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Break-in advice for new rotors

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Old Aug 19, 2003 | 03:09 PM
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Default Break-in advice for new rotors

Installing new Delco Durastop cross drilled, slotted rotors, new pads and SS brakelines today. Any advice on proper break-in procedures?

:steering:
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Old Aug 19, 2003 | 03:36 PM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (Kexec)

Disc 'Seasoning' This info is from AP-Racing http://www.apracing.com
All cast iron brake discs need to be bedded-in to ensure heat stabilisation and improve resistance to cracking. Cracks or even disc failure can occur during the first few heavy stops if careful bedding is not carried out. AP Racing recommend the following procedure :

If ducts are fitted they should be ¾ blanked off.
Use previously bedded pads.
For a minimum of 15 Km use brakes gently at first from initially low speeds - progressively raise speed to normal racing speed but still using gentle applications.
For the final 2 or 3 applications brakes can be used quite heavily.
If AP Racing thermal paints are used then only the Green paint (430°C) should have fully turned to white and maybe also just the Orange paint (560°C) on the outside edges of the discs during the bedding procedure.


Bedding Metallic or Carbon/Metallic Pads - (NEVER DRAG the brakes) This info is from Brembo http://www.brembo.com

Note: Never “Bed” pads on rotors which have not first been “Seasoned.” Always allow a substantial coast down zone when bedding pads that will allow you to safely drive the car to a stop in the event of fade.
Perform four repeated light to medium stops, from 65 to 10 mph, to bring the rotors to temperature.
Perform two heavy stops, back to back, at a point just pending wheel lock, from 65 mph to about 5 mph.
Drive for five to ten minutes to create cooling airflow, without using the brakes if at all possible.
Perform three light stops in succession.
Perform eight heavy stops, back to back, at a point just pending wheel lock, from 65 mph to about 5 mph.
Drive for ten minutes to create cooling airflow, without using the brakes if at all possible.
Metallic brake pads need high temperatures to keep the pad “Bedded”. If you drive the car for a period of time without using the brakes extensively, you may need to “Bed” the pads again. This is not a problem. Simply repeat the procedure.


:cheers:
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Old Aug 19, 2003 | 03:38 PM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (Kexec)

I followed Baer's seasoning procedure for my Eradispeed rotors and it worked perfectly. They strongly suggest seasoning new rotors with used pads and vice versa. I seasoned my rotors with the original GM pads and then left them in place since they were practically new. What follows is Baer's seasoning and bedding procedures.

Rotor Seasoning for Street or Light Track Applications

The first step in preparing the brake system for duty is to “SEASON” the rotors. The most visible effects are that of burning the machine oils from the surface of the iron and establishing a wear pattern between the pad and rotor. The most complex task it performs is that of relieving the internal stresses within the material. If you’ve ever poured water into a glass of ice, and noticed the ice cracking, then you’ve witnessed, first hand, the effects of internal stresses. The rotor casting and cooling processes leave the rotor with internal stresses.

By gradually heating the material, the crystalline matrix will reconfigure to relieve these internal stresses. After these stresses are relieved, the rotor is ready to accept the heat of bedding pads. Heating the rotors before they are fully seasoned can result in material deformation due to the unrelieved internal stresses in the material. This deformation may cause a vibration from the brakes. In order to prevent this vibration, all PRO-RACE+ rotors are trued before shipping.

Rotors need to be gradually elevated to “race” temperatures before any severe use. A “nibble”, or slight vibration, normally indicates rotors that were heated too quickly. After initial “Seasoning”, when running your car at open track events or serious canyon carving, you should use the first lap of a session (or first couple miles of open road), to warm the brakes as well as the engine, gearbox, etc. Where an engine turns chemical energy into motion, the brakes turn that motion into thermal energy....and lots of it! And where there is no cooling system for the brakes as there is for the engine, and there’s not, the brakes could use the courtesy of a warm-up lap.

Remember to ALWAYS WARM THE BRAKES before any heavy use!

Seasoning Procedure:

1) Before you begin, please note: The following represents the minimum recommended “Seasoning” process. If your situation offers any opportunity to perform gentle preliminary “Seasoning” outlined in Step 2 below for a longer period of time, this will generally render even better performance and increase further long term rotor life.
2) Use the vehicle for 5 to 6 days of gentle driving. Use the brakes to the same extent that you used the stock brakes, DO NOT TEST PERFORMANCE or ATTEMPT HEAVY USE UNTIL ALL ITEMS OUTLINED HAVE BEEN COMPLETED. It is imperative that excessive heat is not put into the rotors at this stage. They need temperature-cycling to relieve the internal stresses.
Note: Zinc plated rotors (which are an extra cost option) need a couple of extra days of driving to wear through the plating before “Seasoning” actually will begin.
3) Find a safe location where the brakes can be run to temperature.
Your goal is to gradually increase brake temperatures with progressively faster stops. Start by performing four 60 to 70 mph stops, as you would in the normal course of driving.
Next, perform four medium effort partial stops (about 50 %) from 60 mph down to 15 mph. Follow this with five minutes of freeway driving with LITTLE to NO BRAKING to allow the rotors to cool.
Then, perform four medium-hard effort partial stops (about 75 %) from 60 mph down to 15 mph. Follow this with ten minutes of freeway driving with LITTLE to NO BRAKING to allow the rotors to cool.
Park the car and allow the brakes to cool overnight to ambient temperature. You are now 50 % done with the rotor “Seasoning/Bedding” procedure, proceed to STEP 4 the following day.
4) Return to the safe location where the brakes can be run to temperature.
Make sure the brakes are warmed to full operating temperature and then, perform four medium effort partial stops (about 50 %) from 60 mph down to 15 mph. Follow this with five minutes of freeway driving with LITTLE to NO BRAKING to allow the rotors to cool.
Then, perform four medium-hard effort partial stops (about 75 %) from 60 mph down to 15 mph. Follow this with ten minutes of freeway driving with LITTLE to NO BRAKING to allow the rotors to cool.
NOW, make six HARD partial stops from 60+ mph down to 15 mph or until rotors have reached an operation temperature of between 900 and 1,100° (Note: Temperature paints to accurately measure rotor temperature may be purchased from Baer Racing). Every effort should be made to perform this procedure without locking a wheel. Follow this with ten minutes of freeway driving with LITTLE to NO BRAKING to allow the rotors to cool.
5) Let the system cool off over night. The rotors are then ready for the next step in Preparing your Brake System: Bedding Pads.



Pad Bedding for Street or Light Track Applications

Bedding brake pads has a couple of important effects. The friction material in semi-metallic pads is held together by an organic binder, usually a type of phenolic material. As the pads get hot, the binder boils, and burns, from the top surface of the pad. Once this burning or “Bedding” takes place the friction material makes proper contact with the rotor.

Some race/performance pads, like the Performance Friction’s line of pads, are designated as “pre-burnished” from the manufacturer. In our experience these pads still benefit from“bedding”. “Bedding” pads establishes a wear pattern between the pads and rotor. Some pads, like the Performance Friction pads, deposit a layer of carbon in the surface of the rotor. They need that layer of carbon to perform at peak efficiency.

Most Baer Claw™ systems which are equipped with PBR calipers, SS/DRAG, SPORT, TRACK, and TRACK+, come standard with metallic pads. However, PBR based A-SEDAN systems, as well as PRO-RACE and PRO-RACE+ Systems with the Alcon calipers feature carbon metallic pads from either Pagid, Performance Friction or Tekstar.

Bedding Metallic or Carbon/Metallic Pads - (NEVER DRAG the brakes)


1) Note: Never “Bed” pads on rotors which have not first been “Seasoned.” Always allow a substantial coast down zone when bedding pads that will allow you to safely drive the car to a stop in the event of fade.
2) Perform four repeated light to medium stops, from 65 to 10 mph, to bring the rotors to temperature.
3) Perform two heavy stops, back to back, at a point just pending wheel lock, from 65 mph to about 5 mph.
4) Drive for five to ten minutes to create cooling airflow, without using the brakes if at all possible.
5) Perform three light stops in succession.
6) Perform eight heavy stops, back to back, at a point just pending wheel lock, from 65 mph to about 5 mph.
7) Drive for ten minutes to create cooling airflow, without using the brakes if at all possible.

Metallic brake pads need high temperatures to keep the pad “Bedded”. If you drive the car for a period of time without using the brakes extensively, you may need to “Bed” the pads again. This is not a problem. Simply repeat the procedure.

When switching from Performance Friction Carbon Metallic pads to semi-metallic brake pads (something we do not recommend), you will need to wear through the layer of carbon that the PFC pads have deposited in the rotor surface. The new pads won’t grip well at all, until this layer of carbon is removed.

Racers should “Bed” a few sets of pads at a time. In the event you need to change brake pads during a race, you MUST use a set of “Bedded” pads. Racing on “non-bedded” pads leads to a type of “fade” caused by the binding agents coming out of the pad too quickly. This is called “green fade”. These binders may create a liquid (actually a gas) layer between your pads and rotors. Liquids have a very poor coefficient of friction. This condition is the reason for reverse slotting or crossdrilling rotors, as it allows a pathway for the gasses to escape.

:cheers:
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Old Aug 19, 2003 | 04:48 PM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (Patches)

I just bought some new stock rotors (old ones were warped), and some raybestos QS pads. Should I not put them all on at the same time? :confused:
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Old Aug 19, 2003 | 05:24 PM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (Patches)

Patches,

I followed this procedure on seasoning the iRotors that I had bought recently. I used the stock pads since I have only 18K miles in it and waited a week for the zinc to be wiped off the surface that makes contact with the pad.

My question is why dont we season rotors or bed pads when the car is new? :confused:
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Old Aug 19, 2003 | 07:46 PM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (c5chris)

GM service manual says to perform 20 firm stops from 30 mph to "burnish" new pads to rotors (or vice versa).

Do not stop hard enough to lock the brakes, just a good firm smooth stop. You should drive several minutes between stops to allow the brakes to cool.

I just installed a set of ceramic pads. They squeaked at first, but around stop number 10, they silenced and I ain't heard a peep out of them since.

I'm really *liking* these ceramic pads now too. It's only been a couple of weeks now and the dusting has already settled down to nearly none. My wheels stay clean a long time now. :party:
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Old Aug 19, 2003 | 08:59 PM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (Kexec)

I guess I have to ask - Why can't the manufacturers pre-season the rotors? Metals are tempered to relieve stresses all the time - why not rotors?
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Old Aug 19, 2003 | 09:08 PM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (Kexec)

Picked up my car this evening, brakes are pulsing when I come to a stop. I wouldn't think they should do this with new rotors,ceramic pads and lines. Almost the same feeling as having a warped rotor (I hope not :eek: ).

Should I just drive a while and see if it settles down or is this wishful thinking?

:steering:
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Old Aug 19, 2003 | 11:31 PM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (Kexec)

First thing: Get you a torque wrench and re-torque the wheel lugs to 100ft-lbs. Get a clicky type torque wrench and a 19mm (or 3/4") deep socket from Sears or the AutoZone or similar. Keep them in the car.

Is the pedal pulsing? That would mean excessive runout on the rotor or a loose rotor. New rotors can be bad right out of the box.

If the brakes are grabbing, ie, stopping unevenly, that might settle in a few stops.

You could have a bent rim or a bad tire too. They can both cause the same symptoms.


Picked up my car this evening, brakes are pulsing when I come to a stop. I wouldn't think they should do this with new rotors,ceramic pads and lines. Almost the same feeling as having a warped rotor (I hope not :eek: ).

Should I just drive a while and see if it settles down or is this wishful thinking?

:steering:
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Old Aug 20, 2003 | 08:21 AM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (larrysb)

Thanks for the thoughts.

I had no bake problems before the changeover. They worked fine. The tires and wheels have fewer than 1000 miles so I would rule that out.

I just drove home 6 miles from the shop, but will drive some more tonight and determinie if it is pulsing or grabbing or both.

Do shops typically bleed the ABS system when changing the brake lines? could this contribute to the problem?


:steering:
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Old Aug 20, 2003 | 08:56 AM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (c5chris)

My question is why dont we season rotors or bed pads when the car is new? :confused:
I've wondered this myself. The procedures I posted above are from the expensive aftermarket manufacturers. It's what they require for optimum life and performance. You can forego these procedures as we all pretty much do in a new car and the pads and rotors will wear in for everyday driving.

Another thing - my rotors turned a bluish tint after performing the seasoning procedure. This bluish tint is desireable as it indicates the rotors have reach the proper temperature. The tint wears off after the rotors cool overnight and you drive the car again.

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Old Aug 20, 2003 | 08:57 AM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (Kexec)

Try-- http://www.baer.com
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Old Aug 20, 2003 | 12:58 PM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (c5chris)

My question is why dont we season rotors or bed pads when the car is new? :confused:
Becasue we are supposed to slowly break the car in before running it at maximun performance levels. By the time the car is ready for maximum performance, the pads and rotors have been seasoned--unless, you just get on the hiway and drive 500 miles without any braking whatsoever.
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Old Aug 20, 2003 | 07:36 PM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (Kexec)

I have to say that the two best disc brake "break ins" I've ever done were to get in the car, make about 10 light stops in traffic and go for an 8 hour 600 mile freeway cruise immediately thereafter.

1st time; 97 Altima, pulsing pedal and shimmy when applying brakes while moving to California. Stopped in Flagstaff, dealer turned rotors, scuffed pads and I went from dealer ship to freeway. Never had problems with that car ever again. Altima's are pretty common with the "warp rotor" syndrome.

2nd time: Bought 02 vert new in Louisiana. Got on freeway and went west for 3 days and 2400 miles.

At 8500 miles, I swapped to the ceramic pads to keep the wheels clean. No squeaks or pulses.

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Old Aug 20, 2003 | 11:12 PM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (Kexec)

Kexec,
You need to make sure the rotors are seated properly on the hubs. On a car that hasn't had a lot of brake maintenance (several times a year during racing season) there can be quite a bit of rust build up around the hub. The 03 Z with 18K miles that I just bought had a lot. I had to sand paper the hubs to get it off and to allow the rotors to go back on properly. If the rotors are not seated properly you get a rotor run out problem and some bad pulsing. Take off the wheels and check for corrosion and then put the wheels back on. Put the lug nuts on and tighten them while while holding the wheel tight against the rotor and hub. I have found this method gets rid of any brake pulsing that occurs after I do a brake job on any of my cars.
Bill
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Old Aug 20, 2003 | 11:34 PM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (Patches)

I have the Baer Eradispeeds and followed the **** multi-day schedule, Brakes are perfect now a few thousand miles later and I drive the car hard.
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Old Aug 21, 2003 | 08:07 AM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (Bill Dearborn)

Bill,

Thanks for your advice, I'll give it a try. I have only driven the car 14 miles since the brake job was done. Last night they seemd a bit calmer. What I have noticed is that all four rotors show amber colored residue (not rust) that is somewhat sticky. Do you have an idea what this could be and could it be contributing to the way the car is pulsing?

:steering:
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Old Aug 21, 2003 | 08:31 AM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (Kexec)

I have new PFC Z pads and Eradi Rotors, is it possible to use the standart Baer-breakin-procedure for Rotors and then the one for the pads even when the pads are new? Or will this do any harm?

Toby
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Old Aug 22, 2003 | 09:43 AM
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Default Re: Break-in advice for new rotors (Kexec)

What happens if I install my rotors and pads at the same time?
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