Valve Stem Oil Seals
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,956
Likes: 135
From: Maryland
Valve Stem Oil Seals
Any brand better than the others?
After multiple seal changes over the years, I just had my first three pop-off. This was on a new spring kit. Dual springs and I use the kent-moore tool.
Anyone try these from TSP for duals:
https://www.texas-speed.com/p-6283-p...e-springs.aspx
Look interesting but pricey for a seal and TSP's shipping is outrageous these days.
How about these el'cheapo's from RockAuto. They're Viton and look the same as all the rest:
https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...sn=794&jsn=794
Interesting in that they have almost the same part number as TSP's standard Viton seal.
Rob
After multiple seal changes over the years, I just had my first three pop-off. This was on a new spring kit. Dual springs and I use the kent-moore tool.
Anyone try these from TSP for duals:
https://www.texas-speed.com/p-6283-p...e-springs.aspx
Look interesting but pricey for a seal and TSP's shipping is outrageous these days.
How about these el'cheapo's from RockAuto. They're Viton and look the same as all the rest:
https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...sn=794&jsn=794
Interesting in that they have almost the same part number as TSP's standard Viton seal.
Rob
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,097
Likes: 111
From: Fredericksburg Virginia
New motor last year and in 3500 miles I went through 6 qts of oil. Got home swapped all the valve stem seals to the felpros and no more consumption issues. Oil was getting into exhaust but not going through combustion chambers so I guessed it was exhaust valve seals. No more smoking or use. They are after market heads, Dart 205 with some work done to them.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 6,192
Likes: 750
From: near the thumb in the mitten
Popping off is unusual, if they are properly intalled. I would describe condition to spring supplier and see what they recommend. It could be inner diameter of spring is grabbing seal
Last edited by Kevova; Jun 10, 2018 at 05:49 PM.
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 22,025
Likes: 192
From: At the beach in little Rhody
Not sure if I recall correctly, but didn't you speak to Tony Mamo about the 8019 springs you are running? Think I might speak with him prior to making any decisions if that is who you spoke with about the springs.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,956
Likes: 135
From: Maryland
Yep, sent him an email. His guess is they weren't properly seated. I'll pull all the springs and measure the seal to lower spring seat distance to see if any others have moved.
Hard to believe they weren't seated. The seals that lifted are in easy to reach areas and using the kent-moore tool you can hear / feel when they're down all the way. Like I said, this is a first for me after many swaps. But, I guess there's always a first time for screwing something up!!
If they lift a second time then I'll know something is wrong.
Thanks
Rob
Hard to believe they weren't seated. The seals that lifted are in easy to reach areas and using the kent-moore tool you can hear / feel when they're down all the way. Like I said, this is a first for me after many swaps. But, I guess there's always a first time for screwing something up!!
If they lift a second time then I'll know something is wrong.
Thanks
Rob
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,956
Likes: 135
From: Maryland
Finally got into it today. I picked up the black Freudenberg seals from BTR. There were more seals off than originally thought. Only did the passengers side but six seals were off and destroyed, two were lifted but still attached. That pretty much makes it eight for eight failures so far.
Any chance I had some valve float and that pulled them off? I had purposely oriented the red stripe on the springs and noticed they all had rotated. I just watched a video on valve float and it showed the springs rapidly spinning. I don't believe I screwed up installing even just one seal never mind all the seals. This time I measured them with calipers after installing and they're all fully seated.
Any chance I had some valve float and that pulled them off? I had purposely oriented the red stripe on the springs and noticed they all had rotated. I just watched a video on valve float and it showed the springs rapidly spinning. I don't believe I screwed up installing even just one seal never mind all the seals. This time I measured them with calipers after installing and they're all fully seated.
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,862
Likes: 594
From: Prescott, Arizona
I am wondering if the springs are walking around, working the seals off in the process.
Check this link, maybe give Ferrea a call and see what they think.
http://www.dragzine.com/news/locatio...seat-locators/
Check this link, maybe give Ferrea a call and see what they think.
http://www.dragzine.com/news/locatio...seat-locators/
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 22,025
Likes: 192
From: At the beach in little Rhody
Finally got into it today. I picked up the black Freudenberg seals from BTR. There were more seals off than originally thought. Only did the passengers side but six seals were off and destroyed, two were lifted but still attached. That pretty much makes it eight for eight failures so far.
Any chance I had some valve float and that pulled them off? I had purposely oriented the red stripe on the springs and noticed they all had rotated. I just watched a video on valve float and it showed the springs rapidly spinning. I don't believe I screwed up installing even just one seal never mind all the seals. This time I measured them with calipers after installing and they're all fully seated.
Any chance I had some valve float and that pulled them off? I had purposely oriented the red stripe on the springs and noticed they all had rotated. I just watched a video on valve float and it showed the springs rapidly spinning. I don't believe I screwed up installing even just one seal never mind all the seals. This time I measured them with calipers after installing and they're all fully seated.
Last edited by vettenuts; Jun 26, 2018 at 03:39 PM.
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Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,956
Likes: 135
From: Maryland
I have the larger dia, heavy wall Manton pushrods. Emailed Tony and talked to a few other co's. All agree that seals coming off that many valves indicates its something other than an installation issue. A couple of seals were only slightly lifted (the rest are totally destroyed) and they do show evidence of contact / wear completely around the perimeter of the metal bushing. This weekend I'll try to set up a dial indicator and measure the total amount of play with the spring and locator on the guide and compare that to my previous spring & locator.
The locators are not a snug fit like in the Ferrea article. They easily slip on the guide and the spring easily fits on the locator. I'll measure all the clearances this weekend.
The locators are not a snug fit like in the Ferrea article. They easily slip on the guide and the spring easily fits on the locator. I'll measure all the clearances this weekend.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,956
Likes: 135
From: Maryland
Looks like about .02" of play at the spring and locator as well as spring and retainer. If I push the spring over at locator it may be ok. When I push both ends over the .02" its pretty much on the seal. The retainers from my previous springs fit with no play at all. Its almost a press fit like the Ferrea video (but with the retainer not the locator).
I'll reassemble with the BTR seals and my old retainers and see what happens. If thats a fail, I'll see if the TSP one piece seals / locators will work with these springs.
Anyone know of a locator with an ID of .505" for stock guides and a step OD for a .675" ID spring?
I'll reassemble with the BTR seals and my old retainers and see what happens. If thats a fail, I'll see if the TSP one piece seals / locators will work with these springs.
Anyone know of a locator with an ID of .505" for stock guides and a step OD for a .675" ID spring?
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 22,025
Likes: 192
From: At the beach in little Rhody
If I remember correctly, the locator and spring should be a line fit (slip on but minimal clearance). A clearance of 20 thousandths seems to be too much. Are you using the AFR locators? Wonder if Tony has an old one laying around he can send you to try for comparison.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,956
Likes: 135
From: Maryland
AFR uses cup style locators. Tony looked for something with better fit but they were all made for the larger guides of an aftermarket head.
I talked to TSP today. Their one piece seat / seal is made for a .680" spring ID so those should work with my .675" springs. So I'll continue with my plan of 8019 springs, my old retainers for zero clearance on top, current locators with .02" of play and BTR seals. I'm guessing I'll be installing the TSP seals after the next weekend at the track.
I talked to TSP today. Their one piece seat / seal is made for a .680" spring ID so those should work with my .675" springs. So I'll continue with my plan of 8019 springs, my old retainers for zero clearance on top, current locators with .02" of play and BTR seals. I'm guessing I'll be installing the TSP seals after the next weekend at the track.
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,893
Likes: 295
From: Buffalo NY
AFR uses cup style locators. Tony looked for something with better fit but they were all made for the larger guides of an aftermarket head.
I talked to TSP today. Their one piece seat / seal is made for a .680" spring ID so those should work with my .675" springs. So I'll continue with my plan of 8019 springs, my old retainers for zero clearance on top, current locators with .02" of play and BTR seals. I'm guessing I'll be installing the TSP seals after the next weekend at the track.
I talked to TSP today. Their one piece seat / seal is made for a .680" spring ID so those should work with my .675" springs. So I'll continue with my plan of 8019 springs, my old retainers for zero clearance on top, current locators with .02" of play and BTR seals. I'm guessing I'll be installing the TSP seals after the next weekend at the track.
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,893
Likes: 295
From: Buffalo NY
I know you said you replaced them due to the originals popping up, but what made you investigate that? Oil consumption, or something else?
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,956
Likes: 135
From: Maryland
Back end of the car was covered with oil speckles after every track day. I run three catch cans so I knew it wasn't from the PCV. Car's remained clean since the last seal change.