I think you just hit the nail on the head. I think we have a stripper on our hands! It would be the perfect time to introduce one due to GM's finances. Buyer's finances as well!

A stripper would be cheaper for GM to produce, and cheaper for the customer as well. An important niche is filled (enthusiasts) and creates, and costs GM nothing because of the retooling needed for a refresh, anyway. It's pretty much a no-brainer for them...

Now, for what I'd look for:

There is a ton of tech out there to make the C6 "quicker" without messing with HP. R&D is already done: it's called the Z06. I'd look (aka hope) for the C6.5 to inherit the aluminum frame, beefier suspension, brakes, etc. Tooling, manufacturing is already there... and this redesign is virtually no cost to GM (redesigning interior pieces and clusters is much cheaper than the drive train, or it would seem to me). A new engine (with direct injection) would be cake, but I'm not holding my breath. The LS3 is still pretty new.

I'd also expect to see some trickle down ZR1 stuff in the Z06, but again, to save design $$ and actually listen to the customer, see a car that is designed with a specific purpose: to get the **** beaten out of it. They did a decent job with the current Z06, but I'd expect to see something that is a little more "race ready". I wouldn't be shocked if we see some C6.R stuff.

Between the C6, Z06, C6.R, and ZR1, there are already many modular parts to make 2 "new" models!

 

I agree with your points except the last. Your 0-60 vicotry is by no means assured and you would also likely lose by a few car lengths in the 1/4 mile. No sweat for me though, I got a 11.79 LS2 car

 

Amen

You must be butter cause you're on a roll.

Only way to buy it if you are buying a new Vette.

Assuming you got a good deal when you bought in August, yep.

Perzactly.

Now see, ....thats what I'm talking about. ...Say that again so the folks in here can hear it and understand it. Louder and with feeling this time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverC6AZ

NO ONE should be buying a Corvette at the end of ANY model year run unless they can negotiate about a $5000+ additional discount over and above what most people were buying the car for when that model year first hit the market. So, if you were looking at buying a 2007 in April 2007, you needed to get $5000 UNDER invoice or better. That is almost impossible. Thus the reason to NEVER buy a Corvette at the end of the model year!!!!!!!

Yes they are, but I had to mix a little bull$#*+ in with the facts to keep the folks around here reading carefully. You caught it.

The LS3 and the LS2 are going to depreciate about the same.

Indeed. But your whole life can't be based on "depreciation". There is a lot to be said for having if not the "latest and the greatest" then at least having one which is "current" and at least close to the next year's model.

At least part of the reason why I have enjoyed my Z06 so much and for as long as I have is because there has not been a "drastic" change in the car from 2006 to 2009. Certainly not nearly as drastic a change as the base C6 saw from 2007 to 2008.

I have seen GM make two more Z06s since I bought mine and mine is still right there with those two.


Well, nobody races to 60 mph do they.

For 2010, GM may very well up the power of the C6, offer a wide body option for non Z06 cars, offer a Grand Sport, the whole gamut. But as long as they don't drastically change the C6 Z06, I'm happy. Indeed, I hope,..... no I hope like hell that they kill off the Z06 for 2010. And there is a good chance they might

 

You challenged me to look for the data:
The car magazines all quote different times for stock vehicle tests, since we know there are variables with every test.

On average, an LS2 Z51 Coupe is .2 -.3 seconds quicker than a LS2 No Z51 Convertibe in the 1/4 mi. The average is about 12.6s vs
12.9s.

Using the same theory, an LS3 Z51 Coupe should be .2 - .3 seconds quicker than a LS3 No Z51 Convertible.

The average LS3 Z51 Coupe 1/4 mi time is 12.5 seconds. So, using the same theory, the LS3 No Z51 Convertible would be 12.8 seconds. Still
.2 seconds behind a LS2 Z51 Coupe.

These figures all vary and one could argue .1 seconds here or there, but when comparing the fastest possible LS2 configuration to the slowest possible LS3 configuration, the LS2 still seems to have the slight edge.

Aerodynamics and gear ratios and everything else the Z51 offers seem to compensate for the 30 less HP, which makes sense.

 

Here are the things we know...Torch Red's return, the Grand Sport in Coupe and Convertible, rumor of a new blue, electronic parking brake, wide body option on Coupe and Convertible, possibility of F55 option on Z06, Comp Gray wheel for ZR1, no new dash but some electronic upgrades, Michelin tires.

Greg Sanders
EVS Chevrolet

 

but i'm getting older and older...

 

Interesting info.

F55 on a Z06 with Michelin tires would definitely be an interesting combo/upgrade.

 

Well, I concede to you as you were rather clever picking your choice of opponent and options. Herein are the official GM times for future potential challenge arrangments.

Here are THE Official GM times:

LS2

0-60 mph:
A6 auto 4.5 sec, manual 4.2 sec

1/4 mile:
A6 auto 12.9 @110 all cars incl Z51
manual non Z51 12.6@113 manual Z51 12.5@114

Top Speed: 186 mph

LS3

0-60 mph:
A6 auto 4.3 sec, manual 4.1 sec

1/4 mile:
A6 auto No official GM time for the LS3 A6. My guess is 12.8 to 12.7
manual all cars incl Z51, 12.4@117

Top Speed: 190 mph

 

Thank You! Keep it up!

 

So the widebody is definitely happening for 2010???

 

Here is the original post on the web: http://iowahawk.typepad.com/iowahawk/2008/11/lemon.html There is even a reply from the author about the vehicles shown in the picture. Here is his reply:

UPDATE: Many questions of the "what the hell is that car?" variety. It is the Citicar, an early 70s electric produced in the USA. A while back I spotted a couple at a local swap meet. Here's the kicker: just got an email from the great internet comic artist Chris Muir of "Day by Day" fame (hat tip Mike Hendrix), informing me that his dad was its designer(!):

"It was waaaay back in 72'. The specs said it had to fit sideways on a truckbed,hence its length. Batteries were primitive back then, as well as drives,etc.It was an aluminum roll cage @ ABS skin and did indeed meet crash specs. Slow as hell,but was street legal,I drove it to high school."

 

Here is another post claiming that 1) Z06 sales are slumping (probably are) and 2) that the LS3 will get a common dry sump system (probably to save money across engines).

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-c...morning-2.html

What we know already:
1) A Grand sport package will hit the streets - it seems to be purely cosmetic (sadly).
2) GT1 appearance package for 2009.

What are rumored:
1) Change back to Torch Red
2) New blue or additional blue
3) Widebody for LS3 models as an option
4) F55 for the Z06
5) Change to Michelin tires from Goodyear
6) New dash (although I have heard some say no new dash but new electronics...)

What I think are unlikely:
1) Major HP increases. The LS7 could maybe get another 15 HP with tweaks but I think GM has little room to play with without going DI. The LS3 is still too new as is the LS9.
2) DI. Given GMs financial situation, this is probably too costly at the moment. I'd love to be wrong here.

What I think GM needs to do:
1) Stop making color changes and appearance packages (e.g. custom colors with decals) the selling points of some model year changes.
2) Refresh the interior further. Do away with the 4LT packages and spend a few hundred per car on better materials (vinyls, leather, plastics).
3) Discontinue the current NAV system and utilize the NAV system from the new caddys. That would cost very little and would be a huge upgrade.
4) I'm torn on the idea of a widebody LS3. It does diminish the differences between the models but since the LS3's comprise 75% of the total build per year, their sales must be strong for the corvette to survive...
5) Targa Z06 option. Yep, I'm in the minority. Make it an option to keep everyone happy.
6) Bring the ZR1 suspension F55 system to all cars including the Z06 as an option. My understanding is that this system is much better than what is found in the current base corvette electronic suspension.
7) Stripper Z06 option. Offer a sub 3000 lb Scuderia like option for the Z06. No Radio, no A/C, minimal carpet, perhaps lighter seats with side airbag delete, etc. Keep the HUD however...

 

I'd also like to see some better interior materials, including the option of cloth seats. I'm neutral about optional paints and stripes and such. For those who like that sort of thing, it should be an option. But for those of us who don't like such things, a pure clean look should remain available.

I'm curious whether the Caddy NAV would integrate with the HUD. If it won't, then it is a non-starter.

With respect to the so-called "widebody", if wider wheels needing fender flares become standard, then this becomes necessary. But if normal tires continue to be used, I'd much rather have a 0.29 Cd than a 0.34 Cd. Less drag means better MPG and better top speed too.

I'd rather see a fixed roof option for the coupe than a targa option for the Z06. But it isn't a matter of great import either way. I'm not likely to buy a Z06, and since the last top recall, I've been able to keep the top on my coupe without extra brackets and bolts.

What I'd really like to see is unbundling of options. That would allow someone to order a stripper if they like, or a totally loaded car, or anything in between. With current JIT manufacturing methods and computer order scheduling, this can be done without any production cost penalties. It does make the dealer's life a bit more complicated, but earning our business is why we agree to let a dealer make thousands of dollars for just the cost of a postage stamp to mail in our order to the factory.

 

We need new seats a nicer steering wheel and better radios.