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LOL....And no name calling intent there....just a term. And I think there may be some confusion here on your part. I am not suggesting that weight savings is the only advantage to headers. I am quite familiar with the other advantages also. But part of the advantage of headers has always been less weight and you seem to suggest that weight savings is not that important. Weight savings has been one of the most important factors in making ones car go faster since the beginning of....well, trying to go faster....LOL. So whether it be stripping out the interior, or drilling large holes in the frame, weight savings should always be a factor, including the weight savings that headers give......

 

WindyC6, Just for you I went back and weighed them both.





So the difference is 2.6 lbs all together or better yet a difference of a power to weigh ratio of 6.202 to a car with headers of 6.197.
Not much gain there and to be honest with the price of headers for that, just go eat something really greasy and you will lose more wight than that and gain a better power to weigh ratio. So going back to my original statement the logic behind headers is the fact that they create a vacuum in the cylinder. So that when the intake valve opens there is already a vacuum present so that you get 100% fill of fresh air and fuel and will there for make more power in that one stroke then a car with a manifold present and still have wasted fuel air in the cylinder. So with our new setup the avg gain of a set of headers with nothing else is about 25 hp. So with that our new ratio would be 5.904 hp but the great thing about a clean cylinder is now with a new calibration we maybe able to increase timing and gain 35+Hp with the headers which would lead to a new ratio of 5.74. So the benefit of the header scavenging the cylinder far outweighs any gain from weight savings. I know the internet may say other wise, but here is the math and science behind it. Now if you wanted to shave some weight and go with our rotors that would save 40lbs on a ZO6 and your new ratio with those with headers could be 5.66 when compared to 6.202 earlier. For those that are not understanding what these numbers (ratio) are, they are how much how many pounds is being pushed by 1 HP. So when we are all bench racing a new GT40, they have a power to weight of 4.72. This is not the only thing that would decide if a car is faster vs another, but it is the start of how you could determine, but there are other factors as well. Like a Chevy Volt with a LS7 in it will be faster than a New ZO6 in a straight line but not at VIR.

 

Good job. And I must admit that I would have thought of a slightly bigger diff then that. Knew it wouldn't be as much as back in the day though cause the manufactures are cutting weight anyway they can. And at my age I wish eating some good greasy food would make me lose some weight that easy !!!!.........

 

Good, now that we're past that, let's get back on track to what we are talking about and that is air box's. You have to understand how it works. The only think that makes power in an engine is the cylinder pressure created by the explosion of fuel air mixture. Now HP and Torque are directly related to this. So if you have a cylinder that is not getting 100% clean air/fuel mixture the cylinder pressure will be down and therefore your torque on the crankshaft will be down, or actually where is was rated at the factory. What aftermarket air boxes are doing are two things. Once they are trying to overpressure the air in the intake manifold so that when the intake valve opens you have a pressure of air available to help fill the cylinder more efficiently and on the other side to lower the intake air temp, the actual intake air temp so that it has less tendency to detonate and remove timing. If you can get more air into that cylinder and not induce timing retard you are going to make more power period. This is the science behind it and really any aftermarket part, it all comes down to the air mixture in the cylinder. A supercharger or turbo does the exact same thing it over pressures the intake air so when the valve opens if forces more air and fuel into the cylinder which means more pressure and more power created from it. Nitrous is the same, it freezes the air and makes is extremely dense so that the air molecules become tighter packed and they will hold more fuel, more air and fuel into the cylinder=more power. So your bolt on items that are designed to create a better cylinder efficiency actually work if they are doing what they are supposed to be doing.
In the Mamba we created several things, one we are getting fresh air and not stale air in the engine compartment that has already been heated. We are also taking in a larger area of air then the factory and transitioning it down into the Tb and increasing the air velocity of it which goes back to creating more pressure in the intake manifold. This is the simplicity of how it works, there is more to it but all the little small things add into one thing, the box make more power then the stock box. There has been data posted on it and there has been gobs of dyno charts, but I hate to say this and I don't want it to sound negative, but you all are really late to the party on this. This was all done and discussed and tested 11 years ago. I may still have some of it but I am on my 7th computer or so since then and I don't have a lot of the original data from back then. I am sure though if you are diligent enough that you will find all of it using Google and you will not be disappointed in the Mamba.
Thank You
Justin

 

LOL....great write up....and you must be tired after that. It's appreciated and while there isn't quite as much difference in the weight of the stock manifold and a set of headers for a C-6, I am in no need of a lesson on how the internal combustion engine works. And for the record, let us not forget that the weight difference between headers and stock manifolds have been overall significant since the invention of headers, with some applications having more difference than others of course. Weight savings is still a very significant part of going fast which you have yet to acknowledge. Now as far as a CAI goes, I have no problem realizing the advantage of getting more air....denser and cooler air (they usually go together) into the chamber. But most people seem to agree, myself included, (whether you do or not) that CAI's are not really worth the $$$ for your average person just doing most of their driving around town at probably less that 40 - 50 MPH in most cases. Highway excluded of course. The extra HP and torque (HP is theoretical don't forget) is just not worth the $$$. Now of course if I ever find myself in a position where I know i will be driving in a high performance fashion on a regular basis, the a CAI may be in my future. So if you want to consider all of us behind the times because we don't fall prey to wanting to fork out $$$ for something that doesn't really help that much under normal driving conditions then so-be-it.....

 

Jeezus, you guys are arguing apples and kumquats.
Just me, but auto companies design "air boxes" with several criteria. Three of which being efficiency (ie fuel economy), weight (ie fuel economy), and (in)destructiblity (warranty).
Again, just me, but in an otherwise stock engine (or a mildly modded engine, for that matter) there will be negligible difference in adding an aftermarket "air box" DURING NORMAL-TO-SPIRITED DRIVING.
And to smack the bee hive one more time...it's cool to say ya got one. Just like the folks that put a couple hundred miles per year on their (check one) Corvette, Harley, etc.

 

Sit down drink a beer and relax. Windy I wasn't saying all of that to you, I said to everyone else on what a CAI really does and how it makes power. I didn't want to have to go that far into it but you kinda lead me there and I didn't want someone looking at this thread and going away from it more confused then what they were to begin with.
Second I did absolutely 1000% acknowledge the weight issue and even stated is all comes down to power to weight ratio, I can't make it simpler than that. Yes for someone who drives their car around in traffic and town doesn't need any performance gain that a CAI could offer, I explained that earlier and gave the analogy of the motocross bikes.
Ruxvette you are correct, GM designs their for different reasons than the aftermarket and for someone who doesn't every see 100% throttle it really comes down to opening the hood at a car show and being different.

 

Proof given, proof denied.