I have a very wet oil pan, ie dripping, and the area behind the balancer is grimy, but not at all wet, having read several other threads on the subject and that is unlikely the actual rubber gasket has failed, dealer today quoted me 750 just for the oil pan gaskets, and 13 or 1400 for oil pan, front and rear mains.
I've gathered my first step will be to clean, then use dye in the oil, and if it verifies the oil pan is indeed leaking, I'll torque first.
The question is, has anyone actually had the oil pan gaskets fail and have to be replaced? If so, what caused them to fail, if known?

 

I would think the font main seal is the issue. Your on the right track. Clean and try to find where the leak is coming from.

 

After 130,000 miles I reused my lower pan gasket after my engine rebuild without issue. That would be the last place I would look for a leak on these. The prices you were quoted seem high to me. I paid about $50 each for my upper and lower pan gaskets. I plan to install my lower pan gasket later after I break in my engine and check the pan.

I agree with the above poster to check the seals.

 

when i can get the car up again, ill post some pics

 

As CamminC5 stated clean and monitor for leakage. There is a seal behind the harmonic balancer and thats what he's suggesting could be leaking.

Your oil pan seal will only leak if the oil pan bolts are loose or they were overtightened and pinched the gasket. Doubtful that it is rotten since it's made of silicon rubber. GM even say's you can reuse the oil pan gasket.

 

I purchased my 2001 with a known oil pan leak. The PO had records showing that the oil pan gasket had been changed at least 3 times and possibly 4 within 10,000 miles. The oil pan was still leaking after all this work.

It was leaking at each back corner of the upper pan and dripping on the exhaust pipes and had the whole bottom of the car oily from the leak blowing back when driving.

When i pulled the motor and began inspecting the gasket it looked perfect. I then began looking at why it was leaking. I found the back of the pan was not level. I do not know whether it was improperly torqued or some other thing done wrong.

I took the upper pan to my machine shop and they resurfaced the pan and noted it was way out of level. After I finished my rebuild it had not a speck of oil leaking. 6000 miles later and still everything is dry.

I am just telling this story to make sure that whoever does your job to be sure they inspect everything and just not change the gasket and then have to go back and do it again.

Also as stated above in another post the front crankshaft seal has been known to leak and make a terrible mess from the front and blowing back all over the place.

Your plan to clean and then check where the leaks actually are is a great one.

Good luck with your repair.

 

Leaks can be a bit elusive because if you have a leak at the front the wind will blow the oil everywhere. Look behind the harmonic balancer and in the bell housing inspection cover.

 

You can carefully retorque the upper and lower pan bolts. NOTE! The rear two pan bolts STRIP OUT very easily!!!! So do the lower pan bolts.

Those pan gaskets are the LAST thing that I would say is bad.

I let my son drive my car and when I went to work the next morning I saw LOTS of oil under the front and under the engine.

I was ready to have some A$$!!

There was oil dripping from the front of the pan to the rear end!

I ended up just being a bad front seal and bad damper sealing surface. WHEW!!!!!!!!!!!!!




On another note,,,,,,, Ive also see the Oil Pressure Sender fail and leak oil and it runs down the back and sides of the engine and on to the pan.

Take a look behind the intake manifold with a mirror/flashlight.

 

After the dye, the heaviest concentration was at the leaf spring, under the pulley, so I think it safe to say you guys are absolutely right on calling the front main seal instead of the pan.

pics are worthless, too dark

 

Don't worry about buying a special tool to install these. Use a piece of wood larger than the hole and tap it in evenly. Put a little lube on the lip of the seal to ease with installing over the crank snout, and make sure the lip doesn't roll.

 

There are two corners where the timing cover meets the pan. I think a little RTV is needed in that corner when it goes back together. Ditto for the rear main seal cover. and you can get oil at these corners and think it is the seal. To fix it, though you are taking the harmonic balancer off and the front timing cover. The PP is correct, you don't need the install tool, but it might help to protect the dab of RTV (at the corners) until the cover seats.

Taking out a Harmonic balancer is one PITA. Putting a new one back is the exact same PITA except in reverse.

 

After the repair, clean the leaf spring. Heat and fluids can cause it to delaminate and eventually crack. It is about the only thing that gets to them.