mrr23

This was the very first question answered by tadge

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...post1588884164

But of course calling and demanding they fix it will work out great.

Manufacturers are only required to make new parts available for 10 years after the production date of the car.

Slo Yelo C5

Let's face it...when it comes to the 1997-2000 Corvette...GM really dropped the ball. No replacement SWPS? No replacement EBCM? TPMS which run $500 for replacement?!

I've owned 2 other GMs that were high mileage and older (a 22 year old Caprice with 200,000 miles and a 14 year old Cavalier with 200,000 miles). They were both very reliable overall, but when parts did break replacements were always readily available. I've never personally heard of a car that is 17 years old and many important (ie TPMS, EBCM, etc) and crucial (ie SWPS, etc) parts are either not readily available, outrageously expensive (in the case of the EBCM and TPMS--I'm guessing they are nearly approaching Porsche prices for the equivalent Porsche parts--but that's just a guess), or not available at all unless you go on a practical never-ending hunt (SWPS). It makes no sense.

I was talking with my parent's neighbor recently who is a car enthusiast and works on his own cars. He has a 1969 Dodge Superbee with a 440 Six-Pack, 1970 Dodge Superbee with a 440 Six-Pack, and a 2001 Porsche 911 Turbo. I asked if he ever needed a part for any of those 3 cars and had trouble or couldn't purchase it. He mentioned although some parts for them can be expensive (and he emphasized high prices for Porsche parts), he couldn't ever remember not being able to purchase a part, and two of his cars are 47 and 48 years old!

I realize 47 and 48 year old cars didn't have technology like C5 Corvettes, and the little electrical they did have was probably far more simplistic (putting it mildly). But that's not an excuse to not have replacement parts available. His Porsche is only 1 year newer than my Corvette and to the best of his knowledge any part is available for it. 911 Turbo parts for a 2001 Porsche vs. Corvette parts for a 2000 C5 seems like an apples-to-apples comparison at least as far as parts availability.

Lastly, they didn't have replacement EBCMs available for 1997-2000 Corvettes at least as early as 2007. I saw numerous posts online dated from 2007-2008 with 1997-2000 Corvette owners saying dealerships told them EBCMs were no longer produced. If you were a 2000 Corvette owner unable to get a replacement EBCM from GM in 2007 or 2008, that's when the car was 7 or 8 years old. Meaning GM was violating federal law and knew these weren't available before the 10 year period had run its course.

GM did a great job building these cars. They're awesome. That's exactly why I'm so upset...because I want to keep the car indefinitely. With the lack of some parts (and possibly more to come in the future), this is a huge obstacle to overcome for long term ownership. That's extremely upsetting, but GMs complete and total lack of support for long term ownership of their halo car is even more disheartening.

I understand they are in the business of selling new cars, but guess what? I do own, and plan to own, more cars than just the Corvette I currently have. Do you want to hold onto repeat customers? Then a good idea is to not tell them to pound sand when they are in need of assistance. Just saying.

feeder82

you could make this same argument for every car made, GM isnt the only one, it's simply a fact of business, how much more would cars cost if the original manufacturer had to keep parts around forever

v8srfun

It is federal law that ten years after the vehicle is manufactured the manufacturer does not have to produce parts for it any more. If your c5 was 9 years old gm would be obligated to produce a part.

One would have the most success getting every person that needs this part from gm to agree to a type of group buy. Then when you contact gm you can say I have this many people needing this part we are all willing to buy them if you wil stamp them out. Please let us know how much it would cost and if we get more buyers will the price get better.

Gm is a Buisness if they see financial gain in making these parts they will but they will not make them at a loss or a return that takes years to complete.

mrr23

Unfortunately gm lost the designs during the bankruptcy.

Slo Yelo C5

I am assuming you read my post above.

I've read numerous comments from around the internet dated as early as 2007-2008 stating that "Generation 1" (1997-2000) EBCMs were not available from GM. Meaning that model year 2000 Corvettes had no replacement EBCM available as early as 7-8 years after production ended. Don't believe me? Do a Google search.

I'm sure GM didn't intend on running out of EBCMs for 1997-2000 Corvettes before the 10 year period, per federal law, but based on customers with broken EBCMs reporting that dealers told them the part wasn't available as early as 2007-2008...well, you can draw your own conclusions.

Slo Yelo C5

I've heard this from many on here. I'm confused though.

What does everybody mean when they say "lost the design"? Was the design a patent (obviously it would have been patented) that they lost the rights to after going through bankruptcy proceedings and now the rights are owned by a different company that purchased the patent rights?

Or does it mean they lost it...like physically lost it? I can't even begin to wonder, if they lost it physically, how you just lose a design that probably cost millions or tens of millions to create and manufacture? Even in the late 90's, everything was saved on computers and backed up...usually several times for corporate information. Losing it physically, if that is what happened, makes me wonder how that's even possible. Like an employee just threw the blueprints in a dumpster? And then deleted all copies and multiple backup copies off the computer? That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

mrr23

Physically lost is my understanding which is why a few are trying to reverse engineer it. Problem is the gel inside. Trying to remove it does serious damage.

either way good luck. Fight the good fight. Grab a lawyer and demand action. Even though they ran out before 10 years, it's way past the ten year Mark for anything to happen
Plus the added bankruptcy gets in the way.

twokbolt

There is no federal law that says parts must be available for a fixed time of ten years. I would challenge anyone who says there is to find the actual law. The law only requires that parts be produced and made available for the full warranty period of the vehicle. In the case of the Corvette pretty sure even extended warranties from GM didn't last 10 years.

Slo Yelo C5

If it was physically lost...wow. I just can't even begin to wonder how that's possible. Between them likely having many physical copies of the blueprints/specs/build sheet and having it saved on computers, with them likely having backups on the computer...I'm at a loss how that could even happen.

I've heard about the whole "potted" design with that incredibly sticky, rock-hard epoxy. I don't see how that obstacle could be overcome, short of maybe getting a sample of the epoxy in a lab, determining the chemical makeup, and then trying to formulate a chemical compound that could weaken and/or destroy the epoxy, all while not damaging the fragile components inside.

Even if a private attorney, Attorney General's office, etc. could or would challenge GM under the assumption of a violation of some sort of consumer law saying parts weren't available within 10 years of the end of production (assuming that is federal law--I've not seen any statute like that--but heard others say that is the case), there is one barrier after another. The first and most basic is...has a claim of that nature, even if it is a violation of some consumer protection law, become unenforceable due to the statute of limitations being exceeded on said claim? Even if the statute of limitations hasn't run out, the bankruptcy is an almost insurmountable obstacle. From what I understand, GM's bankruptcy was a "custom" bankruptcy, if I recall. All kinds of unique rules around their bankruptcy due to the unique situation, making claims incredibly difficult to pursue.

The only hope at all, other than GM voluntarily agreeing to a settlement/solution (I won't hold my breathe), is a federal safety agency determining the affected units with failed SWPS and/or EBCMs are "unsafe" motor vehicles, forcing a settlement/solution of some kind. Even if GM shouldn't have to/can't/won't come up with replacement parts, your ability to sell an affected unit with say, EBCM failure, is reduced to the point the car is not resellable/marketable. Don't believe me? Take a C5 with ABS and Traction Control warning lights and DIC messages to a dealer and see if they're willing to buy it. I think you'll see a pink unicorn before you find a dealer willing to purchase the unit. Private sales will be a similar experience. Hence, value drops on affected units to almost "worthless" status if you choose or have to sell or trade-in the car. That is why if GM shouldn't have to/can't/won't provide replacement SWPS and EBCM, they should be forced to purchase back affected units at fair market value based on mileage and condition.

That's just my opinion. It may be strong, but as a longtime GM buyer and supporter, who has purchased nothing but GM products my entire life, I have every right to be critical about this. If people who own '57 Chevy Bel Airs can find parts, owners of 1997-2000 Corvettes should be able to locate parts.

P.S. The EBCM issue is discussed frequently and there is a lot of information about it. What's the story on the SWPS? Why can't you buy a SWPS for these cars? And why are TPMS such a big deal for these cars? I've never heard of a car that needs such "special" (translation: expensive) TPMS. The SWPS and TPMS are intriguing issues. Anybody know the answers?

v8srfun

The point is gm will never produce them again and complaining about it is just waisted time

Slo Yelo C5

Fair enough.

Just curious...but do you know what the deal is with the SWPS? How did that disappear? I'm just curious if there is a story about it like what happened with the EBCM.

Also, why are TPMS such a PITA and super expensive for this car? There doesn't seem to be any rational reason when the 2001-2004 C5 TPMS seems to be run of the mill and everywhere.

mrr23

i bought 4 TPMS off of ebay new from china for 58.00. they work just fine.

this is no different than when the cross-fire injection came out from 82-84. they made something then redesigned it. the EBCM, SWPS and TPMS 1st design were from 97-00. they redesigned it and moved on. the SWPS and EBCM work together, so natural they would die together on the drawing board.

the TPMS and key fobs are on the same antenna and so same thing. redesign and move on.

DEgerton

I also have the C1255 code. 2000 Corvette. Can you send me information please?

Vetteman Jack

Moved to C5 Tech.

DEgerton

Hi, although our corvette is a 2000, it has been modified to a C6. Will that make a difference with the EBTCM repair/rebuild/replacement?

Vetman99

[QUOTE=DEgerton;1599406395]I also have the C1255 code. 1999 Corvette. Can you send me information please?[ Any iformation you have would be greatly appreciated thanks.

helga203

[QUOTE=Vetman99;1604539725] Hope u are good with electronics. Look at the sticky above thats ur best bet.