Changing O2 Sensors
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Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 6,366
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From: Fort Lauderdale, Florida
Changing O2 Sensors
Lately I've been getting O2 codes on the DIC of 133 and 153. I plan to go to ECS to get Doug to check my tune, but I figure since I have an oil change due, I would put new sensors in before I head down there. Besides, the exhaust smells more than it used to and gas mileage has gotten worse. I have LG headers with two sensors deleted and the rears moved forward. My question is, is there a particular brand of sensor that seems to work better than others? Denso, Bosch? I had no luck with AC. Looking for educated opinions from people who have changed theirs. Since it is a real pain to get under my car (lowered) I'd like to do this only once.
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Lately I've been getting O2 codes on the DIC of 133 and 153. I plan to go to ECS to get Doug to check my tune, but I figure since I have an oil change due, I would put new sensors in before I head down there. Besides, the exhaust smells more than it used to and gas mileage has gotten worse. I have LG headers with two sensors deleted and the rears moved forward. My question is, is there a particular brand of sensor that seems to work better than others? Denso, Bosch? I had no luck with AC. Looking for educated opinions from people who have changed theirs. Since it is a real pain to get under my car (lowered) I'd like to do this only once.
Moderator, Tech Contributor
Joined: Sep 2013
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From: Cape Coral, Florida
Hello my NJ Bud !!
You starting getting the 133/153 after the header install ??...I don't like to fiddle with "tuned" cars but if you still get the DTC's after your tune I'm not all that far away so I can probably check it out for you !!...my '01 O2'S are starting to get a little lazy but I'm too lazy to change them !!
You starting getting the 133/153 after the header install ??...I don't like to fiddle with "tuned" cars but if you still get the DTC's after your tune I'm not all that far away so I can probably check it out for you !!...my '01 O2'S are starting to get a little lazy but I'm too lazy to change them !!
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,375
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From: CA.
St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15
The issue with LT headers is that the front 02's are moved futher back then the stock locations as much as 3' The front 02's are designed to only worl the best in the stock locations This is whu LT's are illegal in most stares----It causes the front 02's to not heat up or read correctly and your engine will run rich at P/T and the mileage suffers--- There is no 100% fix for this however some good results have been had by lowereing your front 02 switching points to make the 02's oscilate at a leaner AFR--It is a trial and error process only accomplished using a widebamd 02 set-up I would start by lowering the switching points by "100" to the whole table and using a wideband see if your P/T AFR's get leaner closer to the stoich 14.68-1---( typically LT's will make your P/T fueling go very rich into the 12's)
Racer
Joined: Jan 2003
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Cruise-In IV Veteran
I just replace my O2s, and I have LG long tubes also. Used Bosch. I had similar codes and also PO305 (#5 cylinder misfire). Car idled terrible while in gear. Cured all of its issues.
Bosch 13111, 47 inch connection lead. worked like a charm.
Bosch 13111, 47 inch connection lead. worked like a charm.
Heel & Toe
Joined: Jan 2018
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From: C.G. Az.
The issue with LT headers is that the front 02's are moved futher back then the stock locations as much as 3' The front 02's are designed to only worl the best in the stock locations This is whu LT's are illegal in most stares----It causes the front 02's to not heat up or read correctly and your engine will run rich at P/T and the mileage suffers--- There is no 100% fix for this however some good results have been had by lowereing your front 02 switching points to make the 02's oscilate at a leaner AFR--It is a trial and error process only accomplished using a widebamd 02 set-up I would start by lowering the switching points by "100" to the whole table and using a wideband see if your P/T AFR's get leaner closer to the stoich 14.68-1---( typically LT's will make your P/T fueling go very rich into the 12's)
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Joined: Aug 2018
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From: QC AZ
The issue with LT headers is that the front 02's are moved futher back then the stock locations as much as 3' The front 02's are designed to only worl the best in the stock locations This is whu LT's are illegal in most stares----It causes the front 02's to not heat up or read correctly and your engine will run rich at P/T and the mileage suffers--- There is no 100% fix for this however some good results have been had by lowereing your front 02 switching points to make the 02's oscilate at a leaner AFR--It is a trial and error process only accomplished using a widebamd 02 set-up I would start by lowering the switching points by "100" to the whole table and using a wideband see if your P/T AFR's get leaner closer to the stoich 14.68-1---( typically LT's will make your P/T fueling go very rich into the 12's)
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From: Anthony TX
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St. Jude Donor '08
Ahhh,,, That is,,, IF, your O2 Heater Circuit/s are working properly.
The C5 can have a couple of problemsthat prevent the heaters from functioning correctly or functioning at all. One is the ignition voltage that powers the circuit that comes out of the ignition switch and the other is the actual circuit ground. It can become corroded at the splice pack behind the battery. I strongly recommend the anyone who is having O2 sensor troubles, at a minimum check the VOLTAGE and CURRENT to the sensors and the ground path out of the sensors for proper continuity.
Check the OXYSEN Fuse test points (on top of the fuse) to chassis ground and insure that there is full battery voltage at both test points. I would also recommend LOAD testing those fuse test points with a test light to see if there is adequate current flowing through that circuit to support heater operation. A standard automotive brake light bulb will do the job fine.
If the ignition switch electrical contacts are burnt/carboned up, it will limit current and voltage. Very common problem in the C5.
Bill
The C5 can have a couple of problemsthat prevent the heaters from functioning correctly or functioning at all. One is the ignition voltage that powers the circuit that comes out of the ignition switch and the other is the actual circuit ground. It can become corroded at the splice pack behind the battery. I strongly recommend the anyone who is having O2 sensor troubles, at a minimum check the VOLTAGE and CURRENT to the sensors and the ground path out of the sensors for proper continuity.
Check the OXYSEN Fuse test points (on top of the fuse) to chassis ground and insure that there is full battery voltage at both test points. I would also recommend LOAD testing those fuse test points with a test light to see if there is adequate current flowing through that circuit to support heater operation. A standard automotive brake light bulb will do the job fine.
If the ignition switch electrical contacts are burnt/carboned up, it will limit current and voltage. Very common problem in the C5.
Bill
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Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 66
Likes: 6
From: QC AZ
Ahhh,,, That is,,, IF, your O2 Heater Circuit/s are working properly.
The C5 can have a couple of problemsthat prevent the heaters from functioning correctly or functioning at all. One is the ignition voltage that powers the circuit that comes out of the ignition switch and the other is the actual circuit ground. It can become corroded at the splice pack behind the battery. I strongly recommend the anyone who is having O2 sensor troubles, at a minimum check the VOLTAGE and CURRENT to the sensors and the ground path out of the sensors for proper continuity.
Check the OXYSEN Fuse test points (on top of the fuse) to chassis ground and insure that there is full battery voltage at both test points. I would also recommend LOAD testing those fuse test points with a test light to see if there is adequate current flowing through that circuit to support heater operation. A standard automotive brake light bulb will do the job fine.
If the ignition switch electrical contacts are burnt/carboned up, it will limit current and voltage. Very common problem in the C5.
Bill
The C5 can have a couple of problemsthat prevent the heaters from functioning correctly or functioning at all. One is the ignition voltage that powers the circuit that comes out of the ignition switch and the other is the actual circuit ground. It can become corroded at the splice pack behind the battery. I strongly recommend the anyone who is having O2 sensor troubles, at a minimum check the VOLTAGE and CURRENT to the sensors and the ground path out of the sensors for proper continuity.
Check the OXYSEN Fuse test points (on top of the fuse) to chassis ground and insure that there is full battery voltage at both test points. I would also recommend LOAD testing those fuse test points with a test light to see if there is adequate current flowing through that circuit to support heater operation. A standard automotive brake light bulb will do the job fine.
If the ignition switch electrical contacts are burnt/carboned up, it will limit current and voltage. Very common problem in the C5.
Bill
Moderator, Tech Contributor
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 15,595
Likes: 4,055
From: Cape Coral, Florida
Ahhh,,, That is,,, IF, your O2 Heater Circuit/s are working properly.
The C5 can have a couple of problemsthat prevent the heaters from functioning correctly or functioning at all. One is the ignition voltage that powers the circuit that comes out of the ignition switch and the other is the actual circuit ground. It can become corroded at the splice pack behind the battery. I strongly recommend the anyone who is having O2 sensor troubles, at a minimum check the VOLTAGE and CURRENT to the sensors and the ground path out of the sensors for proper continuity.
Check the OXYSEN Fuse test points (on top of the fuse) to chassis ground and insure that there is full battery voltage at both test points. I would also recommend LOAD testing those fuse test points with a test light to see if there is adequate current flowing through that circuit to support heater operation. A standard automotive brake light bulb will do the job fine.
If the ignition switch electrical contacts are burnt/carboned up, it will limit current and voltage. Very common problem in the C5.
Bill
The C5 can have a couple of problemsthat prevent the heaters from functioning correctly or functioning at all. One is the ignition voltage that powers the circuit that comes out of the ignition switch and the other is the actual circuit ground. It can become corroded at the splice pack behind the battery. I strongly recommend the anyone who is having O2 sensor troubles, at a minimum check the VOLTAGE and CURRENT to the sensors and the ground path out of the sensors for proper continuity.
Check the OXYSEN Fuse test points (on top of the fuse) to chassis ground and insure that there is full battery voltage at both test points. I would also recommend LOAD testing those fuse test points with a test light to see if there is adequate current flowing through that circuit to support heater operation. A standard automotive brake light bulb will do the job fine.
If the ignition switch electrical contacts are burnt/carboned up, it will limit current and voltage. Very common problem in the C5.
Bill
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 6,366
Likes: 249
From: Fort Lauderdale, Florida
I ordered a pair of Bosch 13111 O2 sensors. Since it is such a pain to get under my car, I've waited until it's time to change my oil. No change in the code situation, so I've got a few things to do at one time while under there. Tuner says once I change them he'll go over the tune and make sure everything is okay. I'm not having any problems with the car running but it stinks worse than it used to and mileage is down a bit. I'm hoping I can get this fixed. The car has run better so I'm hoping to find out what has changed.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,375
Likes: 328
From: CA.
St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15
That isn't all necessarily accurate. I'll start with O2's not heating up...maybe that was true with old narrow-band single wire units, but ours have heated elements in them so they are hot enough to work within just a few minutes. They will work fine with LT's without needing to tweak the tune.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,375
Likes: 328
From: CA.
St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15
Yes that may be true with a stock exhaust manifold if you are getting incorrect 02 voltage readings However with LT headers being that the front 02 bungs can be moved as much as 3' aft they will never ever read 100% accurately again---The stock narrowband front 02's are not designed to read correctly with LT headrs installations--Again that;s why they are illegal in most staes---as when the 02;s read wrong and don't heat up they will read erroneous 02 data and that is always make your engine run PIG RICH at P/T
Advanced
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 66
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From: QC AZ
Yes that may be true with a stock exhaust manifold if you are getting incorrect 02 voltage readings However with LT headers being that the front 02 bungs can be moved as much as 3' aft they will never ever read 100% accurately again---The stock narrowband front 02's are not designed to read correctly with LT headrs installations--Again that;s why they are illegal in most staes---as when the 02;s read wrong and don't heat up they will read erroneous 02 data and that is always make your engine run PIG RICH at P/T
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,375
Likes: 328
From: CA.
St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15
They are HEATED. There are smog legal headers that relocate the O2's so I don't know where you are getting the information about LT's being illegal. Yes, there are LT headers that are legal even in CA and they move the O2 sensors and the O2 sensors are fine because they are HEATED. They are not like the old single wire that relied on exhaust to heat them up. Research it.
LT headers are all ILLEGAL in Calif and smog states PERIOD
Stock exhaust manifollds and shorty headers retain the stock front 02 locations about 18" from the head--However due to the long tubes of LT's there is no way you could have the 02's 18" from the head ---Otherise the 02 bung would have to be placed in a single exh. tube That makes no sense----
Not only will the P/T fueling become rich so will the WOT become rich with LT's--You can try to correct the P/T fueling by lowewring the switching point as I mentioned BUT at WOT the use of a wideband and tuning will allow you to correct the WOT fueling via tuning
Advanced
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 66
Likes: 6
From: QC AZ
A;ll LS based engines 4.8 5.3 5.7 6.0 6.2 use heated 02 sensors
LT headers are all ILLEGAL in Calif and smog states PERIOD
Stock exhaust manifollds and shorty headers retain the stock front 02 locations about 18" from the head--However due to the long tubes of LT's there is no way you could have the 02's 18" from the head ---Otherise the 02 bung would have to be placed in a single exh. tube That makes no sense----
Not only will the P/T fueling become rich so will the WOT become rich with LT's--You can try to correct the P/T fueling by lowewring the switching point as I mentioned BUT at WOT the use of a wideband and tuning will allow you to correct the WOT fueling via tuning
LT headers are all ILLEGAL in Calif and smog states PERIOD
Stock exhaust manifollds and shorty headers retain the stock front 02 locations about 18" from the head--However due to the long tubes of LT's there is no way you could have the 02's 18" from the head ---Otherise the 02 bung would have to be placed in a single exh. tube That makes no sense----
Not only will the P/T fueling become rich so will the WOT become rich with LT's--You can try to correct the P/T fueling by lowewring the switching point as I mentioned BUT at WOT the use of a wideband and tuning will allow you to correct the WOT fueling via tuning
I know all I need to know about you based on this and a few other replies you have given to stuff. I truly hope no one listens to your drivel because you are way off base on some things. I guess it is just time to block you so I don't have to get aggravated listening to all the incorrect crap that you spew.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 770
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This is just my 2 cents...
It may be hard to believe but here in Cali they set up random smog checks where they funnel one coned off lane thru a mobile inspection station. CHP runs the inspection and they first do a visual.
So yeah, you don't want to get your car impounded. But this is Cali, and so there are people who take the risk.
But cars that came without smog are treated differently. Old vintage car smog rules are not the same here in Cali. They are exempt.
But here is my question-
I just changed my pre cat o2 sensors. I used an o2 sensor socket that has - I think a torque multiplier- won't that make the torque reading different?
How do I figure out how much torque I put on the sensor?
It may be hard to believe but here in Cali they set up random smog checks where they funnel one coned off lane thru a mobile inspection station. CHP runs the inspection and they first do a visual.
So yeah, you don't want to get your car impounded. But this is Cali, and so there are people who take the risk.
But cars that came without smog are treated differently. Old vintage car smog rules are not the same here in Cali. They are exempt.
But here is my question-
I just changed my pre cat o2 sensors. I used an o2 sensor socket that has - I think a torque multiplier- won't that make the torque reading different?
How do I figure out how much torque I put on the sensor?
Last edited by DRR; Oct 5, 2018 at 11:15 PM.