Nitrogen in the Tires
02-03-2007, 08:51 AM
#1
Melting Slicks
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Nitrogen in the Tires
Forgot to mention that when I took delivery of my Vette at Boardwalk Chevrolet yesterday I had a surprise. Seems the owner likes the use of nitrogen, so puts it in all the tires of the Vettes they sell. Then puts a green tipped stem cap on each wheel as a reminder.
I use it for my car that I drag race beside Nitrogen does not expanded and contract they air does when the weather changes and the tires heat up from runs. Just maintains a more consistant tire pressure which is critical when drag racing but never really considered it in the tires of a vette, but makes sense.
Nice to see an owner go the extra mile and expense because they believe in something.
I use it for my car that I drag race beside Nitrogen does not expanded and contract they air does when the weather changes and the tires heat up from runs. Just maintains a more consistant tire pressure which is critical when drag racing but never really considered it in the tires of a vette, but makes sense.
Nice to see an owner go the extra mile and expense because they believe in something.
02-03-2007, 09:09 AM
#2
Melting Slicks
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http://www.bargaineering.com/article...s-mileage.html
http://digg.com/design/Put_Nitrogen_...Instead_Of_Air
Roberts says his company is the only one in the Midlands that currently offers nitrogen tire fillings. They charge about $5 per tire for the service.
SCAM!!!!!!!
:HEY! Let's talk about all the bogosity, magic thinking, nuttiness and just plain BS about nitrogen on this thread all over again! I especially like:
* Might explode
* Better fuel milage
*20% less change in pressure over temp (pv=nrt?)
* "Thicker compound" (WTF?)
* More environmentally friendly
Straight poop from GM:
http://www.gmfleet.com/image/pdf/Tec...itrogenGas.pdf
Last edited by TrackNoob; 02-03-2007 at 09:22 AM.
02-03-2007, 09:28 AM
#4
Melting Slicks
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Yeah, I decided 100% nitrogen was much too 'thick', and I had such good fuel mileage I ended up having to stop every few miles to drain the extra accumulated gasoline from the tank, so what I did, was I played around with different mixtures to optimize it.
I ended up with about 78% Nitrogen, 21% oxygen. I then added in about 0.9% argon so that the tires would glow as they spin (but only visible from the inside of the tire, to stay stealthy to the cops - clever, eh?!) and finally, about 0.1% CO2 to help with the whole carbon-credits thing. I am thinking about selling a bit more capacity in future to to power plants, if they want me to carry more carbon for them.
Just tryin' to do my part!
02-03-2007, 10:56 AM
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St. Jude Donor '08-'09
Yeah, I decided 100% nitrogen was much too 'thick', and I had such good fuel mileage I ended up having to stop every few miles to drain the extra accumulated gasoline from the tank, so what I did, was I played around with different mixtures to optimize it.
I ended up with about 78% Nitrogen, 21% oxygen. I then added in about 0.9% argon so that the tires would glow as they spin (but only visible from the inside of the tire, to stay stealthy to the cops - clever, eh?!) and finally, about 0.1% CO2 to help with the whole carbon-credits thing. I am thinking about selling a bit more capacity in future to to power plants, if they want me to carry more carbon for them.
Just tryin' to do my part!
very witty retort!
02-03-2007, 12:14 PM
#6
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St. Jude Donor '06
Yeah, I decided 100% nitrogen was much too 'thick', and I had such good fuel mileage I ended up having to stop every few miles to drain the extra accumulated gasoline from the tank, so what I did, was I played around with different mixtures to optimize it.
I ended up with about 78% Nitrogen, 21% oxygen. I then added in about 0.9% argon so that the tires would glow as they spin (but only visible from the inside of the tire, to stay stealthy to the cops - clever, eh?!) and finally, about 0.1% CO2 to help with the whole carbon-credits thing. I am thinking about selling a bit more capacity in future to to power plants, if they want me to carry more carbon for them.
Just tryin' to do my part!
02-03-2007, 05:51 PM
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Yeah, I decided 100% nitrogen was much too 'thick', and I had such good fuel mileage I ended up having to stop every few miles to drain the extra accumulated gasoline from the tank, so what I did, was I played around with different mixtures to optimize it.
I ended up with about 78% Nitrogen, 21% oxygen. I then added in about 0.9% argon so that the tires would glow as they spin (but only visible from the inside of the tire, to stay stealthy to the cops - clever, eh?!) and finally, about 0.1% CO2 to help with the whole carbon-credits thing. I am thinking about selling a bit more capacity in future to to power plants, if they want me to carry more carbon for them.
Just tryin' to do my part!
Bottled water.
Bagged dirt.
Compressed air.
WHY DIDN'T I COME UP WITH THESE THINGS???????
02-03-2007, 06:27 PM
#8
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Quoted from www.eng-tips.com because it says what I wanted to say without me having to think about it and type it. Long story short . . . there is a benefit in race cars, but if you are paying $5.00 per tire for 5% nitrogen, you are getting ripped off.
QUOTE:
"Nitrogen in tires has a couple benefits:
The biggest reason to use compressed nitrogen *in a racing tire* is that it's dry, compared to typical compressed air.
When a tire heats up, the air and any moisture inside it heats up as well. When the moisture inside the tire heats up, the water molecules move further apart, increasing the tire pressure. By removing this moisture, the pressure stays more consistent over the entire heat cycle of the tire.
On a racecar, a 1/4 psi difference can change the handling of a car significantly. The humidity inside a tire does not have to be zero, but if it is not at least kept consistent from one set of tires to another, to equal a 1/4 psi increase in the current set, a 1 psi change may need to be made in another set because of the differing humidities.
Is nitrogen completely necessary? No. Air can be dried using inline air dryers and such. However, it's much easier to keep tire humidity consistent when all the tires can be filled from the same 1500 psi bottle of nitrogen delivered to the shop.
As far as race tires go, this is the reason to use nitrogen. Because of the short life of a race tire, how much air permiates out of a tire over a year is of no concern.
For a street car, I can see little benefit in using nitrogen. But then again, I check my pressures just about every week, and I'm not worried about whether my pressures increase 1 or 3 psi during my daily commute. For someone who "sets and forgets" it may help. As far as corrosion resistence, rusting will only occur when the oxygen in the air can reach bare metal. Unless for some reason your wheels didn't come painted or the surface was damaged before the tire was put on, the side of the wheel open to the ambient air will corrode much, much faster."
-spdracer
QUOTE:
"Nitrogen in tires has a couple benefits:
The biggest reason to use compressed nitrogen *in a racing tire* is that it's dry, compared to typical compressed air.
When a tire heats up, the air and any moisture inside it heats up as well. When the moisture inside the tire heats up, the water molecules move further apart, increasing the tire pressure. By removing this moisture, the pressure stays more consistent over the entire heat cycle of the tire.
On a racecar, a 1/4 psi difference can change the handling of a car significantly. The humidity inside a tire does not have to be zero, but if it is not at least kept consistent from one set of tires to another, to equal a 1/4 psi increase in the current set, a 1 psi change may need to be made in another set because of the differing humidities.
Is nitrogen completely necessary? No. Air can be dried using inline air dryers and such. However, it's much easier to keep tire humidity consistent when all the tires can be filled from the same 1500 psi bottle of nitrogen delivered to the shop.
As far as race tires go, this is the reason to use nitrogen. Because of the short life of a race tire, how much air permiates out of a tire over a year is of no concern.
For a street car, I can see little benefit in using nitrogen. But then again, I check my pressures just about every week, and I'm not worried about whether my pressures increase 1 or 3 psi during my daily commute. For someone who "sets and forgets" it may help. As far as corrosion resistence, rusting will only occur when the oxygen in the air can reach bare metal. Unless for some reason your wheels didn't come painted or the surface was damaged before the tire was put on, the side of the wheel open to the ambient air will corrode much, much faster."
-spdracer
02-03-2007, 10:56 PM
#9
Race Director
I have a nitrogen cylinder for servicing my airplane's struts (hundreds of pounds PSI) and tires (because it is handier than hauling a compressor around.
Just for giggles, deflated two tires on my C5 and purged them with nitrogen twice and filled them to recommended pressure.
The other two were filled up with regular old air from one of those cigarette lighter powered tire compressors.
Since the DIC shows the tire pressure, and I borrowed the infra-red grill thermometer from my wife's cooking gadgetry drawer (she won't miss it, but no telling), I can accurately guage the effect of temperature and pressure.
The results, I must say are astounding. All four tires are completely indistiguishable from each other. Temperature and pressure relate exactly the same and in reality, no one would be able to determine which two tires had the nitrogen and which two had low quality air from the Walmart special tire filler, short of using some kind of lab test equipment to determine the relative concentration of air and nitrogen.
Just for giggles, deflated two tires on my C5 and purged them with nitrogen twice and filled them to recommended pressure.
The other two were filled up with regular old air from one of those cigarette lighter powered tire compressors.
Since the DIC shows the tire pressure, and I borrowed the infra-red grill thermometer from my wife's cooking gadgetry drawer (she won't miss it, but no telling), I can accurately guage the effect of temperature and pressure.
The results, I must say are astounding. All four tires are completely indistiguishable from each other. Temperature and pressure relate exactly the same and in reality, no one would be able to determine which two tires had the nitrogen and which two had low quality air from the Walmart special tire filler, short of using some kind of lab test equipment to determine the relative concentration of air and nitrogen.
02-03-2007, 11:48 PM
#11
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If it's free and convenience to use....I'd do it. Otherwise, I wouldn't bother with nitrogen in my tires. IMO there aren't enough true practical benefits for the 'average' driver to warrant paying for it....it's more of a 'gimmick' than anything.
02-03-2007, 11:50 PM
#12
I have a nitrogen cylinder for servicing my airplane's struts (hundreds of pounds PSI) and tires (because it is handier than hauling a compressor around.
Just for giggles, deflated two tires on my C5 and purged them with nitrogen twice and filled them to recommended pressure.
The other two were filled up with regular old air from one of those cigarette lighter powered tire compressors.
Since the DIC shows the tire pressure, and I borrowed the infra-red grill thermometer from my wife's cooking gadgetry drawer (she won't miss it, but no telling), I can accurately guage the effect of temperature and pressure.
The results, I must say are astounding. All four tires are completely indistiguishable from each other. Temperature and pressure relate exactly the same and in reality, no one would be able to determine which two tires had the nitrogen and which two had low quality air from the Walmart special tire filler, short of using some kind of lab test equipment to determine the relative concentration of air and nitrogen.
Just for giggles, deflated two tires on my C5 and purged them with nitrogen twice and filled them to recommended pressure.
The other two were filled up with regular old air from one of those cigarette lighter powered tire compressors.
Since the DIC shows the tire pressure, and I borrowed the infra-red grill thermometer from my wife's cooking gadgetry drawer (she won't miss it, but no telling), I can accurately guage the effect of temperature and pressure.
The results, I must say are astounding. All four tires are completely indistiguishable from each other. Temperature and pressure relate exactly the same and in reality, no one would be able to determine which two tires had the nitrogen and which two had low quality air from the Walmart special tire filler, short of using some kind of lab test equipment to determine the relative concentration of air and nitrogen.
I'd caution everyone to keep in mind the basic test of truthfulness in testimonial advertising. If the huckster's lips are moving, he is lying.
02-03-2007, 11:54 PM
#13
Team Owner
I'd be curious to see how much nitrogen is going to cost you over a year's time. I've been using air and it's only cost me $0.50 one time about 5 years ago when the only station open on Sunday in a small town charged for air.
02-04-2007, 12:00 AM
#14
Moderator
If they want to fill my tires with Nitrogen for FREE, then I have no problem with it.
If they want to charge me for it, then it is pure.
Absolutely no value for normal street driven cars.
If they want to charge me for it, then it is pure
.Absolutely no value for normal street driven cars.
02-04-2007, 12:01 AM
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Forgot to mention that when I took delivery of my Vette at Boardwalk Chevrolet yesterday I had a surprise. Seems the owner likes the use of nitrogen, so puts it in all the tires of the Vettes they sell. Then puts a green tipped stem cap on each wheel as a reminder.
I use it for my car that I drag race beside Nitrogen does not expanded and contract they air does when the weather changes and the tires heat up from runs. Just maintains a more consistant tire pressure which is critical when drag racing but never really considered it in the tires of a vette, but makes sense.
Nice to see an owner go the extra mile and expense because they believe in something.
I use it for my car that I drag race beside Nitrogen does not expanded and contract they air does when the weather changes and the tires heat up from runs. Just maintains a more consistant tire pressure which is critical when drag racing but never really considered it in the tires of a vette, but makes sense.
Nice to see an owner go the extra mile and expense because they believe in something.
02-04-2007, 12:18 AM
#16
Melting Slicks
PV=nRT is still the law, no matter what gas is used. For those who don't understand basic physics, your empirical testing should be a convincing demonstration of the validity of the fundamental gas laws.
I'd caution everyone to keep in mind the basic test of truthfulness in testimonial advertising. If the huckster's lips are moving, he is lying.
I'd caution everyone to keep in mind the basic test of truthfulness in testimonial advertising. If the huckster's lips are moving, he is lying.
02-04-2007, 12:18 AM
#17
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Forgot to mention that when I took delivery of my Vette at Boardwalk Chevrolet yesterday I had a surprise. Seems the owner likes the use of nitrogen, so puts it in all the tires of the Vettes they sell. Then puts a green tipped stem cap on each wheel as a reminder.
I use it for my car that I drag race beside Nitrogen does not expanded and contract they air does when the weather changes and the tires heat up from runs. Just maintains a more consistant tire pressure which is critical when drag racing but never really considered it in the tires of a vette, but makes sense.
Nice to see an owner go the extra mile and expense because they believe in something.
I use it for my car that I drag race beside Nitrogen does not expanded and contract they air does when the weather changes and the tires heat up from runs. Just maintains a more consistant tire pressure which is critical when drag racing but never really considered it in the tires of a vette, but makes sense.
Nice to see an owner go the extra mile and expense because they believe in something.
I see what your saying-nice to see a dealer doing something extra even if the benifits are questionable-at least it doesn't hurt anything.
02-04-2007, 12:31 AM
#18
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I don't see what the problem is. Even if nitrogen is only .0000001% better on a street car, he got it for nothing, it's not hurting anyone, so why not take it and enjoy? He never said he'd only fill it with nitrogen from now on. Even if he did, it's his car and he can do what he wants.Seems he got a lot of crap for no reason from some of you. Let the man enjoy his freebie gas!
02-04-2007, 12:33 AM
#19
Team Owner
I see this one being locked again...
02-04-2007, 12:37 AM
#20
Le Mans Master
