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Oil pan leaking again.

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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 05:13 AM
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Default Oil pan leaking again.

So I put new gaskets on my 2003 LS1. At first It was successful until.... Its the two piece butterfly style oil pan. The lower pan is fine however where the upper pan bolts to the engine block about half the bolts are weeping oil. I torqued at 18 foot pounds and the pan gasket is sealed. But there are drops forming on the M8 bolts. This was such a complete bear. Any ideas ? Thank you in advance.
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Wopalong
So I put new gaskets on my 2003 LS1. At first It was successful until.... Its the two piece butterfly style oil pan. The lower pan is fine however where the upper pan bolts to the engine block about half the bolts are weeping oil. I torqued at 18 foot pounds and the pan gasket is sealed. But there are drops forming on the M8 bolts. This was such a complete bear. Any ideas ? Thank you in advance.
did you use new bolts? They are torque to yield and should be replaced. Bolts are probably stretched.
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 01:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Wopalong
the pan gasket is sealed. But there are drops forming on the M8 bolts.
I'm not sure how you determined the pan gasket is sealed. If it was, there should be no oil getting to the bolts.
I'd clean the bolts and the holes and put some gasket sealer on them. If that doesn't work I think you need to re-do the pan gasket.
Have you looked for leaks elsewhere? Seems unlikely you would only see drops on pan bolts if it were coming from somewhere else though.
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Lawandorder
did you use new bolts? They are torque to yield and should be replaced. Bolts are probably stretched.
So you are saying in the service manual, the oil pan bolts have a base torque spec, followed by additional tightening to a certain number of degrees?
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 01:53 PM
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OEM pan bolts are not TTY. OP are you putting sealant on the front/rear cover corners?
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 02:41 PM
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Default Oil pan leak.

I did put the RTV on the corners. As I remember there is a the outer pan seal and then another ring gasket around each bolt all on an aluminum frame. 18 foot pounds is what I have for the torque setting. There was no instruction to do a graduated torque but I did do a rotational tightening. I'm gong to RTV each leaking bolt. I did apply a straight edge before Installing the upper pan though. The whole oil pan is dry...just bolts are leaking in my opinion.Thank you all for the input.
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 03:13 PM
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Originally Posted by lucky131969
So you are saying in the service manual, the oil pan bolts have a base torque spec, followed by additional tightening to a certain number of degrees?
im saying you shouldn’t reuse bolts. They are stretched out.
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by RapidC84B
OEM pan bolts are not TTY. OP are you putting sealant on the front/rear cover corners?
any seasoned tech would never reuse those bolts. They are old and stretched.
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 03:16 PM
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They're not stretch bolts and would only be stretched if someone over-torqued them into elasticity and then at that point they'd usually break because they're small. Bolts don't "wear out" if they're not torqued to elastic deformation, that's not how materials science works.
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by RapidC84B
They're not stretch bolts and would only be stretched if someone over-torqued them into elasticity and then at that point they'd usually break because they're small. Bolts don't "wear out" if they're not torqued to elastic deformation, that's not how materials science works.
oh so you recommend reusing the oem balancer bolt? 😂😂😂😂😂 clutch bolts, rotor bolts, suspension bolts, oil pan bolts, harmonic bolt, water pump bolts, etc SHOULD NEVER BE REUSED.

you do you, I prefer to not snap bolts or here, reuse old bolts, and cause oil leaks. 😂😂😂
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 04:29 PM
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When you order a lower oil pan from GM, they literally send you new bolts. 😂😂😂
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 04:30 PM
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Default Oil pan gasket...

So I just looked at a picture of the upper oil pan gasket. The bolt seals are on the outside of the pan gasket...so its gonna be a redo. This time I'm going to get the pan machined. Thank you all for the input.
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 04:33 PM
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I used genuine GM gaskets. No bolts were included. The lower pan gasket worked out fine.
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 04:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Wopalong
I did put the RTV on the corners. As I remember there is a the outer pan seal and then another ring gasket around each bolt all on an aluminum frame. 18 foot pounds is what I have for the torque setting. There was no instruction to do a graduated torque but I did do a rotational tightening. I'm gong to RTV each leaking bolt. I did apply a straight edge before Installing the upper pan though. The whole oil pan is dry...just bolts are leaking in my opinion.Thank you all for the input.
Double check that torque value. I show 106 lb in (for some- others are 18 lb ft) which is just under nine lb ft.
This is a screenshot from the downloadable manual that is stickied here and indicates it is for a 2004. My printed manual for a 2000 also says 106 lb in.
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 05:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Wopalong
I did put the RTV on the corners. As I remember there is a the outer pan seal and then another ring gasket around each bolt all on an aluminum frame. 18 foot pounds is what I have for the torque setting. There was no instruction to do a graduated torque but I did do a rotational tightening. I'm gong to RTV each leaking bolt. I did apply a straight edge before Installing the upper pan though. The whole oil pan is dry...just bolts are leaking in my opinion.Thank you all for the input.
Originally Posted by Wopalong
So I just looked at a picture of the upper oil pan gasket. The bolt seals are on the outside of the pan gasket...so its gonna be a redo. This time I'm going to get the pan machined. Thank you all for the input.
The "ring gasket" in those bolt holes of the aluminum gasket frame is there to hold the bolts in place during assembly. They're not for sealing purposes. With the exception of the corners where RTV is recommended, the seal is almost entirely on the inside of the frame. The bolt holes in the engine block are blind-ended, meaning the hole in the casting doesn't open into the crankcase. Therefor it should be all but impossible for one of the bolts to leak crankcase oil around the threaded interface.

If you're getting oil leaking from the bolts it's possible (and a lot more likely) it's coming from somewhere else and then "wicking" around the perimeter of the aluminum frame. My rear main seal started leaking like this and the entire rear half of the oil pan gasket frame was wet with oil that had seeped forward from the rear main.

Originally Posted by Dads2kconvertible
Double check that torque value. I show 106 lb in (for some- others are 18 lb ft) which is just under nine lb ft.
The bolts he's mentioning are the upper m8x1.25. The torque spec for these bolts is 18 lb/ft.

Originally Posted by Lawandorder
any seasoned tech would never reuse those bolts. They are old and stretched.
These bolts aren't torque-to-yield. The aluminum threads in the engine block would sooner strip out than deform the steel bolts. I rarely resort to juvenile name-calling, but in this case it's warranted - you're an idiot, and should go elsewhere so you can more effectively interact with people of similar intellectual capacity. I would recommend Tik-Tok as a starting point.

Last edited by spfautsch; Mar 27, 2024 at 05:44 PM.
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 05:50 PM
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Can you imagine if I tried 106 foot pounds....you are right. It could be rear main seal and front main seal.
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Wopalong
Can you imagine if I tried 106 foot pounds....you are right. It could be rear main seal and front main seal.
He posted 106 lb/in - I've interacted w/ him in the past and he's a good guy. But that's the torque spec for the m6x1.0 bolts (the two rear in the upper, and all the batwing bolts). I just finished doing this job <click myself. It's a "peach", but not as bad as pulling the driveline (3-4 times)!
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 06:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Wopalong
Can you imagine if I tried 106 foot pounds....you are right. It could be rear main seal and front main seal.
You would have noticed after the first bolt stripped all the threads out of the block.
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 06:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Lawandorder
oh so you recommend reusing the oem balancer bolt? 😂😂😂😂😂 clutch bolts, rotor bolts, suspension bolts, oil pan bolts, harmonic bolt, water pump bolts, etc SHOULD NEVER BE REUSED.
Any bolt that is not TTY can be reused, I have reused the oil pan bolt, water pump bolts, front cover bolts and suspension bolts... Read the FSM it has all the info you need
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Old Mar 27, 2024 | 06:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Lawandorder
When you order a lower oil pan from GM, they literally send you new bolts. 😂😂😂
There is NO note or warning in the service manual about reusing the oil pan bolts. Why, because they are not TTY, and do not stretch when torqued properly. The service manual will flat out tell you if a fastener is not reusable i.e. cylinder head bolts, harmonic balancer, etc. No such note exists in the oil pan procedure.
Ya know, tech stuff isn't for everyone.....and doubling-down only makes you look worse. Why not hang out in the General section where the water isn't so deep? Here's a link: https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums/c5-general-103/
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