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Watching some youtube C6 crash vids several show rear tires spinning at the launch or tires spinning after shifting into 2nd gear then the car makes a sudden 180 degree turn into the ditch or worse.
When there is a loss of traction, tires smoking the car should not make a right angle turn. Does the differential let go?
What dyou think about that?
Has your C6 ever made a hard turn without you wanting it to?
I suppose it could be lots of things. Could be a money shift causing the rpms to spike and unsettle the car. Could be bad throttle control. RWD moderate to high horsepower cars don't really respond well to mashing the pedal into the floor.
2020 Corvette of the Year Finalist (track prepared)
2019 C6 of Year Winner (track prepared)
Originally Posted by SlothX311
RWD moderate to high horsepower cars don't really respond well to mashing the pedal into the floor.
Sure they do:
It's been my experience that there are two primary causes for an avoidable crash - stupid drivers and incorrect tire choice for the car.
You'd be surprised at how many so-called "experienced" drivers I've seen who think they can handle a car properly when it starts to lose traction and attempt to drive through it, which more often than not leads to somebody crashing. Simple rule that has served me very well over the years - if it starts to get loose just lift as there's always another pass to be made. The only minor exception is that if I spin a bit right when the car launches I'll stay in it for maybe a second or two as the Hoosier drag radials I run do a very good job of rehooking. When I used to run MT drag radials however, if I spun off the line I just lifted as that pass was almost certainly done.
Incorrect tire choice is another common problem because it seems way too many people think they can just slap a blower on a car and then wonder "gee, why aren't my old street tires not hooking properly with my 700rwhp?". With the right tires there's no reason a car can't go down the track straight like mine's done literally thousands of times.
I didn't mention spills or mechanical breakage above because I was referring to avoidable crashes. If something breaks going down the track or you hit a patch of oil or spring a leak, no amount of experience in the world (or having the best tire setup) is going to keep you from going into a wall if that's what the car decides it wants to do.
* not sure if i should take this thread seriously ... *
when you break traction because you applied too much torque to the rear wheels any and all rear wheel drive cars will start sliding and the back of the car will try to pass the front of the car.
once the driver chose to turn off the traction control / stability control, etc, (i suspect all or most of those videos you reference) it is now the responsibility of the driver to modulate throttle input and steering angle to maintain the car moving forward and not towards a ditch.
Did i experience this, yes, many times on autocross because i was overoptimistic on how much torque the rear tires can take. To make this perfectly clear every time it was operator error, and over time i learned better (and got some training).
high power, relatively low mass sports car, means the car will rotate faster than the driver expects, but mostly it's overconfidence of the driver / lack of skill.
over-correction followed by sudden regaining of grip = snap oversteer
^^ This is my experience.
Often times, the sudden regaining of traction is caused when the driver lifts.
Something like this: You shift hard and the rear breaks traction. It begins to come out from behind you. If it gets too far and you lift, it will violently regain grip and come snapping back the other direction too hard and fast to make the necessary steering correction.
You are better off only slightly backing off the throttle and using the steering wheel to bring the tail back behind you before letting off the throttle more if necessary.
It can go against your natural intuition.
Knowing I'm not a professional racecar driver I have come to just leave the nannies turned on. I attend open track days at Road America, and even then I leave the nannies on. I believe it's better to leave them on than to potentially need to explain to my wife how my totaled car may be the result of me being a fool.
A lot of those "drivers" disengage the traction/stability control in an effort to spin the tires and lay down some rubber/smoke. If you are not used to the power/torque or have never done that before the result can be ...well...embarrassing.
Last edited by lobstah24; Feb 28, 2020 at 07:33 PM.
As I said earlier in this thread......too much car, and not enough driver. A good driver can handle this. An inexperienced driver will put the car into the wall, curb, or whatever other obstacle is around.
A lot of those "drivers" disengage the traction/stability control in an effort to spin the tires and lay down some rubber/smoke. If you are not used to the power/torque or have never done that before the result can be ...well...embarrassing.
Sure they do:
It's been my experience that there are two primary causes for an avoidable crash - stupid drivers and incorrect tire choice for the car.
On low pressure drag radials? Yeah I'm sure you hook. I'm talking about on the street. Throttle input is key. If you're spinning the tires and you're trying to "go fast" you're doing it wrong.
As the others have said, it's ovsrcorrection. People tend to shake the wheel violently from side to side trying to "drive through it". What they're really doing is adding momentum to the rear end swinging, like when you push a child on a swing. Eventually they get traction, and head in whatever direction the car was pointed at that moment, usually not the way they wanted.
Sawing the wheel doesn't increase control folks, regardless of how the movies make it look.
When my kids turned 16 I sent them both through a high performance driving school for this very reason. I had been through a HPD school in the 70's and taught at one for a time in the 80's and believe they are a great value.
The HPD school easily pays for itself if you avoid one accident in your lifetime. Not to mention it makes you a much better and safer driver.
The drivers education and driving experience required to get a driver's license in the US is a joke.
It's been my experience that there are two primary causes for an avoidable crash - stupid drivers and incorrect tire choice for the car.
You'd be surprised at how many so-called "experienced" drivers I've seen who think they can handle a car properly when it starts to lose traction and attempt to drive through it, which more often than not leads to somebody crashing. Simple rule that has served me very well over the years - if it starts to get loose just lift as there's always another pass to be made. The only minor exception is that if I spin a bit right when the car launches I'll stay in it for maybe a second or two as the Hoosier drag radials I run do a very good job of rehooking. When I used to run MT drag radials however, if I spun off the line I just lifted as that pass was almost certainly done.
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this is 100% the problem I see in the crash vids , they lose control, yet still keep their foot in the gas and try to drive/steer their way out of it , almost never works
If the car gets squirrely the first thing we should do is let off the gas completely and focus on steering/braking
even better is to just try to drive with care and control and not let yourself get into that situation . if your a racer then its different, your whole goal is to push the limits of the car, but these cars and coffee guys shouldn't even bother
Originally Posted by mellojoe
over-correction followed by sudden regaining of grip = snap oversteer
yep, they let it get too far away from them and try a hail mary to bring it back
It's been my experience that there are two primary causes for an avoidable crash - stupid drivers and incorrect tire choice for the car.
looks like that was run at sac raceway. looks like a pretty good too!
You'd be surprised at how many so-called "experienced" drivers I've seen who think they can handle a car properly when it starts to lose traction and attempt to drive through it, which more often than not leads to somebody crashing. Simple rule that has served me very well over the years - if it starts to get loose just lift as there's always another pass to be made. The only minor exception is that if I spin a bit right when the car launches I'll stay in it for maybe a second or two as the Hoosier drag radials I run do a very good job of rehooking. When I used to run MT drag radials however, if I spun off the line I just lifted as that pass was almost certainly done.
Incorrect tire choice is another common problem because it seems way too many people think they can just slap a blower on a car and then wonder "gee, why aren't my old street tires not hooking properly with my 700rwhp?". With the right tires there's no reason a car can't go down the track straight like mine's done literally thousands of times.
I didn't mention spills or mechanical breakage above because I was referring to avoidable crashes. If something breaks going down the track or you hit a patch of oil or spring a leak, no amount of experience in the world (or having the best tire setup) is going to keep you from going into a wall if that's what the car decides it wants to do.
looks like this run at sac raceway. nice looking run!
When my kids turned 16 I sent them both through a high performance driving school for this very reason. I had been through a HPD school in the 70's and taught at one for a time in the 80's and believe they are a great value.
The HPD school easily pays for itself if you avoid one accident in your lifetime. Not to mention it makes you a much better and safer driver.
The drivers education and driving experience required to get a driver's license in the US is a joke.
i would have loved to have had been exposed to any HPD course. as it was, my buddy and i, during our high school formative years, did our own version of HPD school. not to say that we're now expert drivers but, it at least it exposes you to what happens when operating at the extremes. we did our share of starsky & hutch maneuvers over those years ( and somehow survived unscathed ). i agree with all who put the blame on the driver. the biggest I've picked over the years ( when encountering a skid situation ) is to gradually let off on the accelerator. too quick and you get immediate traction the opposite direction. then starts the fishtailing. when that happens, unless you have ample run-off, usually results in contact with whatever is nearest to you.
C6 crash vids
