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Old Oct 10, 2021 | 09:13 PM
  #21  
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Not a fan of throttle controllers, since they make the car think that you are pressing the pedal down farther than you really are. Hence depending the device and it settings, can actual make the Car think that you have the pedal pressed all the way down, when the pedal is only halfway down isntead.

So does not change the TB opening and closing timing rates of the Vane, does not change the stall rate timing of the system to get better gas mileage, and in events where you need as much Throttle pedal push range to control the back end, all you have done is just shortened it to turn the pedal into a on/off button instead.

So best solution, is to re-map the throttle mapping to de-soccer mom what GM did to it.
Here, you can change the opening and closing timing/speed rates to make the TB more responsive with the pedal, the amount that the TB will open with percentage of pedal push percentage, decrease the fixed stall time of the TB per changes in pedal position, and the big one, not decrease the usage over all range of the pedal usable distance to better control the back end as well.
Note, on the base model, the more nannies you turn off, the less sensitive the pedal to TB becomes, as well in increase in fixed stall time of the vain per pedal percentage changes as well. The Z06 is a little better on less fixed stall rates, but still desensitizes the pedal to TB as you turn off more Nannies. So when throttle re-mapping, you need to go through all the Nannie mods (all on, Comp mode, All off mode) to make them the same for all the mods.

Last edited by Dano523; Oct 10, 2021 at 09:17 PM.
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Old Oct 10, 2021 | 11:16 PM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by Dano523
Not a fan of throttle controllers, since they make the car think that you are pressing the pedal down farther than you really are.
Except for the fact the GM screwed up the throttle programing to begin with.... in stock mode pressing the C6 throttle 50% only opens the TB 30%. Pressing the throttle 70% only opens the TB 50%....

So to get a true 50/50 split which makes the car feel like an old school cable operated carburetor/TB/fuel injectorion requires a throttle controller. At least if you're on a budget of any type.

I have no clue about other brand throttle controllers, but to get a 50/50 split with a Vitesse requires a setting of SP4.

That's not a bad bargain for $100 and 15 minutes of your time. Not to mention it makes the car more fun to drive.

My only bitch is most guys dial in far to much advance and just flip flop GM's mistake the other way to where 50% throttle opens the TB to 70%.

YMMV
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Old Oct 11, 2021 | 01:45 PM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by Iceaxe
Except for the fact the GM screwed up the throttle programing to begin with.... in stock mode pressing the C6 throttle 50% only opens the TB 30%. Pressing the throttle 70% only opens the TB 50%....

So to get a true 50/50 split which makes the car feel like an old school cable operated carburetor/TB/fuel injectorion requires a throttle controller. At least if you're on a budget of any type.

I have no clue about other brand throttle controllers, but to get a 50/50 split with a Vitesse requires a setting of SP4.

That's not a bad bargain for $100 and 15 minutes of your time. Not to mention it makes the car more fun to drive.

My only bitch is most guys dial in far to much advance and just flip flop GM's mistake the other way to where 50% throttle opens the TB to 70%.

YMMV

TB openning rate to pedal percentage is even smaller than the numbers you posted.
At close to 70% pedal, your not even close to 50% open on the vain, and its the last 20% of pedal downward push where TB to throttle pedal become closer to linear instead. So yes, throttle devices can help this by making the car think that you are pushing the pedal down farther. But as stated, by doing this, you are really just losing the bottom side of the pedal range for precision over all, and losing the initial ramp up push of the pedal where you need to feather the power to keep the back end sticking.

Now what the devices do not do, is change the rate of which the Vain opens (its clocking rate of how fast it will change potions), nor will it change the vain stall in position that GM programmed into the system to get better gas mileage (when you come off the pedal, and the RPMs hang for a second before they drop down on a base car without touching the clutch), nor the over all decrease action rate of system response as you are tuning off nannies as well. Hence the whole soccer mom changes that GM did to the throttle mapping to make is safer for novices to drive the car so it was trying to kill them less.

Simply put, if you are trying to make the throttle respond as quick as if it did have a cable driven carb on the car, then that take throttle re-mapping to detune out the soccer mom de-tune that GM put in the throttle instead.
Hence running joke, race team had a go with the car to tune it correctly on its track testing days, then gave the car back to the pencil pushers, whose first thing was to de tune all of that instant response right back out again.
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Old Oct 11, 2021 | 10:34 PM
  #24  
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Age 74..... 2011 GS . Pedal Commander running wide open. Hidden under dash and controlled by android phone.
love it and would never go back. And never be put off by my age, spirited driving and 3 digit numbers quiet often;
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Old Oct 12, 2021 | 09:01 AM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by Dano523
TB openning rate to pedal percentage is even smaller than the numbers you posted.
At close to 70% pedal, your not even close to 50% open on the vain, and its the last 20% of pedal downward push where TB to throttle pedal become closer to linear instead. So yes, throttle devices can help this by making the car think that you are pushing the pedal down farther. But as stated, by doing this, you are really just losing the bottom side of the pedal range for precision over all, and losing the initial ramp up push of the pedal where you need to feather the power to keep the back end sticking.

Now what the devices do not do, is change the rate of which the Vain opens (its clocking rate of how fast it will change potions), nor will it change the vain stall in position that GM programmed into the system to get better gas mileage (when you come off the pedal, and the RPMs hang for a second before they drop down on a base car without touching the clutch), nor the over all decrease action rate of system response as you are tuning off nannies as well. Hence the whole soccer mom changes that GM did to the throttle mapping to make is safer for novices to drive the car so it was trying to kill them less.

Simply put, if you are trying to make the throttle respond as quick as if it did have a cable driven carb on the car, then that take throttle re-mapping to detune out the soccer mom de-tune that GM put in the throttle instead.
Hence running joke, race team had a go with the car to tune it correctly on its track testing days, then gave the car back to the pencil pushers, whose first thing was to de tune all of that instant response right back out again.
I have seen way too many cautions on HP Tuners forum about bricking the ecm to mess with the throttle timing tables. I am perfectly satisfied with the way my car responds with the Vitesse on SP4 or SP5 and with almost all torque management removed.
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Old Oct 12, 2021 | 03:18 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by BadAV
I have seen way too many cautions on HP Tuners forum about bricking the ecm to mess with the throttle timing tables. I am perfectly satisfied with the way my car responds with the Vitesse on SP4 or SP5 and with almost all torque management removed.
Hate to say it, but HP tuner is still not showing all the needed tables to do a throttle remapping, so either have to add in pid's to get them in HP Tuner, or just use EFI live that has had all the tables from day one instead.

As for bricking a ECM with either re throttle mapping (when you do have all the needed tables in HP tuner to use it), yes very easy to do, but the same can be said of just a bad tune on a motor to blow it up as well.

Hell, when talking tunes on car with major HP mods, even getting the TM set correctly can be a challenge if the traction conditions are every changing.

So to sum it up, the throttle controllers are not more than just tricking the system in to thinking that you are just pressing the pedal down farther, and that is something that you can do yourself. To make the throttle more responsive/sharper itself, then you need to remap to pull that one off.
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