and vice grip to form a good leverage. The rest is history.
I've now learned my lesson and hope I don't have to deal with this situation again.
Thanks again for all the advice guys. I'm glad this story had a happy (low cost) ending.
[Modified by QuickSilver2002, 4:58 AM 8/16/2002]
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 2,596
Likes: 120
From: East Tennessee
Re: Snapped header bolt, what now! (QuickSilver2002)
What matters is you got it out :cheers:
Even if it didnt leak I still would have tried to get it out - I cant stand not doing something right.
Have fun with your ATI, you will like it :)
Even if it didnt leak I still would have tried to get it out - I cant stand not doing something right.
Have fun with your ATI, you will like it :)
